Item arrived damaged in Denmark

Soldato
Joined
17 Aug 2009
Posts
18,364
Location
Finchley, London
I've just had a message from someone I sold an item to in Denmark that it's arrived damaged and now I've got to honour my word and send him the money back. :( Not only will I have lost any profit but will be in deficit to the tune of about £120 if he sends it back to me, since I'll have to cover his return postage, plus I already covered some of the postage myself sending it out ( it was £64 insured but I charged him £50 and covered the remainder myself), plus a large roll of bubble wrap, plus about £20 (4%) that paypal took from the proceeds.

I sent it via myparceldelivery.com and DPD were the couriers. I packed it as well as I could in a sturdy 5 mm thick cardboard tube, tons of bubble wrap on the outside, and a load of gaffa tape.

This was his message "Hi,Just unboxed the unit.
Im sad to say that there are two things wrong with the it. The power supply end got shattered along the way. Also, it sounds like there is a loose spring inside the unit which is falling around and rattling up and down. I'm not sure this plays a role when in use but I can't get it to work without power. What should we do from here? Can I send the unit back to you? I wish I had the skills and time to fix this but I don't unfortunately :-(
Sorry for the bad news and thanks for your understanding...

Best wishes.
."

It's a rare vintage spring reverb unit shaped as a drainpipe in a grey plastic shell, an old analogue piece of studio equipment that basically adds reverb to guitars. It worked when I tested it and yes you can hear a spring if you shake it, but I didn't suspect it as broken when I sent it as it can't be seen. Don't remember thinking it was falling around. So I've actually no idea if it got broken in transit or not. The power supply I wrapped in bubble wrap and there was just enough space at one end of the cardboard tube to slot it in. I made a lid by cutting two cardboard circles and gaffa taping it thoroughly over the end. Bubble wrap went over that. I thought it would be sufficient but I guess not.

I need to make a claim as I added up to £500 cover and the sale was £425 plus £50 shipping. Do you think I stand much chance of getting anything back? They say "If your parcel was damaged by the courier, you can claim for the repair cost, or the cost of replacing the item if a repair is not possible. This is available up to the compensation value purchased with your booking. You must be able to prove the value of the item and any repair costs."

I suppose worst case scenario is I get nothing, he sends it back and I can sell it cheap as needing repair to just recoup my losses.

I want to reassure him that I will of course pay him back the £475, and that I will also put in a claim. It might have been easier to ask him if he could get the power supply repaired and I'd cover his costs but the spring seems to complicate it further.
 
You'll get your money back if it was insured, surely?

Who knows? You know what insurance companies are like, any excuse to weazel out. But even regardless of my cynicism, surely it depends on their investigations as to whether they think I packaged it well enough at the end where the power supply was. Also, they might or might not take responsibility for the spring breaking.
 
Thanks guys, I asked him not to return it yet. He sent me these pictures. Seems to me he should at least stick a danish plug on the end and see if it works. For all we know, the crack in the PSU might be superficial. For someone that runs his own recording studio, you'd think he could wire a plug.

I asked him if there's anyone he knows who might be able to quote a repair for him and that I'll cover the cost. He's told me there's a couple of engineers he'll speak to.

Here's the pictures he sent me.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/03ojzzg9tm7vxsq/AACcJ-JjN7FZAts47sMaqM1pa?dl=0
 
Assuming it works that looks perfectly repairable. Worst case would be buy a new plastic housing and drill a couple of holes in it.

Should be able to claim the repair/compensation cost from the delivery company.

Thing is, I don't know if I should ask him to repair it now or even just stick a plug on the end to see if it works, before I've contacted myparceldelivery.com tomorrow and before they've seen it in it's current state.
 
I honestly don't know guys. I don't think he's trying to scam me. It wasn't through ebay, it was via a gear forum.

About my packaging, here's some pics of the unit and the box it went into. At the end where I put the power supply, there was no lid. There was a plastic lid at the other end. So what I did was cut out two cardboard circles the diameter of the tube box and taped them down over the end with plenty of tape and then bubble wrap over that. Do you think that can be considered sufficient or too soft?

http://s4.postimg.org/o26wznw3x/Packaged.jpg


http://s11.postimg.org/6ltly8w77/image.jpg
http://s11.postimg.org/hmor39og3/image.jpg
http://s11.postimg.org/bzse5slxf/image.jpg
http://s29.postimg.org/bpc3wt6mf/image.jpg
http://s29.postimg.org/5mzvskssn/image.jpg
 
Well guys, as I can't start accusing him of scamming, (he might be, might not be, but personally I don't think so and he owns a very nice and expensive studio so my feeling is that he isn't trying it on), then I've done all I can for the time being. I've rung myparceldelivery and they gave me a claims email address. I've sent a detailed email including all the photos I posted here of the unit, plus pics of it packaged on the day of collection, plus the photos he sent me of the damaged PSU, plus screenshots of my paypal invoice and receipt. I also messaged the buyer saying this:

Hi,

Thanks for the photos. I've just spoken to myparceldelivery and they've given me an email address to put a claim in. They want photos so I'll send them the ones you sent me. They said don't fix anything yet until I've heard back from them. However, they said by all means get a quote for a repair. I mentioned the loose spring as well saying that it wasn't loose when I sent it and it was in a thick cardboard tube with no play between the unit and the inside of the box. Obviously we need to be able to power it up first before we know if there's any damage to springs or any damage that would actually affect it working or not, but like I say, there was nothing falling around or loose when I sent it and it worked as it should when I tested it.

