I've given up on LPG - the future is Electric.

[Hawk Tuah]

My issue at the moment is that I wouldn't be confident in being able to just pull up at any major services and be able to roll into a free charging station.

Motorway charging points aren't free. They're £6 a go. An EV is not a cheap way of doing motorway journeys. It's either the same, or possibly more expensive than an efficient ICE.

PS - I don't know if you have to pay for the Tesla superchargers. But if you're thinking of buying a Tesla, you're not buying a car to save money.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Automatic charging would be good. Maybe something like bumper cars, high voltage exposed wire with a open lattice incredibly dangerous live metal mesh low ceiling so when you reverse the metal rod touches the ceiling and starts charging.

When you get to a fuel station, do you sit in the car and beep the horn until an attendant comes to 'fill her up'?

How much effort do you think it is plugging a car in when you get home?

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Ha ha. When you return from holiday to find you car has gone, as it's driven itself to a charger.

I'd have thought it would be easier to make the chargers semi mobile. Some kind of sky crane setup, where it could traverse a section of the car park - rather than moving the cars themselves.

Of course, it would be easier to just employ people to do it. But then I guess a robot can't go on strike for weeks on end. Maybe Tesla should be working on driverless trains.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

how would that be easier, teslas come with all the hardware to self drive, and can park themselfs, a much easier solution, with little cost. you can even summon a tesla so wouldnt even need to go walking through the car park, or can just have your location shown on the app.

what also will be interesting is now CCS is rolling out 400kw chargers, what suercharger v3 will offer and any car announcements to produce a car that can charge anywhere near that rate. The faraday future car can charge (supposedly) at 400kw.

I suppose EVs with bigger the batteries will have more cells, so the amount of current per cell would be the same as existing EVs.

The VW bus concept has a 101kw battery - 4 time the size of my Nissan, so I'd expect it to be able to take 4 x the current and charge at a similar rate.

Maybe it's just the way my brain works. Simple solutions for simple problems.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

There's lease deals for £500 down and £140 a month on these for 8k mileage

Really tempting, busy doing a spreadsheet on savings made vs keeping the A4

It is tempting (and I coulddn't resist). Just don't get mis'sold the fact that it'll do 100+ miles on one charge.

Although, the 2018 model is even more tempting.... http://carslane.com/2018-nissan-leaf/

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Being given an E63 AMG tomorrow... does that ruffle and jimmies in here?

If I was given any decent car, and didn't have to pay the fuel myself - I'd be over the moon.

Oh, and your AMG is probably more fuel efficient than my other car.

Edit,

Just curious, but is that a gift from mummy and daddy, or is that a company car. I've never known a company give away cars like that, even for senior directors - the tax would be massive. Or do you work at a dealership?

 

[Hawk Tuah]

...who's going to put up all those lovely new nuclear power plants we'll need?

The Chinese.

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...nese-firm-to-submit-essex-nuclear-plant-plans

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Yep, diminishing returns is the problem. You can't just add more and more batteries to increase range. Because friction becomes a bigger and bigger energy sucker.

There is a sweet spot which won't improve until batteries become lighter or better at storing energy. Once they crack that (and they will eventually), they will replace petrol/diesel.

Some day in the future? You mean now then.

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-ne...0-on-sale-for-18k-range-pictures-and-details/

 

[Hawk Tuah]

No, he means some day in the future.

Renault / LG have doubled the capacity, yet it fits in exactly the same space. 200 mile range for £18000.

50% capacity increase in a couple of years. Some people are never satisfied.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Possible silly question.

But, How do EV's keep De-frosted, De-Misted and internally warm under current weather conditions?

Heating and AC, same as other cars. In fact it's quicker than an ICE as you dont have to wait for the engine to warm up. However the heating uses energy. Hence why range is worse in cold weather.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

They use a heat pump powered by the battery.



Range is worse in cold weather because the battery holds less charge when it's cold. Turn AC off in winter and range doesn't improve by much; the actual power used by the AC system is fairly negligible in the context of the size of these batteries. Many models now have AC for the battery as it has an overall positive effect on range.

If it was the AC system dropping range by a third then you'd expect a similar drop during hot weather, as the AC system will be working just as hard (of not harder) to keep the cabin cool. The real impact is <5 miles on my 22kWh Zoe.

My app says <5 miles, however in car it usually says ~8 miles on a full charge.

Either way, it comes from battery power.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

I currently driving an R56 MINI Cooper S in London. I cover no more than 8,000 miles a year max.

