Honda to quit F1 after 2021

Milkybk said:
No RBR didn’t. They invested money into development required to improve the engine for Renault, including hiring Mario Illien. That was their involvement. Everyone wanted a way out of the relationship in the end, the rebranding was just the end of it.

Also my original post was quite arsey, just re-read it. I should drink coffee after a long morning before posting :p.
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Christian Horner throughout out the beginning of that season was saying they were using the expertise within their team to make it better. The hate for Renault was clear and didn't want to give them much credit. There were many suggestions that they may have soon after branched the development completely to come up with their own engine.

The agreement as you say was that Red Bull were far more involved in the technical development and they wanted to make that clear.
 
Nasher said:
I hope they go back to simpler, V8 engines. Might have to now otherwise they are going to run out of manufacturers. No one likes these engines anyway :D
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The manufacturers like them, you go back to v8, then bye bye manufacturers.

The rule change to simplify has already made honda quit.
 
It would be an F1 lovers dream to see Merc, Honda, Renault, Ferrari engines all broadly similar in performance so we can see some decent races. When you see great drivers like Ocon, Perez, Saintz, Vettel lapped like today its depressing for the sport, we don't want a parade of technology, we want racing.
 
chrcoluk said:
The manufacturers like them, you go back to v8, then bye bye manufacturers.

The rule change to simplify has already made honda quit.
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That just means the budgets will have to get lowered and we'll see more indipendent teams again. Like back when F1 was good.
 
turbot1984 said:
It would be an F1 lovers dream to see Merc, Honda, Renault, Ferrari engines all broadly similar in performance so we can see some decent races. When you see great drivers like Ocon, Perez, Saintz, Vettel lapped like today its depressing for the sport, we don't want a parade of technology, we want racing.
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It’s the way it’s always been. Could it be more exciting, yes. Can I see things changing, no, success breeds success. Is this F1, yes. The frustrating thing in modern F1 is that we can see the technological advances, unlike the days when we had 6 wheelers, fan cars etc.
 
CaptainRAVE said:
It’s the way it’s always been. Could it be more exciting, yes. Can I see things changing, no, success breeds success. Is this F1, yes. The frustrating thing in modern F1 is that we can see the technological advances, unlike the days when we had 6 wheelers, fan cars etc.
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Ok, but when Mercedes are only kept off the podium by technical problems or by exceptional driving by Verstappen and others its poor viewing. What's worse its bloody predictable, and it has been for years. Bottas out because his engine bricked, oh my god!
 
Welcome to the early 2000s where Schumacher won and no one else got a look in ;)
 
turbot1984 said:
Ok, but when Mercedes are only kept off the podium by technical problems or by exceptional driving by Verstappen and others its poor viewing. What's worse its bloody predictable, and it has been for years. Bottas out because his engine bricked, oh my god!
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This is what happens when you make rules that reduce variability, and also ban innovations which means only the rich teams can afford to innovate, as its not worth a poor team innovating when its banned the next year.

Example of rules that reduce variability.

Ban on refueling
Changing from race fuel in Q3.
Blue flags
Ban on engine modes
 
chrcoluk said:
This is what happens when you make rules that reduce variability, and also ban innovations which means only the rich teams can afford to innovate, as its not worth a poor team innovating when its banned the next year.

Example of rules that reduce variability.

Ban on refueling
Changing from race fuel in Q3.
Blue flags
Ban on engine modes
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All rules that were supposed to bring the teams and cars closer together. I honestly don;t get why people want refuelling back. With it there were very few on track passes. Like single digits every race, admittedly without DRS though.
 
EVH said:
Welcome to the early 2000s where Schumacher won and no one else got a look in ;)
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I looked into this because I'm bored and my perception has been that it's worst now than ever.

2000-2004 Ferrari won 67% of all races, 57 out of 85 races (lost 28)

2014-2019 Mercedes won 73% of all races, 89 out of 121 races (lost 32)

Turns out I was right!

If I'm wrong blame wiki :p
 
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EVH said:
Welcome to the early 2000s where Schumacher won and no one else got a look in ;)
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or when McLaren won all but one race in a season. Or red bulls 4 seasons of dominance. Or brawn and the blown diffuser. It’s always been like this, just this period is a bit longer than expected. If not for Covid we’d be getting the new cars next year.
 
CaptainRAVE said:
or when McLaren won all but one race in a season. Or red bulls 4 seasons of dominance. Or brawn and the blown diffuser. It’s always been like this, just this period is a bit longer than expected. If not for Covid we’d be getting the new cars next year.
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Red Bull won four seasons in a row it’s true, but not all of them were a complete cakewalk like this is for Mercedes.
 
MissChief said:
All rules that were supposed to bring the teams and cars closer together. I honestly don;t get why people want refuelling back. With it there were very few on track passes. Like single digits every race, admittedly without DRS though.
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The idea that it would improve things, was wholly misinformed.

Refuelling adds risk, and risk shakes things up, removing it was never going to bring teams closer together.
 
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