Language Tutors

[Cern]

A couple of links I'm using at the moment:

Listening - https://www.radiofrance.fr/franceculture (c'est plus difficile pour comprendre les mots dans les chansons françaises. )
Other suggestions here: https://frenchtogether.com/french-radio/ - it's still a bit jarring having songs in English interspersing everything but I see it as a brain break.

Interesting that there's a rule for French stations having to have a significant percentage of French music for cultural preservation reasons. I do wish I could find the local talk station I listened to when at my friend's place but I guess they probably aren't online.

As for youtubers, I like this guy as he speaks really clearly: https://www.youtube.com/@professeurfrancais_guillaume

Thanks for these links. Guillaume is fantastic. As you say, he speaks really precisely and at a good pace. I've watched his videos on why spoken French is so different to written French ("the French eat words" ) and also his 50 useful slang words. Fabulous. The penny dropped on so many things with just those two lessons, especially the stuff about missing or concatenated words. Will be watching lots more.

I've started on Busuu and completed several Chapters. Turns out I'm Elementary A2, although I think in written French I'm B1 and in spoken French A1 It's got some of the gamified features of Duolingo but they're not as in your face. The huge difference over Duolingo for me is the videos of real French speakers, not lame cartoon characters with AI voices. It's a massive improvement. I also like the community marking feature and have been getting involved with that a bit.

I'm going to put French radio on while I work, perhaps some will sink in via osmosis.

 

[arknor]

reviving my skills and have been hammering Duolingo

Duo lingo is crap apart from building cookie cutter responses and learning words

Try an audio book or watch Netflix in French.
might be harder to follow TV though, I had a German speaking partner who could do English conversations fine, but she struggled with accents in movies

 

[Narj]

I'm going to put French radio on while I work, perhaps some will sink in via osmosis.

Honestly, there are big chunks of time when I don't understand anything on the radio, but it's such a great feeling when I can say, "I understood that whole sentence!!!"

 

[Blackjack Davy]

Duo lingo is crap apart from building cookie cutter responses and learning words

Try an audio book or watch Netflix in French.
might be harder to follow TV though, I had a German speaking partner who could do English conversations fine, but she struggled with accents in movies

I've heard the same from non native speakers of english they're ok with say london english but when it comes to something like New Orleans/american accents they don't understand a thing

 

[Parsley]

As others have mentioned above, they really just teach languages much better in most of Europe. A large part of that, according to my partner, is the age at which they start with a second language meaning they're bilingual quite early on, at least in Sweden. My partner is Swedish, speaks German passably, lives and works in Denmark (Danish, whilst similar has quite a few different ways of doing things and they sound like they have a potato in their throat sometimes). She is fluent in English unless I pull some obscure word out of somewhere. I tell her what it means once and she then remembers it, she has even got my own slang and regional words down now, mostly. Her siblings, her sister in particular, would have me convinced she speaks awful English if she had her way. Other than having to pause and grasp for a word occasionally, or accidentally saying things the Swedish way around if she's distracted (literally translated they somewhat say things in the wrong order in English) she's perfectly understandable. It makes me feel like an idiot honestly.

Besides the fact my partner has a brain for it, I just don't understand language rules in the same way they do... I just "know" what to say, and I don't know the rule or why I use it a lot of the time.

 

[McGray]

Learn French FLE for free, French courses with TV5MONDE

French courses FLE all levels. Free online exercises. Help to improve your skills. French knowledge test (TCF) and training.

apprendre.tv5monde.com

That is an excellent resource for French learning.

 

[McGray]

I've heard the same from non native speakers of english they're ok with say london english but when it comes to something like New Orleans/american accents they don't understand a thing

Nah. Most speakers with English as a second language speak with an American accent from watching films and TV shows.

I have to taper my English as even though theirs is perfect, they don't understand if I talk normally.

 

[Parsley]

Nah. Most speakers with English as a second language speak with an American accent from watching films and TV shows.

I have to taper my English as even though theirs is perfect, they don't understand if I talk normally.

From the people I know this is particularly true of younger people, so people under 25-30 now. I think a lot of it has to do with in-game voice chat and streaming though, or just content creators in general (I really don't like the term content creator, content content content!). If they watch a lot of an American or British streamer they pick up their intonation as they grow up and end up speaking similarly. But yeah, it's the same thing, exposure.

