Insulating a shed - for someone useless at DIY

[Junglist]

Brains of OCUK, I need to work something out and I'm sure most of you would have a sensible answer for what I'm trying to do.

We're getting a shed put up next week, it's an 8'x6' pent shed which we will be using for our indoor cycling set up/room. To make it a bit more pleasant and somewhere we wont mind being in, we're going to try and make it look somewhat like a room from inside the house.

Not going to bother insulating the base of the shed I figured if we got some thick underlay and carpets, that would do most of the work of stopping the draught coming in. It's the walls and roof which I am a bit stuck on. I'm looking to do this as cheap as possible as we'll likely be selling and moving from the house in 2-3 years so longevity isn't a concern just as long as it can survive the next few winters, it'll be worth while.

Would this polystyrene insulation do the trick if it was placed along the walls and roof? Realistically we're going to be exercising within the shed so it doesn't have to make it extremely warm just be able to take the edge off in the winter and a bonus if it can keep it a bit cooler in the summer. Planning on having some electrical bits in the shed as well (computer, tv, lights and soundbar) which I presume I would need to really reduce how much condensation would happen within the shed after sweating out.

Can it also just be left as it is and paint over it or would we need to have plasterboard placed over it?

I guess my second question is; how the hell do I install it? Would I need to attempt to build a frame out of wood and place it within the cavities or can I (what I would do without seeking help) just get some adhesive and stick it to the shed walls?

If it's not clear from my ramblings, I have zero idea about what I'm doing and what I need to do! We've just decided this is the best route to go and will work things out along the way

 

[Semple]

Realistically without a heat source in there I can't see it doing diddly squat in the winter.

Unless you're really going full on with insulating it (which will be tricky in an 8x6 shed due to the space you'll lose) I'd also avoid putting things in like a PC/TV as any condensation will just ruin them.

 

[KompuKare]

Is it wood or steel?
I think in either case you could grabfill it but since you've done nothing about moisture then it will get wet.

If the outside is wood, you'd ideally want a membrane against that. The type which stops water but allows air (so anything which does go in doesn't become trapped), Tyvek Housewrap etc.
And for those you should leave a gap (2.4m x 1.8m quickly gets small with 100mm or more insulation).
Also, a DPM under a foundation makes a huge difference - if you just have old carpets they will probably get wet and stay wet and eventually some fungus will come along too.

For full insulation on a shed/garden house etc., I think it's something like outside skin > Breatable Membrane > air gap > insulation > a vapour barrier > plasterboard or similar.

As ESP boards vs PIR etc. I think EPS has great compression strength (you can walk on it). No wait that's XPS. EPS is still better for walking on than PIR.

Although:

Water vapour diffusion resistance​

EPS has a water vapour diffusion resistance of 30-70, whereas XPS reaches 80-250. Slightly more permeable to air and moisture, EPS is less resistant to water vapour than XPS. If you’re looking to insulate a space prone to humidity (e.g. floors, cellars, and foundation walls), XPS is your best option. PIR and PUR are a no-go in those scenarios, because water may soak into the compound of the product, increasing its weight and (in the longer term) reducing its thermal value.

What is the difference between EPS and XPS insulation? And what about PIR/PUR? - Soprema United Kingdom

Whether a building complies with today’s energy standards greatly depends on the type of insulation used. Discover the differences between EPS, XPS, PIR and PUR.

www.soprema.co.uk

Although vastly oversold, maybe those bubble super foil things might work. If your shed is wood, you can just staple it on. Acts as a vapour barrier. At least somewhat

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Polystyrene will do something, but it's not the most efficient product you can get. Perhaps if you're going very low budget. To install you'd be cutting it so that it fits between the shed frame. If you want it to feel like a room, then you'll want to plasterboard over. I think insulating the floor might be a worthwhile investment.

Are you intending to wire this properly (armoured cable, new RCD etc) to support the electrical bits?

 

[Junglist]

Realistically without a heat source in there I can't see it doing diddly squat in the winter.

Unless you're really going full on with insulating it (which will be tricky in an 8x6 shed due to the space you'll lose) I'd also avoid putting things in like a PC/TV as any condensation will just ruin them.

If it was properly freezing I could always put a little fan heater in there to take the edge off. I get really hot when I cycle especially during intervals so it doesn't need to be toasty in there. It's only going to be used for turbo sessions so needs to just not be as cold as outside. The actual space for the trainer only needs to be about 1mx2m so if we really need to insulate around, it could be done. A TV will have to live in there but I'm going to scout gumtree for something cheap I don't mind sacrificing. I Suppose I could always just use a laptop for the computer part though.

Is it wood or steel?
I think in either case you could grabfill it but since you've done nothing about moisture then it will get wet.

If the outside is wood, you'd ideally want a membrane against that. The type which stops water but allows air (so anything which does go in doesn't become trapped), Tyvek Housewrap etc.
And for those you should leave a gap (2.4m x 1.8m quickly gets small with 100mm or more insulation).
Also, a DPM under a foundation makes a huge difference - if you just have old carpets they will probably get wet and stay wet and eventually some fungus will come along too.

For full insulation on a shed/garden house etc., I think it's something like outside skin > Breatable Membrane > air gap > insulation > a vapour barrier > plasterboard or similar.

As ESP boards vs PIR etc. I think EPS has great compression strength (you can walk on it). No wait that's XPS. EPS is still better for walking on than PIR.

