How the cost of living has changed from late 70's

[danlightbulb]

I’m feeling a level of bitterness from others in my cohort. How about taking some responsibility?

How can people take responsibility for stuff they don't/can't control?

All we can do as individuals is try to work hard, get a decent job, don't waste money.

That does not get you an equivalent house to what a semi skilled worker could get in the 70s. It does not get you an equivalent pension either.

Yeah we have lots of other things these days. Convenience appliances, nice kitchens, more reliable cars, computers and phones, nice variety of exotic (compared to the 70s) food, tonnes of hobbies to enrich our lives.

But housing is a mess in this country and has been since the 90s.

 

[CapitalOne]

How can people take responsibility for stuff they don't/can't control?

All we can do as individuals is try to work hard, get a decent job, don't waste money.

That does not get you an equivalent house to what a semi skilled worker could get in the 70s. It does not get you an equivalent pension either.

Yeah we have lots of other things these days. Convenience appliances, nice kitchens, more reliable cars, computers and phones, nice variety of exotic (compared to the 70s) food, tonnes of hobbies to enrich our lives.

But housing is a mess in this country and has been since the 90s.

What I meant was that there are some people in my generation who are blaming things for their problems in this thread. If they were indeed problems we all faced them. I'm thinking specifically those saying "immigration did for me".

 

[danlightbulb]

What I meant was that there are some people in my generation who are blaming things for their problems in this thread. If they were indeed problems we all faced them. I'm thinking specifically those saying "immigration did for me".

How old are you?

Im 43 and I think a reliance on cheap immigrant labour has been bad for this country overall. It's enabled growth but all that money has gone to the rich or in shareholder value. It's probably helped suppress wages of normal working people by increasing the supply of workers.

Not good for a country to be reliant on foreign labour to fulfil basic functions I think.

 

[adam cool dude]

Housing is a mess but a lot of other stuff is a lot cheaper than it used to be. For example electronic goods. I can remember my mother got me an Nintendo 64 for my birthday after I winged about it for months. She got it from Debenhams on the drip. £300 for the bare console and memory card which is £547 in today's market. I got Top Gear Rally as my first game which was £69.99 or £125 in todays money. Roll on today and I simply have the cash available to buy an Series X on whim because I found stock in a Smyths 2 years ago. My first PC was a Tiny unit in 1999. £1100 all in. I had to add a Radeon 7500 from OcUK on top as it had onboard GFX so call it £1300. That is £2300 in todays money for what would have been a mid range PC.

My father wasn't either poor he was retired in his 50's with a final pension from the army and ICL/Fujitsu computers. Yet we only had 1 television in the living room for the vast majority (He would rent a new one every year from Hughes) and a small 15" in the kitchen where I would play the majority of my computer games till later when I got my own TV in my bedroom.

Roll on today and we have a television in every room bar the bathroom. My 3 year old son has a 55" Samsung in his bedroom!

If it wasn't for the mess with housing we would be a lot better off than boomers as we would have a lot more cash to put away for pensions etc but that is just the way it is. Equality of pay from the top to the bottom is the problem not the boomers so you can thank Thatcher and the 80's for that.

How old are you?

Im 43 and I think a reliance on cheap immigrant labour has been bad for this country overall. It's enabled growth but all that money has gone to the rich or in shareholder value. It's probably helped suppress wages of normal working people by increasing the supply of workers.

Not good for a country to be reliant on foreign labour to fulfil basic functions I think.

This is very true. I worked in management in the food production industry from 2008 till 2022. My annual earnings in 2008 on the shop floor were around 26k or 40K in todays market whereas someone doing a similar job today would be lucky to make 30K. Company's annual profits were around the 80 million mark. They benefitted massively from cheap foreign labour. At the beginning you had a waiting list of staff wanting to be trained up to a higher grade to say run machinery and if they didn't make the cut you just managed them out of the business. Go forward to the end of my tenure and I am managing 50+ people, short of at least 20 staff a day, agencies unable to supply workers and getting to the point where whole production lines are having to be stopped and the company is being fined by its customers for shorting orders. I spent half my day phoning up people just to try and get overtime in to cover the shortfall. They have alienated themselves from an English workforce as a result and are unable to recruit. They have increased the wages massively recently but was too little too late. They have shut down two sites this year alone. With around 6 shutting down in the past 3 years. I thought I had a cushy job for life (13 weeks sick pay, tax benefits, healthcare, decent pension contributions etc) but the job just become untenable because of what they expected me to do by the end where I would most likely end up with heart problems at 50 from the stress. Looking back it was absolutely crazy how quickly something can change in just a 15 year period.