 

[AndyCr15]

I just don't understand language rules in the same way they do... I just "know" what to say, and I don't know the rule or why I use it a lot of the time.

I guess this is the goal though, right. I'm not even that good at Spanish, but I've been learning about 18 months and now there are times when I've been doing revision or tests and I've thought 'I think it's said...' and it's been right. I couldn't say how or why... Sometimes something sounds right or it sounds odd... but I wouldn't be able to explain why. (I practice with a friend and she'll say something and I will say 'Hmm, I think I would have said it like...', we look it up and it's correct. Again, I don't know why, I don't remember learning it, it just sticks eventually)

 

[Parsley]

I guess this is the goal though, right. I'm not even that good at Spanish, but I've been learning about 18 months and now there are times when I've been doing revision or tests and I've thought 'I think it's said...' and it's been right. I couldn't say how or why... Sometimes something sounds right or it sounds odd... but I wouldn't be able to explain why. (I practice with a friend and she'll say something and I will say 'Hmm, I think I would have said it like...', we look it up and it's correct. Again, I don't know why, I don't remember learning it, it just sticks eventually)

Yeah absolutely, and with my very, very limited Swedish I'm picking up conversations and following what they say more and more. However, it has to be easier to learn if you actually have a good understanding of the rules of languages to begin with, and multiple languages to pull experience from . I guess for spoken language picking it up by ear and stumbling through speaking it over time is fine as they'll often correct those stumbles for you, it's when writing it down I'd really struggle.

My goal is to move and once I do I'll attend proper classes and do it properly rather than rely on my English. If you move the least you can do at least make an honest effort to integrate, even if they'll very often switch over to English easily if necessary, or just because they want to practice their own English. As an aside, her step-fathers English is an incredible thing even if it doesn't come easily to him, he was a Sailor and a Trucker. You can imagine the words he has picked up over the years! He does enjoy practicing them.

 

[TrojanWhore]

Nah. Most speakers with English as a second language speak with an American accent from watching films and TV shows.

I have to taper my English as even though theirs is perfect, they don't understand if I talk normally.

From the people I know this is particularly true of younger people, so people under 25-30 now. I think a lot of it has to do with in-game voice chat and streaming though, or just content creators in general (I really don't like the term content creator, content content content!). If they watch a lot of an American or British streamer they pick up their intonation as they grow up and end up speaking similarly. But yeah, it's the same thing, exposure.

Tbh I've grown up in the south west and have friends from the north (Newcastle/Sunderland) that I can understand fine sober, but once they've had a few I really struggle at times (partly accent but also colloquialisms)

I also new a dutch guy who learnt English mainly from Cartoon Network - He sounded a lot like Jonny Bravo! Less so now as he's been living here for almost 20 years.
I've worked with a lot of Europeans (Spanish, Portugese, Polish, Hungarian, Slovenian, Slovakian etc.) who often apologised for their English, but spoke better English than some of the natives I know/went to school with.

I used to be able to get by OK in German, probably not so much any more. I think the hardest part for me was the idea of gendered improper nouns.

Edit: As for the streamers, I don't think that's unique to non-native speakers, there are a few UK(Irish) game streamers who gained success fairly young, and sound to me like a mix of UK and American accents

 

[Parsley]

Tbh I've grown up in the south west and have friends from the north (Newcastle/Sunderland) that I can understand fine sober, but once they've had a few I really struggle at times (partly accent but also colloquialisms)

I also new a dutch guy who learnt English mainly from Cartoon Network - He sounded a lot like Jonny Bravo! Less so now as he's been living here for almost 20 years.
I've worked with a lot of Europeans (Spanish, Portugese, Polish, Hungarian, Slovenian, Slovakian etc.) who often apologised for their English, but spoke better English than some of the natives I know/went to school with.

I used to be able to get by OK in German, probably not so much any more. I think the hardest part for me was the idea of gendered improper nouns.

Edit: As for the streamers, I don't think that's unique to non-native speakers, there are a few UK(Irish) game streamers who gained success fairly young, and sound to me like a mix of UK and American accents

I had a Uni friend from Newcastle and he was exactly the same, once he was drunk most struggled to understand a word he was saying. I've always been pretty good at catching what people are saying with an accent, but there was this one guy from Motherwell who defeated me entirely!

