Low end speakers (~£50-£70) - 2.1 or 2.0?

Regarding 2.0 or 2.1, all the primary sound, this is typically everything above around 40Hz, comes from your left / right speakers, a sub woofer is only in support of lower frequencies the main speakers can't handle. So if your left / right speakers are low quality the audio will never sound any good. In addition once speaker drivers get below 5" they often can't recreate mid-range correctly, certainly on a small driver you won't have any warm or depth in the mid range.

So given the choice between small left / right speakers, and a sub, or reasonable size left / right speakers such as the Edifier R1600T III those Edifier's will be far better quality.


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Thanks, @JasonM, that was the kind of information I was looking for. These need to go on my desk so size is limited for the left/right speakers anyway.
 
Mr Jack said:
Thanks, @JasonM, that was the kind of information I was looking for. These need to go on my desk so size is limited for the left/right speakers anyway.
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The other important thing is raising speakers up to ear level, and having the speakers level. The Edifier R1600T III are sitting tilted, so you need to choose some other Edifiers that sit flat.

Speakers placed on your desk your listening in near field (speaker 3 foot or less from your ear). Even on a budget speaker, if you can place the speaker at the correct listening height, it will make a good improvement to the sound. Another benefit of lifting a speaker is you reduce the resonance between the speaker and the desk.

You need speaker stands to raise the speakers, however if you just use books to lift the speakers, it will give you an idea of the improvement without first buying desk stands.
 
Haggisman said:
Was going to recommend the Edifier Studio R1600T III, but it looks like you've already ordered them :D
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Yes, I followed the suggestion from @Armageus. Literally just set them up in fact. Good looking speakers, solid build quality, nice and easily adjustable, and because they take separate left/right inputs I can swap them around to fit with where my PC sits on the left of the table. More importantly, they sound so much better than my old speakers: much better bass, much clearer in the higher stuff. There's probably audiophile words to describe what I mean, but I don't know them ;)

Unfortunately there a couple of drawbacks:

1. Honestly, they're a little big for my desk, and I had to raise my second monitor not to block the speaker. I did wave a tapemeasure around to check before I ordered them, but it's hard to get an impression from that and I hadn't really figured on how comparatively hefty for desktop speakers they are until I saw them.
2. I'm going to have to buy some speakers to go with my TV now...
 
Mr Jack said:
More importantly, they sound so much better than my old speakers: much better bass, much clearer in the higher stuff. There's probably audiophile words to describe what I mean, but I don't know them ;)
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1) Over the next 24-48 hours you will find the speakers improve as the material in the drivers breaks in. You will know when they are broken in as the bass will be slightly more pronounced and the speakers sound more warm.

2) All new speakers should not be driven hard at very first, as the speaker material is stretching in that initial break in period. You start running all new speakers at low volume, then gradually build up the power. One way is to leave new speakers at low volume constantly playing in the background at first.

The YouTube review channels where they take a new speaker from the box, then crank up the power straight away are doing it totally wrong.
 
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JasonM said:
All new speakers you should not be driven hard at very first, as the speaker material is stretching in that initial break in period. You start running all new speakers at low volume, then gradually build up the power. One way is to leave new speakers at low volume constantly playing in the background at first.
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Didn't know that. Honestly though, I don't run them that loud anyway so I guess it'll be fine? These are desktop speakers: I'm running stuff at about normal conversation volume when sitting a metre away rather than running a disco.
 
Mr Jack said:
Didn't know that. Honestly though, I don't run them that loud anyway so I guess it'll be fine? These are desktop speakers: I'm running stuff at about normal conversation volume when sitting a metre away rather than running a disco.
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Yes you be totally fine, just don't go crazy on them for at least 48 hours of playback.

Another thing that can improve them. The speaker drivers are held in with hex bolts, often these hex bolts are loose from the factory. If you turn them with an allen key you will improve sound, however go very careful as not to strip the wood.
 
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Ormy1 said:
Driver break in takes minutes, not days, and should have already been done during QA checks on the speakers before being sold.
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All speakers require many hours of run-in time before they sound best, no manufacture will do this as it would increase costs to much.

What Cambridge audio say on the following link is my experience also.

How To Run In Speakers | Cambridge Audio US

Want your speakers to perform at their optimum level straight out of the box? Then look no further for some Cambridge Audio know-how.
www.cambridgeaudio.com www.cambridgeaudio.com
 
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JasonM said:
All speakers require many hours of run-in time before they sound best
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A common misconception, it takes minutes or seconds, not hours. This misconception is deliberately pushed by speaker manufacturers as it reduces return rate, therefore increasing profit. This is well known among audio professionals. No different than the companies that claim 4 figure silver cables sound better when they are measurably not any better. Consumer audio companies have a tenuous (at best) relationship with scientific fact, again this is common knowledge.

Find some evidence (with actual measurements) conducted by someone with no financial skin in the game and I'll take a look.
 
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Ormy1 said:
A common misconception. This misconception is deliberately pushed by speaker manufacturers as it reduces return rate, therefore increasing profit. This is well known among audio professionals. No different than the companies that claim 4 figure silver cables sound better when they are measurably not any better. Consumer audio companies have a tenuous (at best) relationship with scientific fact, again this is common knowledge.

Find some evidence (with actual measurements) conducted by someone with no financial skin in the game and I'll take a look.
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Audioholics measured speaker break in after years of noticing it themselves.

Key take away below.

In an electrodynamic driver featuring the usual surround-diaphragm-spider construction, driver suspension mechanical compliance plays a key roll in determining the measured value of various driver parameters. All of these parameters will shift as the mechanical compliance of the driver's suspension shifts in value. The bulk of a driver's compliance shift will occur at the time of initial burn in.

www.audioholics.com

Speaker Break In: Fact or Fiction?

Driver "break in", "burn in" or "run in" is a topic that's been debated in various forums for years. This topic continues to ignite occasional flame wars, fueled by the contributions of both
www.audioholics.com www.audioholics.com
 
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JasonM said:
In an electrodynamic driver featuring the usual surround-diaphragm-spider construction, driver suspension mechanical compliance plays a key roll in determining the measured value of various driver parameters. All of these parameters will shift as the mechanical compliance of the driver's suspension shifts in value. The bulk of a driver's compliance shift will occur at the time of initial burn in.
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I agree 100% with that statement. My point is that speaker break-in takes seconds or minutes, not 'many hours' as you claim, I stated this in my first reply. Also that this break-in is usually accomplished in the QA testing by the manufacturer.

Both these points I made are backed up by the article you linked.

"Required break in time for the common spider-diaphragm-surround is typically on the order of 10s of seconds"

"Quite often, spider break in occurs when the driver is tested, before and/or after placement in the cabinet for which it's intended. Driver testing by signal stimulus at some point (or points) in the manufacturing process - if done at levels sufficient to break in the spider - generally makes further break in unnecessary. Hence, a finished system will not - in so far as its drivers are concerned - require further break in by a consumer once taken home from the dealer."
 
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Nothing beats 2.1, if you get a sub, go big or go home.

The sub is EQ'd properly on 800w RMS.

Use headphones, unless you have great speakers that can pick up 20-35hz.

BLACKAIR12D2-V7-front.jpg
 
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Armageus said:
It's like you can't help yourself and always drag the thread off on some squiffy tangent, with bad recommendations that don't meet any of the OPs criteria


But yet you sometimes come out with valid suggestions like this that are bob-on
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It seems he knows that a sub will add so much more to the sound which it does, but also offers a smack on answer for a 2.0 setup also, It's the way with people who experience better.
 
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