If you can bear with me while I wait to hear back from the claims, that would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Regards,


My biggest concern is, even if he gets the PSU working and can power up the unit, it depends whether the main reverb unit itself is working, i.e, if one of the springs has been damaged. It depends on whether myparceldelivery are prepared to accept responsibility and cough up for the whole value of the unit, (over £400), or not. If they don't, and if he says he's not happy with it, I'll then have to send his money back and I'll lose out. I have a bad feeling about this but will try and stay optimistic.
 
Yeah Sinopa, I don't know about that.

Anyway, the latest so far is that I should hear back from the claims department tomorrow or in the next couple of days. Yesterday's email from them:

"Hi,

Thanks for providing these photos.

I have raised this with the courier for you and opened the damage claim with them.
We will aim to advise whether the claim can be progressed within 2 working days.

Kind Regards
"

Meanwhile, my buyer just sent me a copy of a quotation from a qualified studio tech he knows, for repairs to the power supply unit, springs, spare parts and labour which when translated from danish krone to £ comes to £406. He admitted it's on the steep side! Far as I'm concerned, if myparceldelivery accept complete responsibility and pay for that quote, then he gets a fully working unit, doesn't have to send it back, and everyone is happy. Just need to see what they're going to say and hope they don't just want to pay for the PSU. Guess I should call them tomorrow and give them that quote?
 
There's a few odd things about the smashed plug photo.

The flex grip is still intact. How did the cable get free?

That type of fibre flex grip has a flat surface and yet the cable has rib pressure marks caused by a different type of plastic grip.

Both the brown and blue wires are attached to a plug pin. But the live wire screw connector attached to the fuse holder has no wire connected. It looks to me like the plug is wired to earth and neutral.

Having had time to look closer you're right. I can't understand how those wires are still connected to the pins and yet the cable is free of the plug and plastic grip while the plastic grip is still screwed down. I should ask him. I wonder what he'd say to that. And yes, none of the photos show the other side of the plug with my blue writing in permanent ink. Regarding the 3 amp fuse, I've no idea. If mine had a 3 amp fuse in a 13 amp plug, well, it worked anyway in the time I had it and I never changed any fuses that I remember.
 
So how do I proceed from here, chaps? If the courier service is happy to pay for everything, then fine. If not, do I mention to the courier service that it looks like it's been tampered with and let them accuse or question him about it on my behalf?
 
i wouldnt tell them your concerns, it will just result in them refusing to pay out to you and then you will be out of pocket.

File your claim and see if they knock it back. If successful, up to you whether you want to push it further with your buyer.

Yep, I have no intention of mentioning any suspicions yet. Only if they refuse to pay out.
 
Not sure I agree with that seeing as your'e being scammed.

As far as I'm concerned, this is a lot of hassle and possible loss of around £100 out of my pocket, aside from refunding him. I want the path of least resistance. Unless they point blank refuse to pay out, there's no point in telling them I'm being scammed otherwise as Greebo said, I'd be out of pocket. And as dodgy as it looks, there is no actual proof it's a scam.
 
Here's the latest guys. After a lot of chasing up the courier service, I got this email today

"Hi,

My sincere apologies for the inconvenience caused.

Unfortunately, I would have to advise on this occasion I'm not able to process your claim.

Unfortunately, this is due to the packaging the item was sent in was not sufficient to protect the items in transit.

Our terms and conditions state that we shall not accept liability on any damage claims where the packaging does not comply with our packaging guidelines. As a minimum each parcel should be in a new, undamaged cardboard box that is strong enough to carry the weight of the goods, the goods should not touch any side of the box and must be cushioned using internal packaging that is of at least 5 centimetres thick all over. This can be bubble wrap or foam.

In order to make any booking with myParcelDelivery.com you are required to confirm your understanding and agreement to these terms by "ticking" the appropriate box.