Edit: Sorry it wasn't Motherwell it was somewhere in Fife!

 

[D.P.]

Thanks for these links. Guillaume is fantastic. As you say, he speaks really precisely and at a good pace. I've watched his videos on why spoken French is so different to written French ("the French eat words" ) and also his 50 useful slang words. Fabulous. The penny dropped on so many things with just those two lessons, especially the stuff about missing or concatenated words. Will be watching lots more.

I've started on Busuu and completed several Chapters. Turns out I'm Elementary A2, although I think in written French I'm B1 and in spoken French A1 It's got some of the gamified features of Duolingo but they're not as in your face. The huge difference over Duolingo for me is the videos of real French speakers, not lame cartoon characters with AI voices. It's a massive improvement. I also like the community marking feature and have been getting involved with that a bit.

I'm going to put French radio on while I work, perhaps some will sink in via osmosis.

Busuu also has more of a focus on a complete conversation in a certain context so the language is more natural.

Duolingo is not useless but should only be a small part of your language learning. It Is good to repeat some grammar and vocabulary, the odd listening or speaking exercise. But it is an incredibly inefficient way to learn grammar and you will never learn conversational skills with it.


WRT Guillaume, his vids are good but this always highlights to me the complexity in learning French. The way he speaks i understand him as if he was speaking English, barely a single word I can't perceive or understand. Yet real French is so different and knowing a bit of slang and how french speakers drop a lot of sounds doesn't at all help.

 

[Cern]

Busuu also has more of a focus on a complete conversation in a certain context so the language is more natural.

Duolingo is not useless but should only be a small part of your language learning. It Is good to repeat some grammar and vocabulary, the odd listening or speaking exercise. But it is an incredibly inefficient way to learn grammar and you will never learn conversational skills with it.

WRT Guillaume, his vids are good but this always highlights to me the complexity in learning French. The way he speaks i understand him as if he was speaking English, barely a single word I can't perceive or understand. Yet real French is so different and knowing a bit of slang and how french speakers drop a lot of sounds doesn't at all help.

Yep, I get that he slows everything down, intentionally of course. But I think this is useful in the early stages of learning, as long as you realise it's happening and it's a stepping stone.

The problem with real world French at full speed is it can be so overwhelming for the listener that you don't really learn because your brain just short circuits. At best you get the gist of it, at worst you draw a total blank because your brain went "waaaaah". Yes, repeated exposure to full speed French does slowly bring some improvement, but I've found I often don't actually realise what individual words are involved, just the overall gist of the sentence. So that's something, but then I have trouble writing down what I heard or repeating it back if I need to build it up from basics.

My ability to read and write French is significantly ahead of my ability to hear and speak it, although I'm told my pronunciation is quite good when I do get it right. I find that most native French speakers dive into the sentence so quickly and drop / smush certain words that you're already on the back foot from the start. English is no different of course, where words collide all the time and some people never seem to draw a breath. So at this stage I welcome the slowed down learning, although I know the journey ahead will get steeper.

 

[Narj]

Busuu also has more of a focus on a complete conversation in a certain context so the language is more natural.

Duolingo is not useless but should only be a small part of your language learning. It Is good to repeat some grammar and vocabulary, the odd listening or speaking exercise. But it is an incredibly inefficient way to learn grammar and you will never learn conversational skills with it.


WRT Guillaume, his vids are good but this always highlights to me the complexity in learning French. The way he speaks i understand him as if he was speaking English, barely a single word I can't perceive or understand. Yet real French is so different and knowing a bit of slang and how french speakers drop a lot of sounds doesn't at all help.

I really do appreciate what you’re saying, however a good foundation is essential. I have worked in multiple multinational companies and it’s been extremely interesting when we’ve had say, guys from Switzerland suddenly learn to say, “OK, I will have a butcher’s” when there is a fault.

I work with a Polish guy now is keen as mustard to learn idioms, slang and so forth. You really can’t learn it easily without real life exposure and people to nudge you along I think.

So far I have learned all the silly slang stuff I know from news comments, IRC and other places.