Jury Service

dowie · 24 Jul 2019 at 07:04

The guy was an idiot:

He is understood to have told officials that he was incapable of sitting down for long periods and that he was unable to concentrate. However, when he was told that he would need to provide a valid medical certificate, Grimes said that he was generally unfit and would not attend.

Why claim something medical that you can't actually back up?

I'd assume (and at least hope) that anyone with conflicting or unconventional views would be dismissed - I mean if we still had the death penalty for example then a sincere belief (whether religious or otherwise) that it was wrong and a statement that you could never participate in potentially sending someone to their death ought to be sufficient.

Likewise there are people who are opposed philosophically to prison in general or with very limited exceptions - can they be trusted to act impartially when a custodial sentence is likely given a guilty verdict? Some people hate the police, some people love the police and hate criminals some people have extreme political views...

There must be any number of beliefs that could be expressed that would render someone wholly unsuitable for service as a juror - surely if someone either declares a sincerely held belief in advance or (if it is rejected) makes sure to turn up as required and makes that belief know then they've not done anything wrong.

I mean to take an extreme example - say someone is called to a grooming gang trial.... they then declare they're a fan of Tommy Robinson and have liked various dubious social media pages and are super excited to make sure the islamo-paedos get sent down etc... I'd suspect they'd be sent home and not invited back.

esoteric · 24 Jul 2019 at 07:09

I had no part in this I'm clean. I encouraged people to do Jury service your Honour.

ahar · 24 Jul 2019 at 07:40

My wife is a contractor and lost more than £1k in earnings thanks to a full 2 weeks of jury service recently. Maybe she shouldn't have turned up, we'd have been better off!

dowie · 24 Jul 2019 at 07:54

600 a day is fairly standard for IT contractors in London, that’s potentially 6 grand lost before whatever token expenses they pay out. I wouldn’t be surprised if someone in that situation would just not turn up/get themselves a 1k fine instead.

peterwalkley · 24 Jul 2019 at 07:58

OCUK forums quoting newspapers: 3,750,122
Newspapers quoting OCUK forums: 1

My jury service (about 20 years ago) was similar to others' experience - mostly waiting around and I think it was only 3/4 days doing stuff. I'd certainly not attempt to get out of it if asked again.

My wife did it a year or so ago and was needed pretty much the whole two weeks. It was an unpleasant case - child sexual abuse. She had sleepless nights for quite a while afterwards and I think would cite that if ever asked again.

Akagi · 24 Jul 2019 at 08:03

Greebo said:
So where are these tips and advice for avoiding jury service then? I thought this was a computer forum?

Its like, 40% not a computer forum. I rarely post in the computery sections anymore.

Pawnless Endgame · 24 Jul 2019 at 08:06

Terminal_Boy said:
I was really looking forward to my Jury Service when I was called up in the mid 2000s, but it was something of a let down.

Sat in a waiting room for the first week. Second week I was selected and sworn in for a murder case only for another jury member to declare that they knew to the defendant and we all got sent home.

Similar here but in 2012. 120 people waiting in a hot room that was designed for 20 people. A hotbed for viruses and bugs. Then I spent the next 2.5 weeks in bed due to a chest infection that I caught from one of the others

darkgen · 24 Jul 2019 at 08:12

Feek said:
Strange comment on that article. I’ve always advocated jury service as being really interesting and suggested people do it rather than try and get out of it and I’m not the only one who follows that line.

But I suppose these hack journalists will always twist things to appear how they want.

Wow; the original jury service thread in GD has been deleted! It was there yesterday and rather disappointingly contained zero tips.

Megahurtz400 · 24 Jul 2019 at 08:29

darkgen said:
Wow; the original jury service thread in GD has been deleted! It was there yesterday and rather disappointingly contained zero tips.

Still shows up in google but don't have permission to view it when clicked on

Efour · 24 Jul 2019 at 08:31

dowie said:
The guy was an idiot:

Why claim something medical that you can't actually back up?

I'd assume (and at least hope) that anyone with conflicting or unconventional views would be dismissed - I mean if we still had the death penalty for example then a sincere belief (whether religious or otherwise) that it was wrong and a statement that you could never participate in potentially sending someone to their death ought to be sufficient.

Likewise there are people who are opposed philosophically to prison in general or with very limited exceptions - can they be trusted to act impartially when a custodial sentence is likely given a guilty verdict? Some people hate the police, some people love the police and hate criminals some people have extreme political views...

There must be any number of beliefs that could be expressed that would render someone wholly unsuitable for service as a juror - surely if someone either declares a sincerely held belief in advance or (if it is rejected) makes sure to turn up as required and makes that belief know then they've not done anything wrong.