I've been making a real effort over the years to be more green which was the main motive behind booking an extended test drive of the Nissan Leaf from Tuesday until Sunday next week. I'm sceptical of the actual green credentials though:
- What happens with the battery when its eol?
- Most electricity is still generated from fossil fuels
- The car has a higher carbon footprint when manufactured than the typical ICE.

For the reasons above I wonder whether it's more green to keep running my MINI.

I've also been looking at insurance quotes and there is no EV (Zoe, Leaf, Ioniq) I can insure for under £950 . Most ICE cars are much cheaper for me to insure considering my age, NCB and post code (London). Am I missing something?

Do you use your car mainly for regaularly travelling in and around london, or occcasionally travelling out of london.

If it's the former, then electric should be ideal as long as you have a driveway, or a charging post that's not otherwise being used nearby.

If it's just for occasional long journeys, I'd stick ICE for now until the longer range EVs come out.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

To and from work in west London with the occasional 122 mile journey to family home. I have a driveway but we're renting and I begrudge wasting the free fast charger install on a rented property. I could get a charger installed at work with minimal fuss.

It's not the right time for me to be getting a new car, but I'm dead set that my next car will not be ICE.

I haven't bothered with a fast charger, I just installed an external socket. The car fully charges overnight - which is as fast as I will use it.

Check the route to your family home. If there is a rapid charger mid route, then EV will work fine.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

I would only recommend an EV to someone who is capable of planning their route carefully - signing up to all of the fast charger suppliers, and remembering their login details, downloading the apps / getting their RFID cards.

EVs are exceptionally practical, but they're not quite as simple as just jump in, drive where you want, fill up on the way.

Nissan will allow you a 4 day test drive with a Leaf, so I'd suggest they try that first to see if it suits their needs.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

"B" never travels more than 40 miles/day. I do not anticipate this changing much (Or at all) so route planning is unlikly to be an issue.

I got that - but 'never' is quite unlikely. What if she want's to go on holiday and has to drive to the airport, or something you can't expect. When she realises she can't use her car (and I presume it will be her only car), she'll be venting her frustration on you for recommending it. It might work, but if she has a test drive, tests it out and likes it, then that takes the weight off your shoulders.

Neither of them even has a smartphone (and by that, I mean they're not the type of person to HAVE a smartphone).

All motorway fast chargers work using the Electric Highway app from Ecotricity.
All the Local Council chargers near me use Charge Your Car (which you need to subscribe to, and pay for a RFID card).
All Council chargers in Essex are Charge Point Genie, which you access through a website, and have to get £10 credit for before you can use.
Most chargers in London are Source London - which you need to register to.
Most the chargers I've found in Sussex are Polar, which is a subscription service.

And that's just my local area. It's not like pulling up to a service station, filling up and paying. There is a lot of pre-planning required.


Batteries - depends on the car. I own my batteries, so no rental or anything daft like that. In fact, I think Nissan have just announced that you can now buy the batteries outright on their cars that have a battery lease.

Not certain about the Zoe. The older ones might all be 'rented' batteries. The model out this year you have the option to own or rent.

Insurance - my insurance is more than the TT I was driving, but then the estimated value of the TT was a less than half. Until I get my full year renewal I don't know the exact difference.

Servicing - same as any car. On my trip computer it's got the service intervals (actually exactly the same as our 2005 Nissan). My next service is due at 16000. The last service was at 8000.

They're tax free, and will remain tax free after the forthcoming change (in fact, both my cars are tax free )

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Plug it in to check the battery and update software, check brakes, clean it.

I expect it's short as the tech is new and the battery has a long warranty, so they're erring on the side of caution. Plus need to make some money on them.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

For those of you with a leaf.

https://cleantechnica.com/2016/01/19/3rd-party-nissan-leaf-battery-pack-upgrades-doubling-to-48-kwh/

Not sure it would be worth shipping mine over there.

However, as they get out of warranty, I'm sure there will be 3rd party upgrades and hacks available for them - even in the uk. In a few years I might be interested. But then I might also have my eyes on a 60kw leaf.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

The possibility of lithium catching fire in a crash is hardly any different to any other form of fuel currently used - with perhaps the exception of diesel.

It's hardly any reason not to use them - I mean, lets face it, most of us risk a lithium battery in our trouser pockets all day long.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Some garage in Sheffield. Traveled a long way, and didn't hang around long.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

I bet that gets very boring very quickly

Yes, but you get to learn the capabilities whilst doing it. How far 'can I make it' and what you have to do to achieve it.

Then you end up just driving it like a normal, effortless, well equipped comfortable car, whilst never visiting a petrol station, with the added confidence of knowing you could go a bit further if required.