Intel about to expand into Graphics, AMD on the rise, are the tables turning on nVidia?

Jimmy Weirdarms · 4 Dec 2019 at 07:13

b00merang69 said:
P.S while you waiting I will just play my games on my Titan Xp (the 2017 card), I would not touch a 2000 series BTW.

Why not?
My 2080 Ti was cheaper than your Xp (unless you bought used I guess) and has about 25% more performance. Seems like progress to me!

b00merang69 · 4 Dec 2019 at 07:30

I have had the card from new but got a very good deal due to RMA on 1080Ti due to faulty fan and they were low stock near EOL, this was before the 2000 series came out.

At launch the 2080Ti were even behind the 1080Ti in many games going by many reviews and I need a blower so not sure what you are trying to say....

I can game at 1440p and play my backlog of games and sit on this for 2 years or so till Nvidia get something far better and more tested than the 2000 series space invaders launch cards and RTX performs better and I can dream of a better screen than current LCD crap tech.

P.S progress was going to a 7900 GTX from a 7800 GTX = 100% jump, 25% seem the norm today as that is what buyers are willing to buy where as I skip a gen or 2 somethings.

Jimmy Weirdarms · 4 Dec 2019 at 07:48

b00merang69 said:
At launch the 2080Ti were even behind the 1080Ti in many games going by many reviews

Never heard that before! And it's certainly not the case now, being 30%+ better performing in general...

Whatever floats your boat I guess, but there's no reason to think this generation is any worse than any other. It seems popular to say there's been no performance gain over the last gen round these parts... but when the 2070S is equivalent to the previous gen's 80Ti, and new tech (RTX) has been introduced, it looks OK to me. Prices have got high, but if you were buying a Titan then that's not really on the list of valid complaints!

I'm not trying to argue you ought to go out and buy one, it just seems a bit odd to single it out for criticism when your real reason is "I'm happy with what I've got for now", and that's fine!

b00merang69 · 4 Dec 2019 at 07:57

Well you couldn't have looked at the reviews thread here on launch day, the 1080ti and Titan Xp were above it in the benchmark charts in many games.

I really do not care if its 30% or 50% now as it was not at launch and I am not struggling in games and do not care for RTX right now and the 2000 series did not exist when I bought my card so I still do not see your point unless your trying to justify your purchase to yourself.

2000 was a poor launch, prices and failures then replaced by a newer (fixed) Die number then Supers for most of the range which was a boot to the balls for the buyers of the non Supers.

Psycho Sonny · 4 Dec 2019 at 08:23

b00merang69 said:
Well you couldn't have looked at the reviews thread here on launch day, the 1080ti and Titan Xp were above it in the benchmark charts in many games.

I really do not care if its 30% or 50% now as it was not at launch and I am not struggling in games and do not care for RTX right now and the 2000 series did not exist when I bought my card so I still do not see your point unless your trying to justify your purchase to yourself.

2000 was a poor launch, prices and failures then replaced by a newer (fixed) Die number then Supers for most of the range which was a boot to the balls for the buyers of the non Supers.

Regardless of all the above. It cost me £150 to upgrade from a 1080 to a 2070 super.

What did I get for that £150?

Well I now have a card with a brand new warranty vs a card with next to none.

I also have 20% more power when gaming.

For the sake of £150 I reckon it would be stupid to keep on using the 1080. I now have peace of mind if the card dies as I know it won't cost me £500 to replace. I also now get much more respectable fps in apex legends. At times it would drop to 80 fps and I have a 165hz monitor so it's a lot smoother now.

With second hand prices of 10 series cards being stupidly inflated. I would say those not upgrading could regret not doing so should their 10 series card fail on them. It's a no brainer.

Ill probably do the same next gen. Wait until the supers launch and prices come down to make upgrading a lot easier to handle.

As for 100% jump in power. That will never happen within a generation not at a reasonable price point. We have come to a point where tech can only get so small. Therefore it can only have so many transistors, etc. Making it smaller is now getting harder. You can see how Intel have struggled and won't move to the same process as amd until 3 years after them.

aoaaron · 4 Dec 2019 at 11:05

Psycho Sonny said:
Why would you hold back tech? If you have a chance to completely ruin your competition you take it.

After all owning 100% of the market is better than 50%.

Remember nvidia don't make any gpus for consoles which is a massive market bigger than pc gaming.

So I don't believe nvidia are holding back for a second. This is what they have to offer.

You hold back tech because you can make more money from higher priced products which cost less to produce.

b00merang69 · 4 Dec 2019 at 11:14

@Psycho Sonny, That is your case but a 1080Ti like many have/had to a 2000 series esp at launch unless you were desperate to try lacking buggy RTX back at launch and many thread here advised against it when the question was asked if they should upgrade their 1080Ti (one was last week).

You really think I if my EVGA 1080Ti was still ok (10 year warranty so not an issue like your card and it was a golden 2100mhz stable Core Heaven/Valley/games) or the Titan Xp I should have moved to the 2080Ti on launch day?

I have been sitting pretty since 2017 and still am, just because a new card is finally 20% faster does not make mines unusable and RTX does not even come into it at this stage for now.

I added the 100% per jump to show him what a proper gain is not 20% but that is what your going to get drop fed with now and was the same on Intel side of CPU's due to no competition for a long time.

