Make up my mind - X1900XT-X or 7900GTX

[Darkwave]

At what voltage ? At 12v this runs too loud. At 5v it is silent, but is it enough to cool an XT-X ? I suppose you could get a fan controller for it rather then use the zalman fanmate but I cannot belive the zalman at 5v will cool an xt-x under load as well as the stock cooler, which at least exhausts the air out the back.

A VF900-CU is more than enough to cool an X1900XT quietly, that is what it was built for after all. You should check out the "Anyone used an Arctic Accelero?" thread.

<edit> I have just read some good reviews of the Arctic Cooling Accelero X2 cooler. This would solve the noise issue on the ati card for sure, and as I have a btx case which is what these are designed to run in, the heat that rises off it should be caught by the 120mm fan as it blows air through the cpu heatsink (which is at the front of my case) and out the back of the case </edit>

Look for the thread I just mentioned, the Accelero is crap. The VF900-CU cools X1800 and X1900 with ease and without noise.

Also, when you say it's much better then a 7900gtx - are you talking about cooling/temps, because if you are talking about benchmarks, please post some links. I have seen about half a dozen reviews so far and the 7900gtx is as fast and sometimes faster then a 1900xt-x in most gaming benches at 1280 or 1600 with 4xaa/16x af.

Better as in equal or better performance for much less cost. ATi cards usually, since at least the X800 series, pull ahead at higher resolutions and especially with AA+AF. The X1800 and X1900 series cards can also do HDR and AF at the same time in Shader Model 3.0, show me an Nvidia card that can.

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2717&p=6

Benchmarks for you, feel free to tell me that 2 or 3 more FPS is worth up to and beyond £100 more, because then you'll truely be kidding yourself. When comparing an X1900 and 7900, the 7900s are simply a waste of money at the moment (except a successfully volt-modded 7900GT.)

And, please... If you wish to question wether I am biased, feel free to browse my forum history. I am neither in the red nor green camp, it just happens that the 7900 GTXs are stupidly overpriced and understocked, just like the 7800GTX 512's were.

 

[Flanno]

Thanks...just checking out that thread now...yeah is seems the zalman is pretty good allright.

However from the reviews I have seen the 7900 is in fact better at higher res / aa /af, not the other way around, which is what you were saying.

 

[Darkwave]

Thanks...just checking out that thread now...yeah is seems the zalman is pretty good allright.

However from the reviews I have seen the 7900 is in fact better at higher res / aa /af, not the other way around, which is what you were saying.

Simply not the case.

You don't need an XT-X to beat a GTX, you only need an XT. The only game that the GTX pulls ahead in is Quake IV, which is a given since it's OpenGL and ATi OpenGL still is not perfect.

But are you going to tell me 4fps is worth an extra hundred quid?

The only value you get out of the 7900 series is if you can successfully volt-mod a 7900GT to GTX speeds.

 

[Nobski]

What are you on about ? The system I have is a Dell 9150 which has a 375w psu. While it can actually run a 1900xt-x, since the 9150 is now sold with the 1900xt-x as an option, it would do so under a fair bit of load, and not leave much juice left over for say a physx card. The 7900GTX on the other hand uses considerably less power (about the same as a 7800GTX), and so the psu would be working less hard, not to mention much quieter. I could have course replace the psu, but that would involve finding an atx psu with the exact same measurements as the 375w (probably not too hard), plus a fairly messy wiring job. For those reasons, plus the fact I have heard my friends ati x1900 and find it too loud under windows - I am going to order a 7900gtx. The only question is whether I order a stock one or wait for the XFX extreme versions to come into stock.

er, so why start this thread, ?

 

[Darkwave]

er, so why start this thread, ?

LOL, you raise a fair point. I think somebody was just looking for a fight.

 

[Flanno]

If you read my previous posts you would see I was talking about 1280 and 1600. I don't play at 2048x1536 so don't consider that relevant.

If you look at the review on vr-zone of a stock 7900gtx - at 1600 and 1280 with 4xaa/16xaf it is beating the 1900xt-x at Fear,Quake4, HL2 Lost Cost, and only 1 frame behind the 1900xtx at 1280. This was using Catalyst 6.2 though. Read another review on Xbit labs, and they are matched in BF2 and Oblivion (HDR test), but Nvidia taking a slight lead on COD2 and Doom3, and loosing out in FarCry. On Anandtech the X1900xt-x is also ahead in most benches at 1280 and 1600. Conversely on the Inquirer, Firingsquad, and a few other sites show ATI taking the lead, especially in Oblivion. I suppose a lot has to do with what version of the drivers you are using at the time. Which leads me to believe now these cards are more of less neck in neck with each other.

 

[Flanno]

er, so why start this thread, ?

Because I started it before my friend came over with his rig...that's why.

Anyway, enough already...I read the post on this site about the Accelero and have also read some good reviews on other sites, so am not convinced it is crap. At the same time the new Zalman looks nice.

 

[Darkwave]

If you read my previous posts you would see I was talking about 1280 and 1600. I don't play at 2048x1536 so don't consider that relevant.

I said that this generation's ATi cards push ahead in high res, did I not? Especially with AA/AF.

