Oh, of course not, I was more disputing the idea that being a librarian was a monkey's job... But even then you'd phrased that in terms of the libraries in question.
I'd still dispute that point, but not nearly as vociferously.
Library Day of Action
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Oh, of course not, I was more disputing the idea that being a librarian was a monkey's job... But even then you'd phrased that in terms of the libraries in question.
I'd still dispute that point, but not nearly as vociferously.
They do.
For example Warwick University offers access for external borrowers for £102 a year. http://www2.warwick.ac.uk/services/library/main/basics/accessmembership#external
But let's not let the facts get in the way of the discussion though.
They are free at point of provision. Don't quibble over semantics. While you're at it, you can stop the "money taken via compulsion" ********. It got old several years ago and has no relevance to this thread.
The "trick" must be working, because people are still using public libraries.
But you haven't actually addressed the issue, so my question remains. Evasive as ever, Dolph! No answers, just bigger smokescreens. 'twas always thus.Just as private schooling is actually cheaper per child than state schooling in the UK, yet we are tricked into thinking it is more expensive because we don't have any choice but to pay for it anyway
Cheaper per child for whom? Not for the parents who are paying £18,000 a year for little Tarquin's education!
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/feb/04/libraries-dvds
I find this a far more convincing assessment of the problems faced by our Libraries than the evil tories rant (not to mention it's the local councils deciding what to cut, and making visible cuts for political reasons).
I find this a far more convincing assessment of the problems faced by our Libraries than the evil tories rant (not to mention it's the local councils deciding what to cut, and making visible cuts for political reasons).
So I can opt out of tax for things I don't want to fund? No, I can't.... Then how is highlighting the compulsion not a valid point.
The "trick" must be working, because people are still using public libraries.
Some people are still using public libraries, most people aren't any more.
Cheaper per child for whom? Not for the parents who are paying £18,000 a year for little Tarquin's education!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/educatio...ucate-a-child-privately-say-headteachers.html
You also are forgetting, again, that parents who choose to get their children a good education are still forced to pay for the crappy one as well.
Soldato
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Because a library is a service for the people and not a business.
We have enough problems with the lack of literacy in people especially the younger generation. Libraries should be encouraged not closed.
The problems with lack of literacy are not due to a lack of libraries, but poor teaching standards and expectations and very poor parenting.
And your point doesn't actually answer the question in a meaningful way. Evidence based reason, not ideological justification.
Soldato
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You're correct to a point. I was educated by good teachers and had parents that encouraged learning. Both teachers and my parents pointed me in the direction of the local library that I used regularly to further my education and understanding.
So if we look at the bigger picture libraries are a piece of the puzzle.
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Because the alternative is a monopoly wherby the interests of the owners are held above all else, not the interests of the people.
No, that's what we have now, only substitute owners for politicians. We don't have a situation where public services at the moment serve the interests of the people.
Also, evidence based argument?
So are lifeboats and they seem to work quite well without government intervention.
In truth I am in two minds about it, I love libraries and used to use our local one extensively as a child, I don't do it any more though. Surely what needs to be looked at is if the local community are using their library enough to justify the expense of keeping it running and if the local council are the best people to run it.
But that doesn't explain why the state has to provide them. If they are that important, they will be provided naturally.
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No, what we have now is a service provided for by the people, for the people through the state. It's not a perfect way of managing things but it's still a damn sight better than what you're suggesting. I don't know about you but everybody i've talked to is perfectly happy with our postal service. Every time i've used it the NHS has been great, and i've never known it to let anyone down. So lets look at privately run services, say... private education? Exactly the same teaching style, environment and for all it's worth, staff. The difference? Parents. BT? Pretty much hold a monopoly on internet service in this country and it's pretty dire for the majority of it. But no, apparently it's 'flourished' since it was privatized. Maybe for those who pocket the profit, but for the people definitely not. What else, national rail? I think you'll agree that that's been a complete failure of management and final delivery, with the service only getting worse when more competition was introduced. Loyds? The list goes on Dolph, and yet you never seem to realize that this model simply doesn't work.
So are lifeboats and they seem to work quite well without government intervention.
In truth I am in two minds about it, I love libraries and used to use our local one extensively as a child, I don't do it any more though. Surely what needs to be looked at is if the local community are using their library enough to justify the expense of keeping it running and if the local council are the best people to run it.
Could it not be said that where a library is least used is where it's most needed?
Soldato
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So are lifeboats and they seem to work quite well without government intervention.
You'd get volunteers to run libraries. Not so sure you'd actually get people to donate. Learning isn't quite seen in the same light as saving lives...
The trouble is they are currently not perceived as important.
I suppose they are a bit of an anachronism in today's Internet enabled 10 second Twitter attention span society but whatever the solution be it State or privately run some form of central repository for loaning books and media that is accessible by the people is needed.
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It has merit. It is encouraging parents and their children in said area to use the library rather than sit at home watching X-Factor whilst their semi-literate children are on Facebook unsupervised that meeds be be done. Some how.
It works better than your model. Libraries aren't provided by the people for the people at the moment, they are provided by the state using money taken by threat of force, provided by state employees and controlled by the state. That's a completely different thing.
Every single time your preferred model has been tried it has ended up as a massive, authoritarian and human disaster. What's truly terrifying is that you cannot see it, or refuse point blank to accept it.
Soldato
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He has a point. Privatisation has not made things better rather it has just lined to pockets of shareholders.
Some privatisations have improved things, some haven't, normally because they are either hamstrung by rules or hamstrung by hangovers from nationalisation.
It's also worth noting that Super doesn't just want nationalisation, he wants communism or authoritarian socialism dressed in a fluffy coat.
It's also worth remembering that the vast majority of 'nationalised' services and industries were effectively stolen from the private sector in the first place (such as the railways).