 

[BUDFORCE]

My parents paid less for their rural 3 bed semi in 1985 than I would put down as a minimal 10% deposit for it in 2023. I bought a house in 2006 and sold it in 2021 for pretty much what I originally paid. My parents house after 15 years was worth 5 times more, and is worth ~16 times more in 2023.

As a 37 year old looking to buy again, I'm well priced out of the area I grew up in (and love) and will possibly have a mortgage well into my 60s if I manage to outlive all the other men in my family. My parents had theirs paid off and could afford for one of them to be unemployed for over a decade, put money into renovation etc.

It feels like I'm always on the back foot financially. Despite now having a decent career and no debt, I do worry I'll be priced out of the lifestyle I want for my family. My parents worked hard and had their own money worries, they started with sod all (no carpets till I was 4), but opportunity to rectify it seemed easy and swift. My mum is comfortably retired at 55 with no mortgage and minimal bills but that's almost impossible for me who is earning more than she did at my age.

Yup your circumstances are very similar to mine, I'm just a couple of years older.

My folks were also poor, in my baby photos all my baby clothes had holes in as they were all hand me downs, I intentionally said that I didn't want to go on school trips as a kid, not that I didn't want to go but knewvmy parents would have to sacrifice and stretch to pay for them, and I didn't want thst. I grew up in a flat in North London.

But typical of that generation, they both had government jobs (NHS and HMRC) which they had for life, and are now both retired on decent pensions, no mortgage and a house worth at least half a million.

Hard work yes, but it paid off.

The problem is now, the hard work is still there, but not the pay off.

 

[CapitalOne]

How old are you?

Im 43 and I think a reliance on cheap immigrant labour has been bad for this country overall. It's enabled growth but all that money has gone to the rich or in shareholder value. It's probably helped suppress wages of normal working people by increasing the supply of workers.

Not good for a country to be reliant on foreign labour to fulfil basic functions I think.

I'm 48

 

[mid_gen]

Housing is a mess but a lot of other stuff is a lot cheaper than it used to be. For example electronic goods. I can remember my mother got me an Nintendo 64 for my birthday after I winged about it for months. She got it from Debenhams on the drip. £300 for the bare console and memory card which is £547 in today's market. I got Top Gear Rally as my first game which was £69.99 or £125 in todays money. Roll on today and I simply have the cash available to buy an Series X on whim because I found stock in a Smyths 2 years ago. My first PC was a Tiny unit in 1999. £1100 all in. I had to add a Radeon 7500 from OcUK on top as it had onboard GFX so call it £1300. That is £2300 in todays money for what would have been a mid range PC.

1) I'm not sure what your mother scrimping and saving for an N64 vs you impulse buying an Series X says about anything more than your stupid spending habits.

Costs of games is really down to the size of the gaming market, economies of scale, and the physical cost of the cartridge manufacturing back then.

2) Have you looked at PC parts recently? A complete mid-range gaming PC, from scratch, is going to be around that £2.3k mark today.

 

[potatolord]

I am just turned 50, so bang in the middle of the groups.

One of the big differences I notice from being a kid is the availability of luxury foods. By luxury, I mean being able to have fresh strawberries/ tomatoes in February and the like. I still find it a minor miracle that I can buy blueberries, at all.

I grew up in a fairly working class family- it was tripe for tea at least once a week, and in winter it would be heavy on root vegetables (swedes etc). As an adult, my diet is completely different.

The other big difference is waste. My dad saved everything, old screws, bits of wood etc, as he grew up in poverty and during rationing. I just chuck it out.

I guess my point is it is swings and roundabouts.

The older generation got cheaper housing etc, but general quality of life was way different.

 

[413x]

Housing is a mess but a lot of other stuff is a lot cheaper than it used to be. For example electronic goods. I can remember my mother got me an Nintendo 64 for my birthday after I winged about it for months. She got it from Debenhams on the drip. £300 for the bare console and memory card which is £547 in today's market. I got Top Gear Rally as my first game which was £69.99 or £125 in todays money. Roll on today and I simply have the cash available to buy an Series X on whim because I found stock in a Smyths 2 years ago. My first PC was a Tiny unit in 1999. £1100 all in. I had to add a Radeon 7500 from OcUK on top as it had onboard GFX so call it £1300. That is £2300 in todays money for what would have been a mid range PC.

