Mac users' elitism

[Mr_White]

I did, and as I said - there are several ways I could do it.

Did you read my post?

I'm not sure what you're on about, there are several ways you could do it, or you could just install XP and dual boot or use parallels....

Why would you want to use a sluggish and ineffective virtual PC on OS X?

 

[Al Vallario]

IIRC Dells are still a few hundred cheaper in fact, although you might have to slum it with a 1.66 Core Duo instead of a 1.83 or whatever.

The Dell I threw together earlier cost £20 more than the full-price MacBook. It had a (rather poor) graphics card and a (very small) advantage on the HDD size front, and it had a bigger (yet still the same resolution) screen.

It did lack a lot of finish, though, with none of the nifty features such as an integrated webcam, gigabit ethernet port, optical audio input/output and none of the great applications pre-installed on all new macs. It was also much thicker, and much uglier than the MacBook.

Hardware-wise, I'd say they're pretty much the same. The extra software on the mac, though, really sets it apart...

 

[Jet]

Probably because it is so standard they don't mention it.

That's fair enough. I haven't bought a Windows laptop for a while but remember networking is extremely easy to set up with OSX. Less so in my opinion for Windows. I'm not great at netwrking though I must say.

 

[benjo plz.]

Only 1.66GHz!

IIRC Dells are still a few hundred cheaper in fact, although you might have to slum it with a 1.66 Core Duo instead of a 1.83 or whatever.

The speed of a processor doesn't really mean much these days. A 2.0 ghz processor is not going to be much faster than a 1.66.

As for slumming it, a 1.83 is not really much better than a 1.66. Going the whole hog would be 2.33+

 

[PhilthyPhil]

The extra software on the mac, though, really sets it apart...

What software does a Mac come with?

 

[Pho]

Personally I can't see the appeal with macs. Maybe I've used Windows/Linux for too long but I find the interface is much too bright and appears to be designed for Children. Not to mention that I want a right mouse button as default (yes i know you can buy a mouse).

Whilst things like uninstalling do sound much better than on Windows, I've never been able to get used to them. I was trying to help a friend network his Mac to a Windows network, it was a pain. Maybe it's because I don't know the shortcuts like I do in Windows.

Even though Macs come with additional software, I'd be surprised if you can't find free or open-source things which do the same on Windows.

 

[NathanE]

It's a difference between the operating systems that is indicative of OSX's ease of use.

Ease of use is one thing. Functionality is another. What happens if you only want to uninstall certain features of that application? Or what if you want to uninstall the application but retain or backup your settings from it? I'm guessing that applications that need this type of functionality will need their own bespoke uninstall program.

 

[clv101]

What software does a Mac come with?

# iLife ’06 (includes iTunes, iPhoto, iMovie HD, iDVD, iWeb, GarageBand), Microsoft Office 2004 for Mac Test Drive, iWork (30-day trial), Big Bang Board Games, Comic Life, OmniOutliner and Apple Hardware Test
# Front Row

 

[Mr_White]

What software does a Mac come with?

Address book
AppleScript
Automator
Big bang board games
Calculator
Chess
Comic Life
Dashboard
Dictionary
DVD Player
Font Book
Garage Band
iCalendar
iChat
iDVD
Image capture
iMovie HD
iPhoto
iSync
iTunes
iWeb
iWork 06 (trial)
Mail
OmniOutliner
Photo booth
Preview
QuickTime Player
Internet connect
Sherlock
Stickies
TextEdit
Safari
Migration Assistant
Netinfo manager
Network utility
ODBC Administrator
Printer setup utility
System profiler
Terminal
VoiceOver Utility
MS office for OS X (trial)
Frontrow

I know some of that is really basic stuff, but I just typed out everything that comes preinstalled I saw in my appliactions folder

 

[Al Vallario]

What software does a Mac come with?

Have a look here if you are genuinely interested in this. All of the applications listed under "Mac OS X" and "iLife" are included with all new macs.

Of those applications, referred to as "bloatware" earlier in the thread, I use all of the following on a pretty much daily basis: Spotlight, Dashboard, Safari, Quicktime, Mail, iCal, iSync, iPhoto and iTunes. I also use iMovie HD from time to time and DVD Player whenever I feel the urge to watch a DVD. Photo Booth is also surprisingly good for a laugh, too

Edit: Plus Frontrow whenever I want some full-screen, at-a-distance media player loving

 

[JRS]

I'm not sure what you're on about, there are several ways you could do it, or you could just install XP and dual boot or use parallels....

Why would you want to use a sluggish and ineffective virtual PC on OS X?

*sigh*

I said I could use a virtual machine as I'm not used to this brave new world of Macs supporting XP natively. It takes some getting used to. But as I've said, you're right - I could dual boot with OSX and XP, or I could throw OSX out entirely, or I could use Parallels. So which bit of me agreeing with you and saying that there are plenty of ways I could do it aren't you getting here?

 

[Mr_White]

*sigh*

I said I could use a virtual machine as I'm not used to this brave new world of Macs supporting XP natively. It takes some getting used to. But as I've said, you're right - I could dual boot with OSX and XP, or I could throw OSX out entirely, or I could use Parallels. So which bit of me agreeing with you and saying that there are plenty of ways I could do it aren't you getting here?