Although:

What is the difference between EPS and XPS insulation? And what about PIR/PUR? - Soprema United Kingdom

Whether a building complies with today’s energy standards greatly depends on the type of insulation used. Discover the differences between EPS, XPS, PIR and PUR.

www.soprema.co.uk

Although vastly oversold, maybe those bubble super foil things might work. If your shed is wood, you can just staple it on. Acts as a vapour barrier. At least somewhat

It's a fairly thick wooden one. I did see there was some membrane from Wicks that looked like fancy tinfoil. I did add that to the basket and assumed I'd do that against the actual wood then put the polystyrene boards on top of that. I believe the builders are doing a DPM between the foundation and base of the shed but I'll double check with them when they install next week.

Thanks for the help! Much to think about

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Insulation will do nothing if it's going to retain shed like qualities like single glazing, no heating, non-sealing door, etc.

Turning a 'shed' into a proper garden room is quite an undertaking.

 

[BUDFORCE]

I wouldn't bother, you need to go all in or not, half arsing (no offense) won't achieve much.

 

[Junglist]

Polystyrene will do something, but it's not the most efficient product you can get. Perhaps if you're going very low budget. To install you'd be cutting it so that it fits between the shed frame. If you want it to feel like a room, then you'll want to plasterboard over. I think insulating the floor might be a worthwhile investment.

Are you intending to wire this properly (armoured cable, new RCD etc) to support the electrical bits?

Did think about insulating the floor but the shed is only 6'10 in height and I worry that when out of the saddle I may be headbutting the roof if I insulated the floor?

Getting it wired up properly was considered but I imagine that would add a significant cost. Was planning on just running an extension lead from an outside plug into the shed whenever it would be in use. If this was in a house we planned to stay in for more than 2 years, I'd totally go that route. I just don't want to spend too much money on something we will leave behind.

 

[Junglist]

I wouldn't bother, you need to go all in or not, half arsing (no offense) won't achieve much.

Half arsing is my only option at the moment really. It's literally only going to be used to do turbo trainer sessions on as I can no longer use the trainer where it was originally set up. The shed wont be used for anything else so being really well insulated isn't a huge concern.

Basically as long as I am dry and it retains enough heat initially that my hands aren't frozen - it'll be good enough. I'm pretty sure my body heat after a few intervals will warm it up

Appreciate all the help though, I literally have no idea what I'm doing!

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Sounds like polystyrene would be a waste of money tbh. Forget about using it in winter. It'll be damp, cold and miserable.

 

[Junglist]

I wish that would be an option but sadly it's not lol. The cold part isn't the bit I'm worried about, if anything the cold will be welcome. The condensation is the main concern with a TV. But I guess as long as I leave the door open and have airflow, it shouldn't be too bad.

I blame my daughter for kicking me out of the spare room

 

[sovietspybob]

I'll echo the others in here, with a wooden garden shed there isn't going to be much point, if you wanted an insulated outdoor building it'd be easier to built it from scratch with that in mind, retrofitting a standard shed would be a big undertaking.

Best bet would be to just make sure there's good air flow so you don't get too much condensation and then just bring a laptop out with you each time.

 

[Junglist]

I think I probably oversold what I'm trying to achieve with the word 'insulating'. I'm not expecting it to be insulated to the point that it feels like a room in the house where we can sit and relax in. More so I just wanted to avoid condensation so that the electricals will be fine in there. I'm not going to be lugging my smart trainer in and out every time I want to do a session. It's going to be permanently set up with either mine or my partners bikes. I do have a powerful fan which will always be on as I work out so i guess if I leave the door open after a workout and the fan on for a bit it would reduce the risk.

In that case then maybe I'll just get some of that foil looking stuff and some plasterboard so it at least doesn't feel like I'm in a shed. Not that that bit matters so much. Just want to be able to ride/suffer in peace

 

[Semple]

I wish that would be an option but sadly it's not lol. The cold part isn't the bit I'm worried about, if anything the cold will be welcome. The condensation is the main concern with a TV. But I guess as long as I leave the door open and have airflow, it shouldn't be too bad.

I blame my daughter for kicking me out of the spare room

If it was just to use the bike, with nothing fixed electrical out there then it's not too much of a concern. Having something permanently out there even if not plugged in I'd see as a recipe for disaster.

Can you not take a laptop out and plug it in only when you're out using the bike?

 

[Junglist]

If it was just to use the bike, with nothing fixed electrical out there then it's not too much of a concern. Having something permanently out there even if not plugged in I'd see as a recipe for disaster.

Can you not take a laptop out and plug it in only when you're out using the bike?

What the bike is on also requires electric. If I have to go full hog and take 100mm off each wall due to insulation, I can do that. Just means I'll have to take my time doing it rather than getting it all done quickly.

Still want to do it as cheap as possible as it's only a temporary requirement. As long as it can last 2 years, I don't care if it falls apart during year 3 as we'll be moving house and leaving it behind.

 

[Uther]

Leave it as it is and chuck an oil filled rad in there when it's cold. That's what I use with the treadmill in our shed, takes the edge off and you soon warm up anyway.
Just accept that it's not very energy efficient.

 

[Junglist]

Well I guess that begs the question if I do that, if it's just better to spend the money and get electric out there.

It seemed like a great idea when buying the shed but once I started looking into it I realised it not as simple as shed up. bike in. ride on

 

[Uther]

Our shed is wired up properly, armoured cable, rcd, lights, sockets. We have a freezer and the treadmill in there.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

More airflow = more spiders.

 

[Junglist]

More airflow = more spiders.

That's the bit I'm really scared about!

So I'm starting to change my mind (Me, being fickle? surely not!). Going to email a few electricians and see how much it would cost to get electric out to the shed. If it's not an absurd amount I guess I could just have a little electric heater out there and get some of that silver stuff to reduce condensation - would that work? Can worry about doing all the boarding up at a later date.