My father wasn't either poor he was retired in his 50's with a final pension from the army and ICL/Fujitsu computers. Yet we only had 1 television in the living room for the vast majority (He would rent a new one every year from Hughes) and a small 15" in the kitchen where I would play the majority of my computer games till later when I got my own TV in my bedroom.

Roll on today and we have a television in every room bar the bathroom. My 3 year old son has a 55" Samsung in his bedroom!

If it wasn't for the mess with housing we would be a lot better off than boomers as we would have a lot more cash to put away for pensions etc but that is just the way it is. Equality of pay from the top to the bottom is the problem not the boomers so you can thank Thatcher and the 80's for that.



This is very true. I worked in management in the food production industry from 2008 till 2022. My annual earnings in 2008 on the shop floor were around 26k or 40K in todays market whereas someone doing a similar job today would be lucky to make 30K. Company's annual profits were around the 80 million mark. They benefitted massively from cheap foreign labour. At the beginning you had a waiting list of staff wanting to be trained up to a higher grade to say run machinery and if they didn't make the cut you just managed them out of the business. Go forward to the end of my tenure and I am managing 50+ people, short of at least 20 staff a day, agencies unable to supply workers and getting to the point where whole production lines are having to be stopped and the company is being fined by its customers for shorting orders. I spent half my day phoning up people just to try and get overtime in to cover the shortfall. They have alienated themselves from an English workforce as a result and are unable to recruit. They have increased the wages massively recently but was too little too late. They have shut down two sites this year alone. With around 6 shutting down in the past 3 years. I thought I had a cushy job for life (13 weeks sick pay, tax benefits, healthcare, decent pension contributions etc) but the job just become untenable because of what they expected me to do by the end where I would most likely end up with heart problems at 50 from the stress. Looking back it was absolutely crazy how quickly something can change in just a 15 year period.

The prices here do seem quite comparable actually. Especially post covid. As @mid_gen said.look at cost of a PC. I'm priced out of that.

Sure, we have more convinces.

Doesn't take away that housing is the big big problem. Being early or being gifted/inheriting a deposit early on (say in early 20s) means you can basically get a minimum wage job and still do really well.


With no help even a higher tax salary can make it a slog to get on the ladder. And then you're saddled with an ever bigger mortgage the later you get on.

Remember retirement is pushing up and up too. And life expectancy has stopped extending.

Personally, I think it will really show when our generation retire. Sorry, don't retire.
Its not showing so much now as we are working age. But my parents retired early. I, on a bigger inflation adjusted salary, will probably be working 15 years longer. Simply due to dire state and work place pension.

 

[Rroff]

I am just turned 50, so bang in the middle of the groups.

One of the big differences I notice from being a kid is the availability of luxury foods. By luxury, I mean being able to have fresh strawberries/ tomatoes in February and the like. I still find it a minor miracle that I can buy blueberries, at all.

I grew up in a fairly working class family- it was tripe for tea at least once a week, and in winter it would be heavy on root vegetables (swedes etc). As an adult, my diet is completely different.

The other big difference is waste. My dad saved everything, old screws, bits of wood etc, as he grew up in poverty and during rationing. I just chuck it out.

I guess my point is it is swings and roundabouts.

The older generation got cheaper housing etc, but general quality of life was way different.

People have no interest in doing repairs, etc. these days - though you do have to be careful of clutter and just holding onto things for the sake of it I tend to file away all kinds of odds and ends like screws and fastenings, etc. so often I've been able to repair things or build something to solve a problem, etc. etc. I'm "only" 41.

There seems to be vast amounts of waste with the generation around me and below, which wasn't there, mostly, before, with complete abandonment, it is sad to see.

In terms of food - my parents ate more basic, stopped eating out, etc. etc. and those sacrifices made an appreciable difference in terms of buying a house, etc. these days, and something many of the older generations don't seem to be able to appreciate, those kind of sacrifices have little reward and in many cases make negligible difference if at all in someone's position in terms of housing.

EDIT: Related to this there has been conversations at work where the increasing costs of living are ruinous on people's plans to save up to buy their own place.

 

[adam cool dude]

1) I'm not sure what your mother scrimping and saving for an N64 vs you impulse buying an Series X says about anything more than your stupid spending habits.

Costs of games is really down to the size of the gaming market, economies of scale, and the physical cost of the cartridge manufacturing back then.

2) Have you looked at PC parts recently? A complete mid-range gaming PC, from scratch, is going to be around that £2.3k mark today.