JediFragger · 4 Dec 2019 at 11:17

aoaaron said:
their gpus not so much

Too harsh imo, the 5700-series has been outstanding for AMD I think. Just because they started in the more profitable mid-range segment don't hold that against them. They may surprise us soon

aoaaron · 4 Dec 2019 at 11:55

JediFragger said:
Too harsh imo, the 5700-series has been outstanding for AMD I think. Just because they started in the more profitable mid-range segment don't hold that against them. They may surprise us soon

Yeah sorry I’m only at the 4k end of things at the moment so I’m just very annoyed by amd and how late they arrive with anything relevant for myself.

LoadsaMoney · 4 Dec 2019 at 12:36

viathinair said:
LoadsaTrouble?

MissChief · 4 Dec 2019 at 12:52

I’ve been getting the impression AMD don’t really want the very top end of the market. While those cards and their owners may be numerous on here overall the cards are single digit percentage of market share with very little return available. AMD are far more into the mid range or slightly towards top end as there’s more buyers there. It also means less spend on bleeding edge R&D with little return.

oldestgregg · 4 Dec 2019 at 13:17

b00merang69 said:
At launch the 2080Ti were even behind the 1080Ti in many games going by many reviews and I need a blower so not sure what you are trying to say....
/QUOTE]

I went from a 1080ti to a 2080ti at launch and at no point was the 2080 slower. Same brand and model card and at 4k it faster from day one.

oldestgregg · 4 Dec 2019 at 13:20

Made a mess of quoting b00merang there but the point stands. From day one, the 2080ti was faster than the 1080ti. Sorry it just was and like for like comparisons ,at the same settings I just dont understand how the 2080 could be anything but faster?

melmac · 4 Dec 2019 at 13:40

b00merang69 said:
Well you couldn't have looked at the reviews thread here on launch day, the 1080ti and Titan Xp were above it in the benchmark charts in many games.

Are you sure you are not thinking of the 2080? Because, apart from some 1080p benchmarks on launch day, the 1080Ti was never faster than the 2080Ti.

b00merang69 said:
At launch the 2080Ti were even behind the 1080Ti in many games going by many reviews and I need a blower so not sure what you are trying to say....

Again at 1080P maybe in some games because the 2080ti is a lot more bottlenecked than the 1080ti at that resolution. At 1440p and above the 2080ti is always faster. And you can get blower 2080Ti's as well, so not sure what you are talking about.

b00merang69 · 4 Dec 2019 at 14:07

I said in some games the 1080Ti and Titan Xp were above the 2080Ti in the charts posted in the review thread on this very forum, they were near equal in other games and bellow it in other games but the were above the 2080 in nearly all if not all games.

I know as I was going to be dumb and upgrade but after what I seen and the mess of RTX then and the dying cards I decided to skip this gen.

The reviews were 1080p / 1440p and 4k, the 1080Ti/Titan Xp are 1440p cards 1080p will be more the CPU holding them back.

melmac · 4 Dec 2019 at 14:31

b00merang69 said:
I said in some games the 1080Ti and Titan Xp were above the 2080Ti in the charts posted in the review thread on this very forum, they were near equal in other games and bellow it in other games but the were above the 2080 in nearly all if not all games.

And I am telling you that wasn't the case apart from a few games at 1080p. The 2080 and the 1080Ti traded blows, but the 2080Ti was faster than both at 1440P and higher resolutions.

If you understand what bottlenecking is and consider the Titan XP and 1080Ti to be 1440p cards, why are/were you even looking at 1080p benchmarks for the 2080Ti? The 2080Ti is even more CPU limited at 1080p than both the Titan XP and the 1080Ti.

b00merang69 · 4 Dec 2019 at 14:36

I know what I seen/read here and on the sites linked to and when did I say I looked only at 1080p benches that was my reply to you mentioning 1080p and my reply was 1080p /1440p and 4k (as that is what the sites tested).

Are you simply justifying your purchase as i am happy with mines and have been for 2 years and will be for year so I have no need to.

KiNgPiN83 · 4 Dec 2019 at 15:03

Going back to the subject at hand i think it will be interesting once Intel release a GPU as AMD and Intel both have CPU sales to help keep things ticking over whilst Nvidia just have GPU's. So its imperative to them that they stay that the top of the GPU tree as well as making sure there other offerings are more competitive in price and performance than the Red and Blue teams. They could be in for a rude awakening... Or they could go and buy a CPU company just to even things out.

4K8KW10 · 4 Dec 2019 at 15:16

KiNgPiN83 said:
Going back to the subject at hand i think it will be interesting once Intel release a GPU as AMD and Intel both have CPU sales to help keep things ticking over whilst Nvidia just have GPU's. So its imperative to them that they stay that the top of the GPU tree as well as making sure there other offerings are more competitive in price and performance than the Red and Blue teams. They could be in for a rude awakening... Or they could go and buy a CPU company just to even things out.

The x86 license which they desperately need is not transferable. If they start using ARM-type of cores, the performance competitiveness will be doubtful.

I think nvidia is screwed and doomed in the long term, more likely intel and AMD would support Xe and Radeon on their platforms, while dropping the full support of nvidia cards.
I would advise them to do so

KiNgPiN83 · 4 Dec 2019 at 15:23

4K8KW10 said:
The x86 license which they desperately need is not transferable. If they start using ARM-type of cores, the performance competitiveness will be doubtful.

I think nvidia is screwed and doomed in the long term, more likely intel and AMD would support Xe and Radeon on their platforms, while dropping the full support of nvidia cards.
I would advise them to do so

So technically Nvidia couldn't just buy VIA or DM&P electronics and use their X86 licence? (The other two holders according to Wikipedia) I'm, guessing however they'd have to also somehow get AMD to agree to give them a 64 licence too which would be interesting. Haha!