ISIL, ISIS, Daesh discussion thread.

RoboCod said:
Reportedly 7 smaller attacks on the UK have been prevented this year. Seems like good value to me, would you agree?
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Depends if the prevention was actually GCHQs involvement in spying or luck and police passed the details onto them.

Heck if it stops these people keep throwing money at them but I dont think they'll stop the next one :(. They've been banging on about internet spying too much recently for any aspiring pleb to risk using encrypted communication.
 
When I picture the majority of those western recruits, that picture of the young guy dressed in fatigues and the caption "don't worry I'm from the internet springs to mind.

There do however seem to be exceptions, real sociopath types who really look like they are living the dream, so to speak, JJ I surmise was one example.
 
mid_gen said:
I'm not blaming anybody, I'm being realistic. You can't stop a committed terrorist organisation from executing attacks.

The threat of Irish terrorism I grew up with was resolved, and it wasn't through military force, and wasn't through closing the borders and not letting any Irish people in.
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well it was a combination of things, both a political solution and also members of those organisations being heavily recruited as agents to the point where lots of things they did were compromised

unfortunately you're not going to get a political solution with religious fanatics who see other muslims as apostates and want to kill all non muslims in order to form a giant Islamic superstate to take over the world - there really isn't any middle ground there

you can however work with the local population - the Iraqi sunni tribes who have been at best merely ambivalent towards them and in some cases supportive of them(that is how they were able to take so much land so quickly)... that is the fault of the shia govt who marginalised the sunni and refused to work with them - it is also the reason why Obama has been rather restrained in the campaign against ISIS in Iraq, he doesn't want to alienate the sunni minority

Iraq either needs a proper federal solution or it needs to be split up into separate Shia, Sunni and Kurdish states
 
Hitman_Leon said:
When I picture the majority of those western recruits, that picture of the young guy dressed in fatigues and the caption "don't worry I'm from the internet springs to mind.

There do however seem to be exceptions, real sociopath types who really look like they are living the dream, so to speak, JJ I surmise was one example.
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well jihadi john was still more of a PR exercise - he wasn't fighting over there, they didn't want to put him at risk - he was just rolled out for the throat slitting videos
 
Dj_Jestar said:
Funded by private parties within G20 countries != Funded by G20 countries.

Click bait is click bait.
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lazy journalism on the part of the article writer and poor reading comprehension on the part of the poster who linked to it

as for it being 'breaking news' LOL
 
dowie said:
western ISIS recruits are generally soft - some idiot loners from Luton, Birmingham who've played too much call of duty.... some of the seasoned fighters have treated them with complete contempt apparently, they're basically little more than a PR exercise and quite a few of them want to come home
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Hitman_Leon said:
When I picture the majority of those western recruits, that picture of the young guy dressed in fatigues and the caption "don't worry I'm from the internet springs to mind.
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I did face palm a while back when one of the reasons a returnee cited for coming back, was the terrible conditions and lack of toilet paper :o:confused:

Oh boy, what a hardened terrorist fighter you were....:p
 
Apparently France has just invoked a request for support from the EU members.

We have some more detail as France invokes an EU treaty provision requesting mutual assistance from other EU countries.

French Defence Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian said EU partners could help “either by taking part in France’s operations in Syria or Iraq, or by easing the load or providing support for France in other operations.”

“France cannot act alone in these theatres,” Le Drian told fellow EU defence ministers during a meeting in Brussels, according to aides.

France is the first nation to invoke article 42-7 in the treaty, which requires all states to offer aid and assistance “as they are able.”
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http://www.theguardian.com/world/li...overnight-live#block-564b013de4b0e0595dc6c51e
 
Gilly said:
...and then we got the Arab Spring and now we have ISIS.

We don't know what would have happened had the West not intervened, but you can be sure that it would be much more difficult for them to incite so much hatred against us had we not.
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no you can't be sure of that at all

the bali bombings were the result of us stopping a genocide in east timor

the 9/11 attacks were the result of the US having troops in Saudi, at the invitation of Saudi, after their neighbour was invaded by Iraq

the previous Paris shootings were the result of a cartoon

a large portion of Iraqis were quite glad Saddam had gone, they just didn't want western troops hanging around for much longer - the shia wanted to run the place.... the US wanted power sharing... power sharing didn't work out and the marginalisation of the sunni population by the shia allowed ISIS to gain ground rapidly... if we'd left soon after invading and kept a large portion of the population happy as a result you might well have seen ISIS emerge much more rapidly - we'd be in the same mess... if we hadn't invaded then who knows... though it seems unlikely that there wouldn't have been an attempted uprising by now by the shia majority.


Regardless of that none of that would be required for the likes of ISIS to hate us... they hate fellow muslims who don't share their interpretations of Islam, they're conducting mass executions of mostly fellow muslims... they'd hate western non muslims regardless
 
The fanatics that make up the core of ISIS will sooner or later turn on themselves because they need an enemy to focus on. If it's not non-muslims or Muslims who have a different ideological view then it'll eventually be those who make the simplest of errors or break petty laws.
 
Raz said:
The fanatics that make up the core of ISIS will sooner or later turn on themselves because they need an enemy to focus on. If it's not non-muslims or Muslims who have a different ideological view then it'll eventually be those who make the simplest of errors or break petty laws.
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For along as non Mulsims bomb and kill Muslims they will have an enemy and a constant stream of people to replace their martyrs.
 
dowie said:
Regardless of that none of that would be required for the likes of ISIS to hate us... they hate fellow muslims who don't share their interpretations of Islam, they're conducting mass executions of mostly fellow muslims... they'd hate western non muslims regardless
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I don't argue with any of what you say... it's just not particularly relevant.

I wasn't saying that ISIS might not exist (in fact it doesn't exist, it's just an ideology for some extremists) I was saying that ISIS themselves would find it more difficult to stir up hatred against the West had we not gone in guns blazing.
 
Getting fed up with all these statements like oh we should just bomb them harder or put boots on the ground.

The ONLY thing that I can see maybe having any sort of effect on the current situation is withdrawing any and all foreign interests/military/aid from the entire region and leaving it to rot.
 
Gilly said:
I don't argue with any of what you say... it's just not particularly relevant.

I wasn't saying that ISIS might not exist (in fact it doesn't exist, it's just an ideology for some extremists) I was saying that ISIS themselves would find it more difficult to stir up hatred against the West had we not gone in guns blazing.
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then you perhaps missed the point - it was relevant to that - they're killing fellow muslims, it isn't hard for them to stir up hatred against us given they can mass murder muslims in the same region, they already hate us regardless - the fact that some extremists don't like us shouldn't stop us from stepping up to stop a potential genocide... and no we've not gone in all guns blazing - the US has been relatively measured in its response, the UK is only bombing select targets in Iraq but not Syria... France is bombing some targets in Syria
 
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