Electronics in general are a lot cheaper than they were back then. We have far easier access to technology. PC's have also been inherently cheap for a long time. Maybe you are all looking at OCUK prices but it is only recently due to the crypto boom that they have been skewed due to GPU prices. I see plenty of mid range gaming PC's on UKhotdeals for around a grand. Add monitor and peripherals and you will not be much over 1300. Perhaps our definition of mid range is different.

I wasn't impulse buying the Series X either but merely pointing out that a brand new console was about £50 cheaper than it was back then. Both were brand new tech at the time of purchase and the games were a lot more expensive whereas now you can get Gamepass for next to nothing and have access to 100's of games straight away.

 

[Werewolf]

My mum's house is worth 45x more than they paid.

#lolLondon

Yarp, similar with my dad's house, he paid £11k for it in around '76, which means if it had went up just with inflation it would be around £67k now, in reality it's probably over £300k and it's nothing special, a house 20 meters away is up for £280k, and doesn't have the garage or extension.

 

[ColdAsIce]

What Hans Christian Anderson fairy tale books have you and rest of this generation been reading.

The main boomer generation wasn't all the same - Very few of the country lived in London where pay was much higher than anywhere else in UK and they down there bought their council houses and sold them for big prices - That had a knock on for whole of UK and prices increased although pay stayed lower here.

We could never have had a council house as we didn't have kids so we rented furnished then unfurnished - we then saver for a deposit on a house and at one point interest rate hit 12%+ and my income didn't cover the mortgage so good job wife worked.
From there it's as my OP above.

So when I retired 23 yrs ago and collected my whacking great final salary pension I was ovewhelmed.
On retirement my salary was 2/3rds of the national average so being clever work that out then half it for my pension -Now see how much it is after 23 yrs of inflation and I can tell you the girl over the road that works at Tesco picks up more than me.
The wife and I like a lot of the people of our age who did buy their own houses were the same as me - Property owner but not rich by any means. We don't buy things we can't afford - we never took out debt but saved for it - Not quite like this gen who "WANT'S IT NOW.

The wifes parents bought their council house for around 50k and it sold for £120k when they died years later. - that was divided by two. (her sister)

I just wish you lot would look at the whole picture not the tasty bit's you pick out to support your flawed argument.

The NHS did indeed work but we the boomers didn't vote in smarmy face Bliar who opened up this country to the scum of the world - How can something work when another 4million are added to the list but not paying in - of course it is broke.

Your gen has so many funny groups who are managing to force the police to change the way they work.

Our life wasn't easy - we worked hard day in day out and made do - nothing wife and I had was handed to us on a plate -we worked for it. We couldn't even afford a washing washine when we got our first house -we had a wishy washy ringer machine given to us -Would you accept that today -I very much doubt you would.

Anyway do what we did and work hard -do overtime -save your money -don't go on expensive holidays -don't waste it on trivia -buy a left hand drive Citroen 2CV like we did - or a rusty DAF 44 or Fiat Panda. And main thing -Don't have kids unless you can afford them - I have spent my life paying family allowance for other peoples kid and now I am subsidising child care. Can't you all pay your own way and save me a bit of tax.


My car is a 13 yr old Focus.

Most of the old generation were well compensated for working hard. In the 80s and 90s my dad shift work because it was 100% guaranteed overtime available. If he wanted to work a Saturday (double time) Sunday (treble time) any bank holiday, or something like Easter / Xmas new year etc. treble time. Guess how much extra you would get for coming in on a Sunday at Wetherspoons etc? Nothing. Your standard wage flat rate.

 

[adam cool dude]

People have no interest in doing repairs, etc. these days - though you do have to be careful of clutter and just holding onto things for the sake of it I tend to file away all kinds of odds and ends like screws and fastenings, etc. so often I've been able to repair things or build something to solve a problem, etc. etc. I'm "only" 41.

There seems to be vast amounts of waste with the generation around me and below, which wasn't there, mostly, before, with complete abandonment, it is sad to see.

In terms of food - my parents ate more basic, stopped eating out, etc. etc. and those sacrifices made an appreciable difference in terms of buying a house, etc. these days, and something many of the older generations don't seem to be able to appreciate, those kind of sacrifices have little reward and in many cases make negligible difference if at all in someone's position in terms of housing.

EDIT: Related to this there has been conversations at work where the increasing costs of living are ruinous on people's plans to save up to buy their own place.

I am still rocking a Dyson DC07 that was given to me by my dad. New motor brushes, rollers, a couple of snapped plastic parts replaced and the usual filters but it still works absolutely fantastic. The missus complained because it is big and heavy so I got her a new battery one. She hated it because the suction was rubbish so it was sent back.

