Is it worth getting an X-Box

[Caustic]

I find it so amusing that people hate MS so much. Why do people expect companies to be all sweatness and light?

As for Netscape, Netscape failed because it was terrible. The fact that you had to pay for Netscape at one time and a better free browser came out would have been applauded if it wasn't just because it was MS. Netscape was good until version 4. After that they took far too long with v6 and when it come out it was buggy and slow. IE might have won for several reason but it was the better browser, besides Netscape had a huge head start over MS.

The worst part is, I used to like Netscape.

As for Paladium, thats another huge area of discussion. People seem quick to hate it, but its only a concept, its far from completion and might never even happen (or even work ). Also, there are some positive things about it, such as it could help with the fight against virus and perhaps even reduce online cheating and games.

CD

 

[Kodiak]

Originally posted by HaX
No, its true. Look at Collin Mcrae 3 for example, Midtown Madness 3 (Yes I know an MS Product) & Halo. These will all be/have been released for the PC way after the X-box versions came out, in a backhanded attempt by MS to force people desperate to play the games to purchase an Xbox.

If the console is that good, they shouldn't need to do that.

Sometimes I DO want an X-box, but then I think in years to come I may regret the decision because, as a consumer, I will find very few avenues to choose from in the games market.

You only have to look at the history of Windows to see what I mean about. Look what happened to Netscape, Microsoft integrated IE into Windows 98 onwards so much that it can't be removed. Not many people are going to install other browsers when they have one pre-installed on their PCs.

Another point of interest, is that since Linux has been becoming a desktop OS in many European local government offices (replacing windows), MS has seen it as a threat and has been funding SCO (Unix Authors) suing the various different Linux distributors (for supposed theft of copyright) in an attempt to put the existance of Linux to an end.

Also, MS are working with M/B manufacturers to create Paladium, a secure platform which will make it impossible to download & use unverified/licensed/signed software on your computer. What will happen to freeware or home-written sw>One up for the $$ hungry over charging sw manufacturers and one down for PC owners, their wallets and privacy.


Microsoft have been a very innovative company, don't get me wrong, but they are taking it one step too far, and not taking into account the well-being of their customers.

I for one, will be switching to a decent Linux Distribution, if Paladium is as they say it is, by which time, it should be refined to the extent of MAC OS for example.

Paladium is years off and probably wont be implimented. Most of the best bits of software are free and all the innovation that exists with PCs will vannish.

As for the IE verses Netscape, well IE is the lesser of the two evils there. Plus its taken 5 (ish) years to kill Netscape and there are still other options about (Mozilla, Opera anyone?).


As for MS's attempt to 'steal' software away from the PC, this has only happened with Halo. And it isnt new, how about Sony and their 'deal' with Rockstar and the GTA3 series? MS only get singled out since the Linux masses seem to winge the loudest about MS funny dealings. I bet a company like Sony is as dirty as MS.

 

[Exorcist]

lol cant believe someone replied in an MS hating manner lol how sad

 

[TheDome]

microsoft will never have a monopoly in the consloe market as long as sony are making playstations.

Thats all that needs to be said on the matter really.

 

[Caustic]

Originally posted by Da-man-uk
microsoft will never have a monopoly in the consloe market as long as sony are making playstations.

Don't rule out Nintendo. I wouldn't like to see them go.

CD

 

[HaX]

Originally posted by Afterlife
lol cant believe someone replied in an MS hating manner lol how sad

I've not posted what I did because I hate Microsoft, but to illustrate what has happened in the past.

Regardless of whether or not the competition was inferior, Microsoft still employed underhand tactics in order to ensure that they pretty much wiped out the competition and the consumer was left with less choices.

Microsoft could, and most likely will use similair tactics in the console and gaming market

 

[sc(+)pe]

Originally posted by HaX
I've not posted what I did because I hate Microsoft, but to illustrate what has happened in the past.

Regardless of whether or not the competition was inferior, Microsoft still employed underhand tactics in order to ensure that they pretty much wiped out the competition and the consumer was left with less choices.

Microsoft could, and most likely will use similair tactics in the console and gaming market

Welcome to the real world pal. Underhand tactics happen all the time in BIG business.

For me MS give me a great OS and great console. Thats more than good enough for me. And if you dont like MS get Linux on your xbox Although why any1 would want linux on their xbox is beyond me.

 

[SooTyLaD]

Re: Re: Is it worth getting an X-Box

Originally posted by HaX
I personally wouldn't, because by doing so you are aiding microsoft in gaining yet another monopoly, this time in the gaming industry.

M$ will never gain anything of the sort as long as Sony are alive and kicking... i personally have an XBox and GC but sold my PS2, because i felt it was getting a bit dated, but you can rest assured there gonna open a whole new can-o-worms with the PS3... M$ dont stand a chance!

 

[Exorcist]

get over it, companies like MS are there and no amount of whinging will stop it.

 

[adam cool dude]

Re: Re: Re: Is it worth getting an X-Box

Originally posted by Caustic
Ha ha ha. I do hope your not serious.

