italian match fixing scandal!
- Thread starter david334
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BoomAM said:
Really? I'd be mighty upset if they win against those teams to progress further along! It takes it away from their games when all you can think of is the fact that they *shouldn't* really be there.
Thats the thing though, they really *should*.greenlizard0 said:
You can sorta see why Juve are good in the league but bad in Europe.
But Milan are awesome in Europe. As proven by our record in the competition over the years.
And admit it or not: We are one of the best sides in Europe, on merit.
I do actually see where Boom is coming from here, granted, the team participated in match fixing in the domestic league and granted that may have helped them get into the CL, but in the end, surely if we are to believe that the match fixing only took place in Serie A then the performances of Milan in the CL are purely based on ability.
And this is coming from an Inter fan.
And this is coming from an Inter fan.
Soldato
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The very fact that they were attempting to fix matches should exclude them from European football since their qualification for the CL is based on potentially dodgy results.
Hmm. With Milan now having -8pts it must see them in with a reasonable chance of qualifying for the Champions League again. So they have come out of this quite well, all things considered.
Regarding Milan being seeded this season, my main man Bert has his site updated promptly as always: http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/seedcl2006.html
So basically there is zero chance of them playing an English team until the group stage. Chelsea probably won't be overly happy as this strengthens the pool of opposition they could potentially face (will be one of Barca, Milan, Madrid, Inter or Valencia, assuming Milan/Valencia qualify)
Regarding Milan being seeded this season, my main man Bert has his site updated promptly as always: http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/seedcl2006.html
So basically there is zero chance of them playing an English team until the group stage. Chelsea probably won't be overly happy as this strengthens the pool of opposition they could potentially face (will be one of Barca, Milan, Madrid, Inter or Valencia, assuming Milan/Valencia qualify)
I've decided I couldn't care less, I'd rather AC were in the CL anyways as it will make it a lot more interesting. 
It doesn't affect me and ultimately, having no loyalty to any big teams, all I want to see is the big players and entertaining games.
It doesn't affect me and ultimately, having no loyalty to any big teams, all I want to see is the big players and entertaining games.
How many people actually have any knowledge of the evidence presented in the case?
I mean, I'm all for throwing the book at them if they're actually all guilty, but the fact is, I have no real idea whether they are or not, and neither, I imagine, do most of you. So I don't see why everyone's throwing around "OMG CHEATERS/FIFA
" comments like they were judges at the trial or something. If one judge decides on a more lenient punishment than another, when presented with the same facts, what makes him/her so obviously less right?
I mean, I'm all for throwing the book at them if they're actually all guilty, but the fact is, I have no real idea whether they are or not, and neither, I imagine, do most of you. So I don't see why everyone's throwing around "OMG CHEATERS/FIFA
" comments like they were judges at the trial or something. If one judge decides on a more lenient punishment than another, when presented with the same facts, what makes him/her so obviously less right?
Again.Dtab said:
Ignorence of the public over here as to what happened.
If they match fixed, why would they match fix a game in which they drew? in a game that didnt matter? Not exactely going to help our league position is it?
And regardless, you've skirted around the issue there. We are good enough for Europe, because we are one of the best in Europe, on merit.
You can argue about the league thing all you want, but the fact of the matter is that we are one of the most consistent teams in Europe at the moment, and unlike Juve who matched fixed themselves a few titles but were bad in Europe, we came a very close second to them in the league with 1 game fixed over several seasons, but were good in Europe.
Thats the difference. If Juve were as good as their league positions suggested, then they'd be doing well in Europe. But they are not.
We are as good as our league positions suggested, because we did well in Europe.
Yes i agree that cheats shouldnt prosper and all that, but considering the evidence against Milan is a game in which we match fixed a draw & a phone call between Leonardo and his mate, i'd hardly class Milan as being worthy being classed as cheaters.
Of course, almost everyone on here wil disagree, and thats fine, everyones free to their opinions. But on the other side, this is my opinion.
It is though.Gilly said:
The asumption is being based that Milan are as guilty as the likes of Juve. When they arnt.
