Lowered car vs emergency vehicle question

Hussman · 4 Jun 2015 at 20:49

Hi,

Quick question...

Myself and a friend were stuck in a queue of traffic recently in his lowered MX5.

The traffic was queuing on both sides of a fairly narrow road and had been stationary for about 5-6 minutes due to it being rush hour on a piece of road close to two very busy junctions.

We heard the sirens of a police car coming down the road towards us from the rear. The vehicles on both sides started to mount the pavement to create a gap down the middle of the road for the emergency vehicle to get through.

Luckily for us we happened to be right by a drop-kerb, so my friend was able to drive up onto that to allow the police car to get past.

We then discussed what he could have done if his car had been on a normal part of the road without a drop kerb.

He couldn't mount the pavement like the other vehicles as he would have caused significant damage to the body work of the MX5.

If he has just sat there the police car would have had a much harder job to get past. If it had been a fire engine, it would not have been able to proceed.

What's the consensus here? Mount the kerb and damage his car, or sit tight and hope other vehicles will provide sufficient space?

Hussman

Conscript · 4 Jun 2015 at 20:53

As I understand the correct thing to do is to not mount the kerb, and no emergency driver would ever expect you to do so, even if it would help them out. Happy to be proved otherwise though.

rodenal · 4 Jun 2015 at 20:53

You'll usually be able to reverse a lowered car up a kerb, if it comes to it

As above though I'm sure they'd find their own way past

PMKeates · 4 Jun 2015 at 20:57

You'd have to destroy the MX-5, I'm afraid

Howard · 4 Jun 2015 at 20:59

They're trained to get through traffic. If you can easily get out of the way without damaging your car or breaking any traffic laws then you're encouraged to do so, but if not, then don't worry.

Kuros · 4 Jun 2015 at 21:06

For me, it depends on what it would be. Whilst I wouldn't want to be in any way belittling the police force, I'd be more inclined to move out the way and damage the car for a fire or ambulance, given that could be a life or death situation for someone else. As has been said, you're not actually required to pull over unless it's 100% safe to do so, for the same reason as you shouldn't cross a red traffic light to let someone with blues and twos past, given you can still be charged for a traffic offence.

Dogbreath · 4 Jun 2015 at 21:40

Hussman said:
What's the consensus here?

Lowering cars to the point that they become an obstruction to other road users is stupid.

Freefaller · 4 Jun 2015 at 21:43

Howard said:
They're trained to get through traffic. If you can easily get out of the way without damaging your car or breaking any traffic laws then you're encouraged to do so, but if not, then don't worry.

This.

Dogbreath said:
Lowering cars to the point that they become an obstruction to other road users is stupid.

And this...

PMKeates · 4 Jun 2015 at 21:45

Dogbreath said:
Lowering cars to the point that they become an obstruction to other road users is stupid.

Since when is mounting a kerb something you should be doing?

Will · 4 Jun 2015 at 21:45

Kuros said:
Whilst I wouldn't want to be in any way belittling the police force, I'd be more inclined to move out the way and damage the car for a fire or ambulance, given that could be a life or death situation for someone else.

Please consider the 50+ police officers who are assaulted every day nationally, and the fact that many forces send single crewed officers to jobs (as in, an officer might get send on his own to deal with something like a burglary in progress with an unknown number of offenders...). A police car with blue lights and a siren on is just as likely to be dealing with something that is potentially 'life or death' as an ambulance or fire engine.

If you can move out of the way then great but nobody is expecting you to damage your car in doing so by the way. I say this as a police employee who himself owns a lowered car that would struggle to mount many kerbs!

pepsilol · 4 Jun 2015 at 21:46

I've had numerous run ins with emergency vehicles, not sure why I keep getting into these situations.

Two stand out for me.

An ambulance driver was flipping out in my rear view mirror when I refused to go through the red light to allow him to get through. Unlucky for him as that set of lights did indeed have a red light camera. I felt really bad for him as he clearly ignored all of his training on remaining calm and negotiating the traffic sensibly to just flipping out at me. That law needs to be revised or soemthing

Recently had a run in with a cop where it wasn't possible / I didn't want to mount a kerb like everyone else was doing and he just patiently waited for the lights to go green.

BigglesPiP · 4 Jun 2015 at 21:48

Don't break the law to get out the way of emergency vehicles, though passing red lights and driving on the kerb if you can do it safely is in practice accepted and actually pretty sensible.

Your case, I would not climb the kerb.

alx · 4 Jun 2015 at 22:07

Dogbreath said:
Lowering cars to the point that they become an obstruction to other road users is stupid.

Surely this doesn't just apply to cars that are lowered, I imagine there's a fair few factory (sports/super) cars that won't mount a kerb without damage.

Howard · 4 Jun 2015 at 22:15

BigglesPiP said:
Don't break the law to get out the way of emergency vehicles, though passing red lights and driving on the kerb if you can do it safely is in practice accepted and actually pretty sensible.

Your case, I would not climb the kerb.

I'm pretty sure no emergency services driver would want you jumping a red light for them. Also, I believe if you do get caught by a camera doing so then you are still completely liable.

sprite1275 · 4 Jun 2015 at 22:19

It's not law to move for emergency vehicles but obviously you should. The amount of times though I see people stopping in the road when carrying on would be the better option is shocking. Ends up with the emergency vehicle taking even longer to get through.

Might be an idea for your mate to carry some planks of wood in the boot

#Chri5# · 4 Jun 2015 at 22:20

My understanding is that only a police officer can direct you to pass a red stop light. Going through a red light for a fire engine or ambulance leaves you at risk of a points / fine.

As for mounting the kerb, the HC rule 219 says avoid mounting the kerb:

Do not endanger yourself, other road users or pedestrians and avoid mounting the kerb.

Freefaller · 4 Jun 2015 at 22:25

Howard said:
I'm pretty sure no emergency services driver would want you jumping a red light for them. Also, I believe if you do get caught by a camera doing so then you are still completely liable.

You are - but you can get it reversed, but it's your call ultimately - I've done it and got away with it... but as you say you can still get points on your licence. You'd have to be unlucky though to find a magistrate that wouldn't rescind it if the evidence was there.

Kenai · 4 Jun 2015 at 22:27

Howard said:
I'm pretty sure no emergency services driver would want you jumping a red light for them. Also, I believe if you do get caught by a camera doing so then you are still completely liable.

Doesn't stop them sitting behind red light bound traffic hammering away at their horns until people get embarrassed enough to move though unfortunately in my experience.

Thankfully i'm yet to be the one caught at the front

Kaeo · 4 Jun 2015 at 22:30

I've seen multiple cases of people not getting them reversed for both red lights and bus lanes. People shouldn't move, they don't need to.

Lashout_UK · 4 Jun 2015 at 22:41

I'd just do my best to get the hell out of the way, even if it meant pushing through a red, but I'd pay close attention to my surroundings. Obviously there are going to be exceptions where you have nowhere to go.