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soullessfire · 16 Dec 2011 at 02:02

mcknight said:
Your logic is flawed.

Once again, buy a Chalice not a Tear.

Extra mana with the ability to upgrade some AP later, or mana regen... Swings and roundabouts really. One means you get on your feet faster after a big mana draining push, the other means you have a bigger mana pool and more oomph in your Q. Depends completely and utterly on your playstyle. I am chosing chalice, simply because the mana regen is probably nicer for the way I play, but it's all about how you play the game, hence my point

mcknight · 16 Dec 2011 at 08:28

Tear gives you absolutely nothing except a bigger mana pool, and it even takes time to give you that effectively. Chalice costs less, gives you infinite mana (addressing the complaint you had) and *also* gives you defensive stats. You are correct, it is about how you play the game. Either you play it well or you don't.

BunnyKillBot · 16 Dec 2011 at 13:26

mcknight said:
Tear gives you absolutely nothing except a bigger mana pool, and it even takes time to give you that effectively. Chalice costs less, gives you infinite mana (addressing the complaint you had) and *also* gives you defensive stats. You are correct, it is about how you play the game. Either you play it well or you don't.

Professor Snape: Tell me, are you incapable of restraining yourself, or do you take pride in being an insufferable know-it-all?
Ron: He's got a point, you know.

mcknight · 18 Dec 2011 at 08:41

At least you agree that I'm right.

And btw, since your being incredibly smug for w/e reason; Believe it or not, there's absolutely nothing wrong with knowing things.

tals · 18 Dec 2011 at 10:20

mcknight said:
At least you agree that I'm right.

And btw, since your being incredibly smug for w/e reason; Believe it or not, there's absolutely nothing wrong with knowing things.

tbh it's probably from the previous post you made - little too QT3 for my liking.

Tals

** QT3 is another forum on the net

krooton · 18 Dec 2011 at 11:02

Played a few games as Sona comparing Tear to Chalice, and I have to agree with Chalice.

Once charged, Tear gives you a beefy mana pool, but by the time that has happened, mana isn't as much of an issue. Regen helps from the start, when going OOM is more detrimental to your ability to support, plus the type of items a support should be running tend to have mana-regen stats, which work better with the Chalice.

tals · 18 Dec 2011 at 11:25

Personally i'd say don't worry about mana regen for Sona from items- get the philo stone and heart of gold - otherwise your getting starved of gold as support.

just Scott · 18 Dec 2011 at 11:46

tals said:
Personally i'd say don't worry about mana regen for Sona from items- get the philo stone and heart of gold - otherwise your getting starved of gold as support.

Aye, you definitely get both of those gp/10 items. Maybe even a kage's lucky pick for a 3rd gp/10. But building a chalice while on your way to finishing your Shurelya's is definitely a good idea.

Heaven Can Wait · 18 Dec 2011 at 18:00

Why would you take CDR blues on Sona instead of mreg/lvl?
also +1 for chalice
-1 for suggesting warmogs Sona

mcknight · 18 Dec 2011 at 20:01

Blue are inefficient and really not worth it since the changes (read: nerf) to mana regen runes a while back. Yellows give the most bang for your buck.

Generic Support Page:
Armor Red
Mana regen/18 Yellow
CDR Blue
Gp5 Quints

Common substitions: Mpen Reds, Armor Yellows, AP (scaling or flat, usually scaling) Blue or Mres Blue, Movespeed Quints.

Masteries: 9/0/21, 8/1/21, 9/21/0, 0/21/9 (the weird middle one is for Heal/CV combo)

Summoner Spells: Flash/CV/Heal/Exhaust (Exhaust only in very specific circumstances)

Season to taste based on both the champion you are playing and the team you are against.

BunnyKillBot · 18 Dec 2011 at 22:02

Heaven Can Wait said:
Why would you take CDR blues on Sona instead of mreg/lvl?
also +1 for chalice
-1 for suggesting warmogs Sona

The -1, do tell me, why?

Stewy · 18 Dec 2011 at 22:12

It would take you soooooooo long to afford Warmog's on a support :eek:

Heaven Can Wait · 18 Dec 2011 at 22:39

mcknight said:
Blue are inefficient and really not worth it since the changes (read: nerf) to mana regen runes a while back. Yellows give the most bang for your buck.

For Sona I mean as well as yellows, only a 0.2 difference between mana/lvl yellows and blues at level 18, doesn't seem that big a drop for secondary runes.
with Sona being dependant on mana cdr seems like to opposite of what you'd like. (haven't tried it out though, just a thought)

Warmogs does nothing for your team at all
you need to get stacks on warmogs which you shouldn't be getting as support.
its really bad on the efficiency chart.
If your team dies in a fight warmogs doesn't help you to escape, its just going to take mr pew pew dps an extra 3 shots
it costs 3000 gold
shurelias costs 2200
aegis 1925
Wota 2100
I'd rather buy 40 wards.
rather get rod of ages (which i'd never get)

mcknight · 18 Dec 2011 at 23:16

BunnyKillBot said:
The -1, do tell me, why?

Because

It's one of the most expensive items in the game. It has absolutely no team value of any kind. The build up items don't help you in any real way (past maybe the belt) which leaves you with a very weird power curve. You will never farm up a Warmogs, making it cost efficient, on a support. You are investing a *huge* amount of money into a stat that the hero arguably doesn't need. It has no synergy with anything else you do.

I could go on but **** it I'm too tired, Pick one.

Heaven: that wasn't a Sona page, just a cookie cutter support one (which is why I included the deviations). It's actually a 2.1 difference not a .2, which is pretty big as far as runes go but I mean combining them isn't awful (it's pretty much the only time I'd advocate taking blues). Blues are just incredibly slot inefficient now unfortunately

The CDR is because it maxes you out after Shurelias/CDR boots, iirc. CDR is a huge stat on any support, Sona included. Your team is dependent on you because of your abilities, nothing more, after all.

GoRedwings19 · 21 Dec 2011 at 16:01

McKnight+tals>I was just wondering do you play dominion at all?

Anim · 21 Dec 2011 at 16:30

From my pov, Dominion was a quick gimmick and havent touched it in a long time.

Gzero · 21 Dec 2011 at 16:34

Anim said:
From my pov, Dominion was a quick gimmick and havent touched it in a long time.

Really? I use it when I'm down from losing to many 5v5 normals in a row to find fun in the game again.

tals · 21 Dec 2011 at 16:54

Anim said:
From my pov, Dominion was a quick gimmick and havent touched it in a long time.

Agreed, I play it very occasionally but it's far to quick IMHO, I far prefer 45 mins of the main game to 15 mins of dominion.

mcknight · 21 Dec 2011 at 22:38

GoRedwings19 said:
McKnight+tals>I was just wondering do you play dominion at all?

Only time I ever play it is with my friends over in the US (usually when I'm either super tired/super drunk

) because I could care less about ping in Dominions. I was never fond of it for a variety of reasons.

krooton · 22 Dec 2011 at 00:53

I play it too much, mainly because I don't get roflstomped in it that much, having a great run with Skarner in it at the mo.

I don't play SR unless I can mumble with people.

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