I was just a bit confused at you saying there are several ways you can do it when you can just install XP instead, no one in their right mind would want to run a virtual PC for normal use, let alone CAD work, when they didn't have to.

Which is why I wondered what you were on about

 

[dirtydog]

The speed of a processor doesn't really mean much these days. A 2.0 ghz processor is not going to be much faster than a 1.66.

As for slumming it, a 1.83 is not really much better than a 1.66. Going the whole hog would be 2.33+

I agree

 

[dirtydog]

Have a look here if you are genuinely interested in this. All of the applications listed under "Mac OS X" and "iLife" are included with all new macs.

Of those applications, referred to as "bloatware" earlier in the thread, I use all of the following on a pretty much daily basis: Spotlight, Dashboard, Safari, Quicktime, Mail, iCal, iSync, iPhoto and iTunes. I also use iMovie HD from time to time and DVD Player whenever I feel the urge to watch a DVD. Photo Booth is also surprisingly good for a laugh, too

Edit: Plus Frontrow whenever I want some full-screen, at-a-distance media player loving

Do you still have to pay extra to get Quicktime to display full screen?

 

[Jet]

Ease of use is one thing. Functionality is another. What happens if you only want to uninstall certain features of that application? Or what if you want to uninstall the application but retain or backup your settings from it? I'm guessing that applications that need this type of functionality will need their own bespoke uninstall program.

They do yes but for those programs that don't need that extra functionality it's easier.

Personally I can't see the appeal with macs. Maybe I've used Windows/Linux for too long but I find the interface is much too bright and appears to be designed for Children. Not to mention that I want a right mouse button as default (yes i know you can buy a mouse).

Whilst things like uninstalling do sound much better than on Windows, I've never been able to get used to them. I was trying to help a friend network his Mac to a Windows network, it was a pain. Maybe it's because I don't know the shortcuts like I do in Windows.

Even though Macs come with additional software, I'd be surprised if you can't find free or open-source things which do the same on Windows.

I found the interface a bit "Fisher Price" but I got used to it. That's not to say everyone will. You can change the brightness on every mac with the keyboard.

The mouse does have a right-click. Enable it in preferences and hit the right side of the mouse. There's no need for distinct buttons really.

A mac (with airport turned on) will 99% of the time connect automatically to any available network.

And you may be able to get some software open source but it won't have the support and integration. And normal users simply don't do that. It's nice to have them bundled for free.

 

[Al Vallario]

Do you still have to pay extra to get Quicktime to display full screen?

Yes, but thats what VLC is for, right?

Edit: Video can be displayed in full screen using Frontrow, and DVD Player can do full screen out of the box, of course.

 

[Stag]

I'm in the position of few of the people in the discussion, being that I own both a Mac (Macbook Pro Laptop) and a PC. I look at them as alternatives, I use the PC as a games machine mostly now with the Mac used as my work station.

They both have different strengths and are different tools for different jobs imo.

 

[Rossmac]

Gotta admit, that I do feel more 'elite' as a mac user.

 

[dirtydog]

I found the interface a bit "Fisher Price" but I got used to it. That's not to say everyone will. You can change the brightness on every mac with the keyboard.

The mouse does have a right-click. Enable it in preferences and hit the right side of the mouse. There's no need for distinct buttons really.

A mac (with airport turned on) will 99% of the time connect automatically to any available network.

And you may be able to get some software open source but it won't have the support and integration. And normal users simply don't do that. It's nice to have them bundled for free.

Other things Macs don't have... the option to change themes without 3rd party commercial software. The option to turn off mouse acceleration without 3rd party commercial software. (Even Windows 95 had that built in - on Mac you have to pay extra) If you want an icon to show network activity you have to install a 3rd party app like menumeters, another basic piece of functionality not available out of the box. I could go on

 

[Angus-Higgins]

I don't really mind Apple Macs (I doubt I would use one though).

I like the way they look (well, the MacBooks, and G5s), but there are some things I don't like.

Firstly I always think of Apple Mac users as people who are into arts, and design; I am not good at design (and certainly not good at art), so I would feel a bit like I was using the wrong appliance.

I remember seeing something on "The Gadget Show" about Apple Macs vs. PCs. One of the points made was very interesting to me; they dropped a PC, and a Mac of similar specification off a balcony, and attempted to repair them. The PC was easy enough to do, and they had it up-and-running in an afternoon, for not much money. The Apple Mac required a much more substantial wait, and also a higher price as the parts were not available, i.e. it had to be sent to a specialist. I like having the ability to quickly buy new parts, and have a large selection.

Also, I don't like the way they look, it seems too "graphicy". In Windows XP, I do run with the Royale Theme, but I wouldn't go further, i.e. make a bolder style (in Windows Vista I will probably not use Aero Glass); I like to have a fairly basic style, that I am used to, and that doesn't take a lot of resources up. I may be wrong, but the flashy graphics in Apple Mac OS X look like they would take up a lot of system resources.

Another thing is the support, for instance, if I want software for my Windows XP machine, all I have to do is a Google search, and then either download (if it is freeware/shareware), or buy online, as most software is designed for the Windows environment. If I owned an Apple Mac, I would have to search harder for things, and be limited to less software.

These things are my opinions really, and I don't really have anything against people using Apple Macs, but I doubt I would ever use one.

Angus Higgins