I mean to take an extreme example - say someone is called to a grooming gang trial.... they then declare they're a fan of Tommy Robinson and have liked various dubious social media pages and are super excited to make sure the islamo-paedos get sent down etc... I'd suspect they'd be sent home and not invited back.

Exactly, just go in and say I don't like black people or something idiotic. Instant dismissal.

Azza · 24 Jul 2019 at 08:53

"web chat room"

wow

Diagro · 24 Jul 2019 at 09:08

I want to do it. 2 weeks paid time off work suits me. I'll just take my switch and play games whilst I wait

Maccy · 24 Jul 2019 at 09:10

sanaxe1 said:
Admins, any stats to see if this article created a spike in visitors?

Was my first thought, I don't have access to Google Analytics on here but looking at the admin panel there was an increase in member logins for yesterday.

andicole0 · 24 Jul 2019 at 09:28

I was excused jury service a while back just after I'd had an intestinal resection and didn't have full bowel control

aardvark · 24 Jul 2019 at 10:14

i did it for 2 weeks several years ago - got a case straight away and it ended on the last friday which was handy.

It was interesting but for self employed people i can see that it would be a pain in the arse.
there was a 6 week one that we were called in to first and people were given the chance to give reasons why they couldn't do a long one - luckily i had a letter from my employer saying i was too important for a long one.

Dano · 24 Jul 2019 at 10:14

Heh, Mother is on jury service at the moment, into her third week now, she's a bit annoyed as she always wanted to do it and they waited until she was retired to call her so no time off work

mmj_uk · 24 Jul 2019 at 11:07

£1000 fine or 14 days in jail, is it me or does jail sound like the better option? unless you're in a well paid job you might as well just do the time and save money. All expenses paid holiday to an adult summer camp.

Steeps · 24 Jul 2019 at 11:28

mmj_uk said:
£1000 fine or 14 days in jail, is it me or does jail sound like the better option? unless you're in a well paid job you might as well just do the time and save money. All expenses paid holiday to an adult summer camp.

Lies, even if you do get sent you'll be out in 5 days for "good behaviour", but most of the prisons are too full apparently so it will be a night in a police cell then sent back home and told not to do it again.

What worries me after reading some of those stories about those too stupid to be excused properly, there are probably many more who are expected to sit though legal jargon and courtroom drama and trusted to make a decision which could change a person's life forever.

If asked I would do service and wouldn't try to get out of it. Would be an eye opener to the system.

phonemonkey · 24 Jul 2019 at 12:09

mmj_uk said:
£1000 fine or 14 days in jail, is it me or does jail sound like the better option? unless you're in a well paid job you might as well just do the time and save money. All expenses paid holiday to an adult summer camp.

Thus spoke someone who has probably never been in prison or in any other situation where your autonomy is curtailed. The punishment aspect of prison isn't the physical conditions, its the loss of freedom. It's having no choice in how you'll spend the day, who you associate with, what you eat, when you wake up, when lights out is, what youll eat and when. I've spent a few weeks at a time on courses with the Army Reserves and that loss of autonomy is what makes particularly basic training hard. Yes its physical, but being treated like a kid with few choices was by far the harder part for me. I chose to be there, was getting paid, and enjoyed most of the experience, none of which is true for prison. Add boredom to the mix (as a short sentence prisoner you won't work, won't do any training etc) and I can't think of much worse. £1000 is more than half my monthly wage, but I think my time and autonomy are worth more. If you feel differently then fair play but I find it hard to comprehend.

Steeps said:
Lies, even if you do get sent you'll be out in 5 days for "good behaviour", but most of the prisons are too full apparently so it will be a night in a police cell then sent back home and told not to do it again.

What worries me after reading some of those stories about those too stupid to be excused properly, there are probably many more who are expected to sit though legal jargon and courtroom drama and trusted to make a decision which could change a person's life forever.

If asked I would do service and wouldn't try to get out of it. Would be an eye opener to the system.

I didn't think such short sentence prisoners got time off for good behaviour, much less got off so lightly as to spend only 1 night in a police cell before being released. Can you point me in the direction of the evidence for this statement please?

The second half makes a bit more sense though, some cases are hugely intricate and would require a great deal of attention and intelligence to follow fully, with serious consequences for those involved, and its worrying that such people are making those decisions. Not sure there's an effective alternative though.

Like you I'd quite happily do jury serivce, it would be an eye opener.

Steeps · 24 Jul 2019 at 12:25

phonemonkey said:
I didn't think such short sentence prisoners got time off for good behaviour, much less got off so lightly as to spend only 1 night in a police cell before being released. Can you point me in the direction of the evidence for this statement please?

All I have is a quote from prisonfamilies:

For offences committed on or after 1 February 2015, those who are over 18 years who receive a determinate sentence of at least 2 days but less than 2 years will be released on licence half way through their sentence. They will be on licence until the end of their sentence, with an additional period of post-sentence supervision.