I am only 36 but my father always taught me the benefit of being able to use my hands.

 

[Rroff]

Most of the old generation were well compensated for working hard. In the 80s and 90s my dad shift work because it was 100% guaranteed overtime available. If he wanted to work a Saturday (double time) Sunday (treble time) any bank holiday, or something like Easter / Xmas new year etc. treble time. Guess how much extra you would get for coming in on a Sunday at Wetherspoons etc? Nothing. Your standard wage flat rate.

Yeah it has really gone down the pan for working extra these days I got all of £185 extra for working right through the Easter bank holidays - would have been north of £500 back in the day when £500 was worth a lot more. Though I also got just over 14 hours uplifted to band 2 management pay because no managers wanted to be working it LOL so I won't complain too much.

 

[ColdAsIce]

Yeah it has really gone down the pan for working extra these days I got all of £185 extra for working right through the Easter bank holidays - would have been north of £500 back in the day when £500 was worth a lot more. Though I also got just over 14 hours uplifted to band 2 management pay because no managers wanted to be working it LOL so I won't complain too much.

It’s why he turned down promotions for years. That would have moved him onto a salary / no overtime. I don’t understand why they wouldn’t recruit more staff. Overtime was 100% available all year round. Would have been nice to see him more but he smashed out the hours of overtime instead and it paid off back then. Helps that his council house sold for about 13x what he paid for it too…

 

[Rroff]

It’s why he turned down promotions for years. That would have moved him onto a salary / no overtime. I don’t understand why they wouldn’t recruit more staff. Overtime was 100% available all year round. Would have been nice to see him more but he smashed out the hours of overtime instead and it paid off back then. Helps that his council house sold for about 13x what he paid for it too…

Businesses always seem reluctant to hire more staff - aside from the extra administration I guess there is also the possibility of changes which leave them massively overstaffed as well. But so many businesses go to the extreme and work a small number of staff into the ground then wonder why they lose good people and/or don't appreciate the cost of losing good people rather than just hire slightly more staff.

EDIT: Where I work no one is really properly salaried aside from like director level, even salaried positions have paid overtime beyond a certain point, etc. and various hourly uplifts.

 

[mid_gen]

Electronics in general are a lot cheaper than they were back then. We have far easier access to technology. PC's have also been inherently cheap for a long time. Maybe you are all looking at OCUK prices but it is only recently due to the crypto boom that they have been skewed due to GPU prices. I see plenty of mid range gaming PC's on UKhotdeals for around a grand. Add monitor and peripherals and you will not be much over 1300. Perhaps our definition of mid range is different.

I wasn't impulse buying the Series X either but merely pointing out that a brand new console was about £50 cheaper than it was back then. Both were brand new tech at the time of purchase and the games were a lot more expensive whereas now you can get Gamepass for next to nothing and have access to 100's of games straight away.

Electronics in general cheaper? Well it depends how you measure it. Is a mobile phone cheaper now? Well yes, if you buy a £20 Nokia feature phone that does the same job, sure. but you get a mid-range smartphone and you're looking at £400+

Ditto PCs. A mid-range current gen graphics card sets you back a grand now. You could put together a budget build for a grand but it's definitely not mid-range by any definition.

Neither of these is really a good measure of the cost of living though, because they are luxuries.

Necessities, namely housing, have gone up massively compared to incomes. The tax burden is higher than ever, and in return we have absolute ****e services thank to 13 years of Tory.

Collapse on your kitchen floor with a heart attack today and chances are you'll be dead before an ambulance arrives. Progress eh?

 

[Rroff]

Collapse on your kitchen floor with a heart attack today and chances are you'll be dead before an ambulance arrives. Progress eh?

I've been at/involved in a few incidents recently where police or ambulance has been called with ludicrous results like literally turning up a day later to see if they are still needed....... (or just to hand out generic advice).

 

[PlacidCasual]

People in the their mid 20's to mid 30's in the 70's would have been born into rationing. They would have experienced huge inflation and interest rates at times during their middle years. The idea of people taking their houe keys back to the estate agent because they were in negative equity and couldn't afford their mortgages was very real. They lived through years of strikes, rolling black outs and overseas travel for the masses didn't really take off until the late 70's.

It is sad that housing costs have grown out of all proportion to income but that is a tyranny of cheap credit so the collateral rich have access to cheap credit and have chased collateral poor out of the market. The power we have handed finance in our lives is truly frightening.