With the Xbox, MS have made some major changes to the console formula. You say no inventiveness or creativity, but how about the first console using PC components, the first console to have a HD as standard, the first with Broadband only internet gaming. They most certainly are inventive and creative.

As for saying the Xbox is just a PC with an nVidia gfx card in it, YAWN, how many times have I heard that.

Demise of consumer freedom? ROFLMAO. Yeah, because MS is going to be the only console maker in a hurry.

CD

Thats the most amount of rubbish i have ever herd, consoles have been using Pc parts in them all the time, even the NES had a off the shelf PC Cpu as did the mega drive. The gamecube processor is based on power pc (MAC) architecture. The Nes even had its own disk drive, as did the N64 add on the 64DD. Also the dreamcast had online play years before the xbox. The only thing microsoft have done inventive with their console is make a somewhat large PC system fit into a smaller although still big box. As for xbox games well if you got a more than capable PC there is no need to own a xbox as most of the top xbox releases end up on PC but with better graphics etc. For example Splinter Cell is already on the PC with KOTOR and Halo to come by the end of this summer. Yes the live experience is good but when the system lags and means you can only have servers of about 16 players, it lacks somewhat in enjoyment compared to a PC.

As for microsoft dominating the industry, they failed to buyout sega and nintendo and are now languishing in third place in world wide sales plus the xbox is loosing microsoft 250 million a quarter. I honestly doubt the xbox will even finish the next generation.

 

[Caustic]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Is it worth getting an X-Box

Originally posted by adam cool dude
Thats the most amount of rubbish i have ever herd, consoles have been using Pc parts in them all the time, even the NES had a off the shelf PC Cpu as did the mega drive. The gamecube processor is based on power pc (MAC) architecture. The Nes even had its own disk drive, as did the N64 add on the 64DD. Also the dreamcast had online play years before the xbox. The only thing microsoft have done inventive with their console is make a somewhat large PC system fit into a smaller although still big box. As for xbox games well if you got a more than capable PC there is no need to own a xbox as most of the top xbox releases end up on PC but with better graphics etc. For example Splinter Cell is already on the PC with KOTOR and Halo to come by the end of this summer. Yes the live experience is good but when the system lags and means you can only have servers of about 16 players, it lacks somewhat in enjoyment compared to a PC.

As for microsoft dominating the industry, they failed to buyout sega and nintendo and are now languishing in third place in world wide sales plus the xbox is loosing microsoft 250 million a quarter. I honestly doubt the xbox will even finish the next generation.

LOL.

I am afraid you are more than slightly wrong (like most of your post).

- The Nes and Megadrive did not have PC CPU's. The NES used a 6502 and the Mega Drive used a 68000. Neither have anything to do with 80x86's.

- The 64DD was a Disk Drive. Not a Hard Disk. Nor was it standard, which is what I was saying about the HD in the Xbox.

- Yes the gamecube CPU is based on a Power PC, but it has been altered in many ways. Besides, I said the Xbox was the first to use PC components, not Mac.

- Recent figures show MS is in Second place. Nintendo has just under 10 million GC's, MS has over 12 milion Xbox's. Yes the stats might be wrong but you show me otherwise.

- I never mentioned about the games.

If you don't like the Xbox then fine, but check your 'facts' before calling my post rubbish.

CD

 

[adam cool dude]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Is it worth getting an X-Box

Originally posted by Caustic
LOL.

I am afraid you are more than slightly wrong (like most of your post).

- The Nes and Megadrive did not have PC CPU's. The NES used a 6502 and the Mega Drive used a 68000. Neither have anything to do with 80x86's.

- The 64DD was a Disk Drive. Not a Hard Disk. Nor was it standard, which is what I was saying about the HD in the Xbox.

- Yes the gamecube CPU is based on a Power PC, but it has been altered in many ways. Besides, I said the Xbox was the first to use PC components, not Mac.

- Recent figures show MS is in Second place. Nintendo has just under 10 million GC's, MS has over 12 milion Xbox's. Yes the stats might be wrong but you show me otherwise.

- I never mentioned about the games.

If you don't like the Xbox then fine, but check your 'facts' before calling my post rubbish.

CD

I guess im going to have to wipe that cheeky grin off your face and show that mine are facts.

First of all here is a quote from a article over at gamespy proving that the NES used off the shelf PC components, mainly the CPU as i said.

Its processor, the NMOS 6502, was a slightly modified off-the-shelf part selected for its cheapness and ease of use. The processor ran at less than 2 MHz, which is less than 1/1000th the speed of an average Windows desktop CPU these days. Of course, the fact that such a cheap unit was still capable of playing great games well beyond its predecessors was what made it such a smash hit in both Japan and the U.S.