Again, the match fixing for Milan is aparentely just one game, where they drew. Hardly a match fix for helping the team is it?
Regardless.
The decisions have been made, theres nout anyone can do now.
And we are rightfully back where we belong. Imo.
It isn't! You've completely missed the point. As I understand it, 2 people who know more about any of this than you have found AC guilty. This is incontrovertible FACT. This cannot be argued.
There are no assumptions being made here except on your part. You assume that someone is taking the **** when he isn't, he's stating fact.
There are no assumptions being made here except on your part. You assume that someone is taking the **** when he isn't, he's stating fact.
So its fact that Milan arnt good enough for Europe?
Because thats basically what he's saying.
Maybe im reading it wrong, but thats what it implys to me.
You cant match fix your way into Europe with 1 draw.
Let me ask you this, answer honestly, are Milan good enough for Europe?
Because thats basically what he's saying.
That to me implys that Milan only got in Europe because of match fixing.
Maybe im reading it wrong, but thats what it implys to me.
You cant match fix your way into Europe with 1 draw.
Let me ask you this, answer honestly, are Milan good enough for Europe?
ARGH!!! Are you being stupid on purpose to wind me up? You've taken umbrage at one comment that was made that is FACT. It cannot be argued, no matter how you wish it could be.
I don't care whether AC are good enough for Europe. I don't care that they've talked their way back into the CL. I don't even care whether they were guilty or not! But it is plain, honest fact that they've been punished for attempting to fix matches.
Whether they're good enough and were guilty or not is something I'm not willing to talk about. I'm not bothering with it because I've had enough problems with you already over the years and I simply don't care. Thats inconsequential to the point though.
I don't care whether AC are good enough for Europe. I don't care that they've talked their way back into the CL. I don't even care whether they were guilty or not! But it is plain, honest fact that they've been punished for attempting to fix matches.
Whether they're good enough and were guilty or not is something I'm not willing to talk about. I'm not bothering with it because I've had enough problems with you already over the years and I simply don't care. Thats inconsequential to the point though.
tbh I think whats happeneed here is a joke, Milan simply havent been punished in my view.
They didnt win the League so where they finish in the league after that is moot except for CL / euroipean qualification.
If they have ahhad points taken off them and still qulaify for Europe there laughing all the way to the CL. If they are starting next season with minus 8 pts, thats not a great deal to make up, so assuming a fair few things, they could theoretically win the CL and Serie A this season. Wheres the punishment ?
And Boom as for whther they are "awesome" in Europe or not is irrelevant to the discussion.
They didnt win the League so where they finish in the league after that is moot except for CL / euroipean qualification.
If they have ahhad points taken off them and still qulaify for Europe there laughing all the way to the CL. If they are starting next season with minus 8 pts, thats not a great deal to make up, so assuming a fair few things, they could theoretically win the CL and Serie A this season. Wheres the punishment ?
And Boom as for whther they are "awesome" in Europe or not is irrelevant to the discussion.
Do any of you know the evidence presented against Milan? Just incase you don't: In the 2005/06 season, an (ex) Milan offical named Leonardo Meani called the FIGC to complain about a linesmen in one of Milan's previous games. He requested a specific linesman for the next game against Chievo. That linesmen turned up and Milan drew. When you compare this to the evidence against Juventus (kidnapping referees etc.), it really is insignificant.
Were Milan in the wrong? Yes, and I think they deserved to be punished. But the original punishments were far too heavy in my opinion. 44 points taken away last season, with a 15 point deficit and no Champions League in 2006/07? I'm glad the punishment got reduced, especially when you consider the fact that Meani was acting under his own accord and didn't have the backing of the club.
Were Milan in the wrong? Yes, and I think they deserved to be punished. But the original punishments were far too heavy in my opinion. 44 points taken away last season, with a 15 point deficit and no Champions League in 2006/07? I'm glad the punishment got reduced, especially when you consider the fact that Meani was acting under his own accord and didn't have the backing of the club.