Job offer, is this normal practice

chroniclard

chroniclard

chroniclard

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Applied for a local job on a whim, ended up being offered the job but question on the salary offer.

I said I was on X and wanted Y to move. They came back offering Z, which is around about the middle(bit less) between X and Y.

I assume it's expected to go back with something like 'no, give moar'... I have not moved jobs that often so not sure.

It's a senior software developer role, if that makes any difference.
 
Depends how badly you want the job. Normally when you say you want Y, it is higher than what you expect to get so there is room for them to 'knock it down'.

Could always say yes to Z if they agree to Y in 6 months when specific KPIs are reached?
 
As above, i thought it was quite the norm to "overstate" your salary but not take the ****. That way when they come back with a counteroffer it's still more than what you're on/what you set your expectation to.
 
chroniclard said:
I said I was on X and wanted Y to move. They came back offering Z, which is around about the middle(bit less) between X and Y.

I assume it's expected to go back with something like 'no, give moar'... I have not moved jobs that often so not sure.
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It's not "expected" per se as most candidates don't ask conversely most hiring managers do keep something in reserve in case a candidate does ask for more so yes, you should always try to ask for more.*

SideWinder said:
Depends how badly you want the job. Normally when you say you want Y, it is higher than what you expect to get so there is room for them to 'knock it down'.

Could always say yes to Z if they agree to Y in 6 months when specific KPIs are reached?
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Bad advice, don't compromise initially, no harm in asking for more regardless of how badly you want the job. The compromise can perhaps come if you're knocked back when asking for more but initially you should simply ask for more money and not complicate it.


*plucked this from google as an example just now but have seen similar variations of this reported plenty of times:
https://business-review.eu/business...ore-money-at-the-interview-for-the-job-202732
Less than half of job candidates negotiate their salary at the interview, even though the amount offered by the company can usually be increased by up to 25 percent. Even fewer negotiate extra-wage benefits, according to the latest BestJobs survey.

Almost a quarter of employers say that less than 10 percent of interviewees negotiate the salary they are offered, while nearly 40 percent say that between 10 percent and 50 percent of those interviewed do so. Only one in ten recruiters say that the percentage of candidates negotiating their salary is between 75 and 100 percent.

However, over six out of ten employers say the salary offered to a candidate is negotiable. For the most part (56.6 percent), recruiters say that the amount offered can be negotiated up to 25 percent. And for nearly one in ten employers, the candidate can negotiate for more than 25 percent over the amount offered. However, about three out of ten recruiters argue that there is no bargaining margin.
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In conclusion, always ask for more, because most of the time more is available!
 
dowie said:
It's not "expected" per se as most candidates don't ask conversely most hiring managers do keep something in reserve in case a candidate does ask for more so yes, you should always try to ask for more.*



Bad advice, don't compromise initially, no harm in asking for more regardless of how badly you want the job. The compromise can perhaps come if you're knocked back when asking for more but initially you should simply ask for more money and not complicate it.


*plucked this from google as an example just now but have seen similar variations of this reported plenty of times:
https://business-review.eu/business...ore-money-at-the-interview-for-the-job-202732


In conclusion, always ask for more, because most of the time more is available!
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Agree with that /grittedteethemoji

I'd add that you might be able to form a better idea of where their thinking at by assessing:-
Whether they indicated a salary range
Whether they indicated a range of experience they were considering, and where you fit in that
What the salary is for similar jobs/similar candidates.

I agree with dowie about not automatically "meeting them halfway", but I agree with sidewinder about possibly agreeing an increase after probation/on delivery of kpis etc
 
garnett said:
I agree with dowie about not automatically "meeting them halfway", but I agree with sidewinder about possibly agreeing an increase after probation/on delivery of kpis etc
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My stance is that you can fall back to that position, seems silly to go with that initially and negotiate your way out of a raise that might have otherwise been given.

The data is there, most people have more money to give so no need to complicate it in most cases, just ask for more initially.
 
Aight, seems good advice. Just an informal offer at the moment via email while they sort the paperwork for a formal offer letter. Will see what that contains and possibly the benefits included before replying. :)

Although they literally want me to resign straight away which I am not prepared to do and leave my current company in the lurch before Christmas so some negotiation on that as well!
 
chroniclard said:
Although they literally want me to resign straight away which I am not prepared to do and leave my current company in the lurch before Christmas so some negotiation on that as well!
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As in resigning before they've even agreed on a formal offer + contract?