As the xbox is a slightly modifed off the shelf Pentium 3 i rest my case even though it is turd in its own right.

and the link if you want to read more about its pc parts although a console of slapped together pc parts isnt very good anyway NES Hardware

Yes the Disk Drives on both the NES and 64DD worked in a completly different way but the purpose of both was exactly the same as what the xbox had in mind

As for gamecube is second worldwide and by a million units at least. Recent Official numbers stated that the xbox had a user base worldwide of 9.4 million at the end of june. Nintendo had a user base worldwide of 9.4 million from last official figures at the end of march. So unless Nintendo didnt sell any consoles for three months then gamecube has quite a considerable lead. Especially that those march numbers from nintendo were before Zelda hit the shelves in america and europe which sold 1 million and 500.000 in each teritory. Thats why i said the xbox was languishing in third place worldwide. link

Anyway nice proving you wrong

 

[TheDome]

First of all here is a quote from a article over at gamespy proving that the NES used off the shelf PC components, mainly the CPU as i said.

And in that bit u posted where does it say PC processor? as in x86 technology which caustic was talking about. ...o yes a apple processor....again not what Caustic was talking about

 

[adam cool dude]

Originally posted by TheDome
And in that bit u posted where does it say PC processor? as in x86 technology which caustic was talking about. ...o yes a apple processor....again not what Caustic was talking about

I was on about desktop computer components in general as in PC meaning personal computer . Anyway whats so good at having a crippled off the shelf PC component rather than a developed CPU like the emotion engine and the Gekko on the PS2 and GCN which is why i cant understand why your so nit picking at it anyway

 

[Stiff_Cookie]

IMO, MS have always given the consumer what they want. They want a user friendly OS then they release a User friendly OS. Who else has released anything close to Windows? Linux most certainly not.

Like someone said Netscape was poo IE was the bomb.

If MS because the only console maker on the market that says to me that they are a better company than every other console maker and make a better console.

underhand tricks happen all the time in business world MS is not the first nor will it be the last to use dirty tricks.


FOR all intesive purposes a games console is a PC, the difference being you dont have to install games or updates or fiddle with drivers etc.

 

[Caustic]

Originally posted by adam cool dude
I was on about desktop computer components in general as in PC meaning personal computer . Anyway whats so good at having a crippled off the shelf PC component rather than a developed CPU like the emotion engine and the Gekko on the PS2 and GCN which is why i cant understand why your so nit picking at it anyway

My original point was that MS have shown inventiveness and/or creativity and one of the examples I gave was it was the first to use PC components. Yes, many have used common CPU's etc but none have been PC hardware. My point was that nearly all the components were slightly modified PC ones. This I think shows a certain level of inventiveness and/or creativity. Nothing you have said has disproved that.

But I have to laugh at you proving me wrong.

"First of all here is a quote from a article over at gamespy proving that the NES used off the shelf PC components"

Except that it doesn't! Oh yes, have you got a 486, an Athlon or a Pentium? No, I have a NMOS 6502! Is the NMOS 6502 an 80x86 chip? Nope.

As for the GC vs Xbox stats. There have been several different ones floating around from different sources. However, whats most amusing, is the one you link to actually says that the GC and Xbox are very close: "... while Nintendo is roughly even with Microsoft".

As for the Disk Drives in the Nes and N64DD, I don't think they were a fully rewriteable media, like a HD. I can't be bothered to try and find out either.

"Anyway nice proving you wrong"

Indeed it was

CD

 

[Caustic]

Originally posted by Stiff_Cookie
IMO, MS have always given the consumer what they want. They want a user friendly OS then they release a User friendly OS. Who else has released anything close to Windows? Linux most certainly not.

Like someone said Netscape was poo IE was the bomb.

If MS because the only console maker on the market that says to me that they are a better company than every other console maker and make a better console.

underhand tricks happen all the time in business world MS is not the first nor will it be the last to use dirty tricks.

FOR all intesive purposes a games console is a PC, the difference being you dont have to install games or updates or fiddle with drivers etc.

Very very true. MS do give the consumer what they want. They might not get it right the first time, but they keep trying until they do. Underhand tricks are common place, it happens all the time. Business is business as the saying goes, and the computer industry is fast moving and cut throat. It probably always has been and I doubt it will change either.

CD

 

[DirtyBerty]

Microsoft won't monopolise any time soon, if they do eventually well that's life.

But atm they're doing terrible in Japan and the PS2 is still by far the best selling console, xbox is attractive to the geeks who give a damn about image quality/polygons per second/dolby digital etc. but the average Joe still sees PS2 as THE console to own.

If MS focus more on the games line-up with XB2 then Sony may have to start worrying, but even still the Japanese seem intent not to welcome it with open arms so it will be difficult for them to knock Sony off their pedistil.

 

[TheDome]

Except that it doesn't! Oh yes, have you got a 486, an Athlon or a Pentium? No, I have a NMOS 6502! Is the NMOS 6502 an 80x86 chip? Nope.

Exactly what i meant

Anyway whats so good at having a crippled off the shelf PC component rather than a developed CPU like the emotion engine and the Gekko on the PS2 and GCN which is why i cant understand why your so nit picking at it anyway

So what is the real difference between them then. At the end fo the day a processor is a processor. they do the same kind of instructions people just have ever so slight differences in there chip...but they all do the same kind of jobs......and the xbox proves this. Cos i always feel xbox games look better than any other console. so where is it crippled

 

[punky_munky]

It's a frickin games console.