I have however arranged for your postage costs to be refunded as a good will gesture

This will be processed within 5 working days


Kind Regards,
"

So the only consolation is the postage cost. I've emailed him to ask it's the full amount I paid including insurance of £63. I'll have to refund the buyer £475 plus his return postage of the item back to me which will probably be another £50. The £63 refund certainly softens the blow a bit. I'll be about £80 to £90 out of pocket when all said and done and then I'll have to see who will buy it cheap off me so I can at least recoup my losses. As it happens, I have someone else who is interested, in the UK! I ain't sending stuff anymore, certainly not abroad! :p


I paid £18 paypal fee on receipt of the money from him. Does this mean I 'll have to cover the same fee for him when I refund him?

The biggest question now is, do I tell him they've refused compensation?

Or do I confront him and ask how the red wire is wired to the wrong pin instead of the fuse terminal, and how the wires are still attached to pins yet the flex grip is still screwed down. What kind of response might he come back with though? There might be a perfectly legit reason he'll come back with?
 
Too many different opinions on here as to what to do, I'm none the wiser :p

It wasn't sold on ebay, it was someone on a well established gear forum. At the end of the day, he can get Paypal to intervene. I think I'll at least ask him why the plug is the way it is without getting nasty and too finger pointing about it, and see what he says. I'll then have to take it from there.
 
Alright guys, so the buyer messaged me 3 days ago and I only noticed his message today. He was just asking if there's any news. I'm going to send him this, the wording based mostly on one of the replies here. Is it good, too accusational sounding, should I alter anything or just send it?

Hi Xxxxx,

Apologies, I only just noticed your message! I'll chase them up again.

Something that's been on my mind however that I'm confused about and wanted to ask you. Looking at your photos, I'm just trying to figure out some odd things about the smashed plug.

The flex grip with the two small screws is still intact, so how did the cable get free?

That type of fibre flex grip has a flat surface and yet the cable has rib pressure marks caused by a different type of plastic grip.

Also, both the brown and blue wires are attached to a plug pin. But the live wire screw connector attached to the fuse holder has no wire connected. It looks to me like the plug is wired to earth and neutral. Just doesn't make any sense to me.

Any ideas on that?

Cheers,"
 
Right, I've made a couple of adjustments and just this moment sent it. Feeling a bit nervous now. :p

Hi Xxxx,

Apologies, I only just noticed your message! I'll chase them up again.

Some things that have been on my mind however that I'm confused about and wanted to ask you. I hope you don't mind. I've shown your photos to some colleagues, and we're trying to figure out some odd things about the smashed plug.

The flex grip with the two small screws is still intact, so how did the cable get free?

That type of fibre flex grip has a flat surface and yet the cable has rib pressure marks caused by a different type of plastic grip.

Also, both the brown and blue wires are attached to a plug pin. Yet the live wire screw connector attached to the fuse holder has no wire connected. The plug is wired wrongly to earth and neutral and so obviously the unit wouldn't power up if the plug was plugged in. But it was working when plugged in before it was sent meaning the brown wire would have been connected to the fuse holder pin. Doesn't make sense.

Is there blue writing on the other side of the plug?

Even with some hard knocks to the box during transit, it takes a considerably large force, I dunno, like a hammer I guess, to shatter a plug like that.

Any ideas on those points?

Cheers,
"
 
I'm not sure about the suggestions of posting on that gear forum, at least, not until I've heard back from him. Also, I've checked his profile there and he last posted there quite a long time ago. I've seen his website and he runs a very nice studio and seems to be a very busy person recording various artists in denmark. How much impact posting on the forum would make I don't know and perhaps might make things messier.

The questions about the plug need to be asked. If he's genuine and not scamming you he should have no issue with your questions.

Were you sent pictures of the packaging? If that plug was destroyed during the shipping the packing would have been crushed / ripped open. Why would he sign for and accept the parcel?

It's a good point and no I wasn't sent any pics other than those four pics of the plug.
 
Last edited:
They can send you angry letters from a 'debt collection' agency demanding you pay the money, but you can safely ignore those.

Paypal are so quick to take money from you and leave you in the dust that if they actually took you to court to get the money, they'd just lose anyway, especially in this case.

So I can expect debt collectors letters and risk paypal not allowing me to use them again for all my future purchases? Just what I need.
 
No, hard plastic. It was basically a sealed drainpipe with some circuitry and springs inside.

so after 2 months of people helping you out your just going to bend over.
OP send me £500 too.

Don't be silly now. I've appreciated the help enormously and followed a lot of the advice here so far. Based on what people have said about the plug and their suspicions, that's exactly what I've now put to him. As far as Fuzz telling me what I should have asked, I asked on page 2 if there is anything I needed to alter before I send and no one answered. So with a couple of revisions I sent it anyway.

I've done what feels right to me up to this point. Closing my paypal account may or may not be the right thing to do, but personally it doesn't sit right with me, and I really don't want to risk debt collections, bad credit scores and not being able to use paypal again. At the end of the day, I'll be out of pocket by only about £90 and then I'll sell it on cheaper and will recoup my losses. All I really then lose is profit which is unfortunate. I'll just have to wait and see what he says now.
 
Back
Top Bottom