Or were you looking to delay it a bit beyond that? Like surely you have a notice period regardless?

Personally, I'd use their keenness to move forward as a reason for them to reach an agreement asap and get that contract out to you, there will be plenty of people looking for jobs in Jan/Feb anyway*, it's the best time of year to move so it shouldn't leave your company in the lurch even if you only have 1 month's notice and hand it in in say a week's time.


*Lots of employers/hiring managers have new budgets then + plenty of employees will receive their annual bonuses around that time of year (and will delay looking for a new job until they've been paid).
 
dowie said:
As in resigning before they've even agreed on a formal offer + contract?

Or were you looking to delay it a bit beyond that? Like surely you have a notice period regardless?

Personally, I'd use their keenness to move forward as a reason for them to reach an agreement asap and get that contract out to you, there will be plenty of people looking for jobs in Jan/Feb anyway, it's the best time of year to move so it shouldn't leave your company in the lurch even if you only have 1 month's notice and hand it in in say a week's time.
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Yeah I have a fairly normal months notice, however in the offer they want me to start mid January so pretty much resign asap. I just cant do that really in good conscience. I will be asking for a Feb start I think.
 
Always assume when you move jobs that your salary won't ever increase once you start the new role. It's a good assumption because often actually occurs, or at least tends to rise barely with inflation whilst they give a million and one excuses as to why... On that basis you don't disappoint yourself because you go in with an amount you are happy to move on. Always aim high, be bold and don't back down. It's literally the main way we get pay rises these days so use the opportunity well.
 
I got a linkedin message about a job yesterday and they want to talk today. I asked about the salary and I got back, and I quote: "Thank you. I got it. There is no budget indicated for this role. It is open to discussion"

This annoys me as there is always a range. If I went through all the discussions etc. and said my expectation was 250k a year and they suddenly were all "oh that's more than we had in mind" it frustrates me, as it's extremely rare for a company to have zero budget indicated when hiring.
 
randomshenans said:
I got a linkedin message about a job yesterday and they want to talk today. I asked about the salary and I got back, and I quote: "Thank you. I got it. There is no budget indicated for this role. It is open to discussion"

This annoys me as there is always a range. If I went through all the discussions etc. and said my expectation was 250k a year and they suddenly were all "oh that's more than we had in mind" it frustrates me, as it's extremely rare for a company to have zero budget indicated when hiring.
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Yeah as you say, not having a range means they could have a really low budget and are afraid of putting off candidates, or a decent budget but don't want to spend it all if possible. I'd probably bluntly reply and say your salary expectations are X, if they can meet that then you're open for discussion.

I guess the flip side is they call your bluff and say yes that's fine without knowing what the client actually wants to pay for the role.
 
If they are not upfront about even a basic salary range then tell them politely that you look forward to speaking to them when they do, goodbye. Simple as that. I have no time for these pimps when they talk BS.
 
Thank you @dowie for adding the extra information regarding my post, do appreciate it. :)

I'll be in a situation in January where I believe I'll be offered less than I am worth so will be taking this onboard. At the end of the day, all they can do is say 'no' and then I know what I need to do next.
 
randomshenans said:
I got a linkedin message about a job yesterday and they want to talk today. I asked about the salary and I got back, and I quote: "Thank you. I got it. There is no budget indicated for this role. It is open to discussion"

This annoys me as there is always a range. If I went through all the discussions etc. and said my expectation was 250k a year and they suddenly were all "oh that's more than we had in mind" it frustrates me, as it's extremely rare for a company to have zero budget indicated when hiring.
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I had sort of the opposite the other day. I asked what the salary was. The lady I was speaking to didn't seem to know, so I said I need a minimum of x. She looked really surprised and quickly said, oh yeah that'll be no problem. So I think I undershot.
 
@SideWinder no worries, yeah always worth asking. Also watch out as recruiters often try to narrow you down to a figure before the offer stage, their motivation is to close the deal quickly, you should still be able to find a reason to ask for more though. :)

dirtychinchilla said:
I had sort of the opposite the other day. I asked what the salary was. The lady I was speaking to didn't seem to know, so I said I need a minimum of x. She looked really surprised and quickly said, oh yeah that'll be no problem. So I think I undershot.
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Who was the lady though? The recruiter? (that would be worrying) Someone from the firm/team interviewing you for the role?
 
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