jeremy clarkson v the mail and mirror
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Why not?
If someone goes "Hey, hold on, that sounded like ******, let's reshoot"
You wouldn't be tempted to intentionally use it to annoy the PC twerp who said you must reshoot?
You're not saying it as a slight against black people, it's just a word in that instance. Racism is only racism if it's directed by discrimination and hatred, he wasn't calling over the Nigerian soundman and asking him to shine his shoes now was he?
Personally I think the fact white folk get so offended about it to be counter productive in race relations.
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Exactly right. It's quite clever when you think about it, because what they've done is taken a word that was used by whites against them, and made it into a blacks only word.
Is the soundman from nigeria?
For over ten years me and the wife used to holiday three times a year at Mnarani Club in Kenya. We used to go out on a dhow trip (lobster lunch, snorkel etc) with Captain Issa (Jesus in Muslim Culture) and his crew. His leading hand, Maxwell was a particular friend of mine and used to ask me many questions about the world. One time on 5th November we were out and I was telling him the rhyme “Remember, remember the 5th of November, gunpowder, treason and plot” which he found interesting. I was telling him about the changes to the English (British) Monarchy and in particular that the current Royal Family descends from German Royalty and they had changed their family name during the 1st world war. I was telling him how Tanzania (then Tanganyika), Namibia, Togo etc had been Germany colonies and that they too “changed hands” after the war. The next day whilst he was preparing the dhow on the beach he asked me where Namibia and Togo were. I drew a large map in the sand and started with Kenya going anticlockwise, showing Tanzania, Mozambique etc, when I got around to West Africa I was pointing out Niger saying that many English people pronounce it “Nigh – Ger” others Nee-jer” then I said “Here is Nigeria the most populous country in Africa”. He looked at me and asked “Is that where the N****** come from?” I was absolutely dumbstruck. I immediately said, that’s not a word to be used. The wife shot off her sun bed to sort the two of us out, saying to Max “Other people can hear what you are saying”. He just gave her an innocent stare.
Now here was a guy from Kenya (Bajuni Tribe) in his mid twenties and he’d never learned that the “N” word was insulting and derogatory. I just hope that nowhere in his past someone had made such a remark to him who is one of the most kind hearted people I have ever met anywhere in the world. After the telling off from wife, we never spoke about it again so I never discovered how he had learned the word in the first place.
I too remember the nursery rhyme and as children would use to decide who would bat or ball first etc. (please bear in mind that I was born on the Somerset Levels where we didn’t have electricity (TV etc) until I was ten and the only person I saw with a dark skin was when a Sikh would walk the roads trying to sell silk garments from a suitcase (probably a multimillionaire by now).
I don’t think that Clarkson should be sacked especially if he makes an apology.
I didn't read the Slope Joke, thank goodness.
Now here was a guy from Kenya (Bajuni Tribe) in his mid twenties and he’d never learned that the “N” word was insulting and derogatory. I just hope that nowhere in his past someone had made such a remark to him who is one of the most kind hearted people I have ever met anywhere in the world. After the telling off from wife, we never spoke about it again so I never discovered how he had learned the word in the first place.
I too remember the nursery rhyme and as children would use to decide who would bat or ball first etc. (please bear in mind that I was born on the Somerset Levels where we didn’t have electricity (TV etc) until I was ten and the only person I saw with a dark skin was when a Sikh would walk the roads trying to sell silk garments from a suitcase (probably a multimillionaire by now).
I don’t think that Clarkson should be sacked especially if he makes an apology.
I didn't read the Slope Joke, thank goodness.
Soldato
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I don't think it has anything to do with empowerment and there is certainly nothing clever about it. It's used by the black community equally as a term of disparagement and endearment depending on the social class of the speaker.
I would argue that far from rehabilitating the term, they've entrenched it as a descriptive term for poor urban blacks. They aren't really using it in a positive context.
Soldato
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What are the official words to that rhyme anyway? he is just reciting lyrics like if you were singing a dodgy crap hiphop tune.
Well my black friends disagree with you. I'll take their word over yours any day. It's not just poor urban blacks either, blacks of all societal stripes use the term amongst themselves.
Soldato
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Like it or not, the slope joke was a technically a Good Joke, fitting into the realms of Pun, Reframing and Timing. For example, I could draw a single panel comic titled 'looking through a chink in the curtains' and come to much the same conclusion. Does such a joke reveal my underlying racism and intolerant attitudes towards Asian people? Balls to that, it's just a witty, reframing pun. Take it or leave it, deal with it, move on.
Simularly, I watched the first episode of Archer last night which I have heard talk about, but I could not get past how much of a douche the main protagonist is. I was offended by his actions, unlike for example Eric Cartman from South Park who is a loveable douche. That said, just because I don't get it, I know other people do, and that's totally fine. I am not outraged by it just because it doesn't sit right with me. Deal. Move on. Get on with your life.
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Your point falls flat when you un-ignore the entire point that you've been ignoring all along: that it is offensive to use such words.
Hmmm it wasn't a 'good' joke
Soldato
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Whether or not you find it funny, the format fits perfectly into the scientific realm of joke creation. Believe it or not, some people like things you don't and vice versa and that's ok.
Bull. Words only have the power you give them. It is only offensive if you are offended, and that is your problem not the tellers. Do people watch popular gore horror films because they support mass murder and gruesome limb decapitation.* Course not, the shock value is entertaining. Just because there exist some people who actually have been tortured does not devalue the source material and does not make people who like or produce it mass murders.
*in before the wah wah straw man posters
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lol.
Yeah, that'll wash. Call someone a **** and when they react, just say "It's only words. Get over it."
See how far you get with that and report back.
And that was my opinion saying it wasn't a good joke
Don't agree with that. I served time in the R.A.F. and I attended a course where we discussed things like sexism, racism and general bigotry. We were told that when we speak to someone, it's not how it's given that is important but how it is received. In other words, you could say the same sexist remark to two women. One might laugh it off, so no harm done. The other could take offence which means you're now in trouble if they report you.
So you've basically got it back to front. It is the tellers problem.
BBC Article
This doesn't look good for him.
This doesn't look good for him.
Soldato
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Irony not lost
You are correct it is funny to dissect a joke, but humour is no less susceptible to academic dissection than documentaries are. Calling someone a star-star-star-star would, in all probability, not be a joke unless in a very specific set of circumstances. It is neither a pun, nor reframing, nor timed nor anything else for that matter. You appear to be blurring the lines of fantasy and reality and failing to draw a line between a joke, and being a douche.
Again, when is the workplace good timing for reframed humour except in very particular understood circumstances. It is real life, not a television show, not a comedy gig, not an entertainer. Again you appear to be confusing the real life office douche bag who thinks he's a comedian, with somebody who's job it is to make jokes.
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Ridiculous. Where has the ability to talk how you want in the privacy of where ever you are. It's not like he did it LIVE or he did it publicly. If you followed around everyone and berated them for everything that ever came out of their mouth that was offensive, then we'd be scared to talk.
Seriously, there must be two or three high up exec's in the papers that have it in for him, and allowed this to be published. It's ridiculous. Utterly ridiculous.
Seriously, there must be two or three high up exec's in the papers that have it in for him, and allowed this to be published. It's ridiculous. Utterly ridiculous.