If you look at the review vr-zone of a stock 7900gxt and at 1600 and 1280 with 4xaa/16xaf it is beating the 1900xt-x at Fear,Quake4, HL2 Lost Cost, and only 1 frame behind the 1900xtx at 1280. This was using Catalyst 6.2 though. Read another review on Xbit labs, and they are matched in BF2 and Oblivion (HDR test), but Nvidia taking a slight lead on COD2 and Doom3, and loosing out in FarCry. On Anandtech the X1900xt-x si also ahead in most benches at 1280 and 1600. Conversely on the Inquirer, Firingsquad, and a few other sites show ATI taking the lead, especially in Oblivion. I suppose a lot has to do with what version of the drivers you are using at the time. Which leads me to believe now these cards are more of less neck in neck with each other.

As I said all along, you might get +4 FPS from time to time out of a 7900GTX over an X1900XT/XT-X, but in the long run the X1900 series win hands-down purely due to price. Not to mention that X1800 and X1900 series cards can do SM3.0 HDR + AA.

 

[Darkwave]

Anyway, enough already...I read the post on this site about the Accelero and have also read some good reviews on other sites, so am not convinced it is crap. At the same time the new Zalman looks nice.

The Accelero is crap, why? Because although it's a very quiet cooler, on-par with the VF900-CU in that regard, but its temperatures are more or less the same as stock. The VF900-CU can knock tens of degrees celsius from a core, and still remain quiet, at roughly the same price!

This is something you need to learn... Comparing based on price, and value.

 

[Flanno]

You know - you seem to be very forceful and condascending with your views and I don't appreciate comments like :

"This is something you need to learn..."
"I think somebody was just looking for a fight"

How dare you.

Mods - please close this thread.

 

[Nobski]

Because I started it before my friend came over with his rig...that's why.

Ah, I see, so you started the thread today @ 15:41, then your friend came around today
You have had a busy day

 

[Nobski]

You know - you seem to be very forceful and condascending with your views and I don't appreciate comments like :

"This is something you need to learn..."
"I think somebody was just looking for a fight"

How dare you.

Mods - please close this thread.

Yawn !
Flanno, go play some games, it`s more fun

 

[Darkwave]

You know - you seem to be very forceful and condascending with your views and I don't appreciate comments like :

"This is something you need to learn..."
"I think somebody was just looking for a fight"

How dare you.

Mods - please close this thread.

Yes, I do tend to become forceful and condescending when I am going out of my way to educate somebody about these two cards and the importance of value in making the decision to buy one of them, when the person I am trying to help starts to turn into an Nvidia (or ATi) fanboy and completely desregard everything I am saying.

So, since your mind is made up... You know what? Let Nvidia rob you blind for up to and exceeding £100, and buy their 7900GTX. I hope you're happy with it, but I hope you miss the money you could've saved for other/future upgrades.

 

[Flanno]

Correct.....my friend was visiting me today with his new rig, and I started this thread while waiting for him to show up.

I am going to depart from this thread now.

It is clear that

1. The ati card is obviously better value and close to and sometimes performing better then the 7900gtx.

2. It can be cooled quietly with the new zalman cooler and still perform at xt-x speeds. That I didn't know.

 

[Flanno]

Yes, I do tend to become forceful and condescending when I am going out of my way to educate somebody about these two cards and the importance of value in making the decision to buy one of them, when the person I am trying to help starts to turn into an Nvidia (or ATi) fanboy and completely desregard everything I am saying.

So, since your mind is made up... You know what? Let Nvidia rob you blind for up to and exceeding £100, and buy their 7900GTX. I hope you're happy with it, but I hope you miss the money you could've saved for other/future upgrades.

Well I do appreciate the ati represents better value. I always knew this from reading reviews, but you were pretty insistent that the nvidia card was faster when we both know they are neck in neck. And now I know it can be cooled quietly with the new zalman. Which is something I did not know. So I did not disregard what you were saying, and may well buy an ati card now.

But how dare you tell me that I need to learn about value in that tone. I don't need to learn about anything.

 

[Flanno]

Yawn !
Flanno, go play some games, it`s more fun

I suggest you go to bed if you are feeling sleepy

 

[Nobski]

I suggest you go to bed if you are feeling sleepy

I don't need to learn about anything

Lol, well unlike you I do need to still learn so I`m going to stay up another 20 mins if my mummy lets me

 

[Darkwave]

But how dare you tell me that I need to learn about value in that tone. I don't need to learn about anything.

Firstly, I didn't even use a tone when I said that. This is the internet, tone is difficult to percieve correctly.

Secondly, yes I do dare to inform someone with seemingly no concept of value that they should learn about the cards and prices in question before making a decision. In fact, it's the first thing anyone making a major purchase of any item should do.

 

[man_from_uncle]

Regardless of Exsomnis' point earlier, that as this is an OcUk site we should only discuss this subject in context of OcUks current pricing scheme, you should have a look about for cheaper 7900gtxs before you take the 'better value' argument in its entirity. (Though if you can find a 7900gtx cheaper than £340 that's in stock you're a better man than me)

That doesn't change my position, but I don't want you getting snowballed by incomplete arguments.

EDIT: Sorry. I don't mean that as an incitment. I'd hope on reflection you can appreciate the point I've made without rubuking it on reflex or trying to teach me a lesson .

 

[Flanno]

Well I probably should have mentioned on my post that value wasn't a major concern as I was prepared to buy either card. The tone of your post by telling someone they they 'need to learn' something instead of suggesitng it to them, comes off as sounding beligerant and unappreciated in my book.

<edit> man_from_uncle...yeah I agree with what you said and everyone else. The more I think about it, the extra cash spent on a 7900gtx is not worth it. The fact I can cool an x1800xt to very good levels and keep the noise down is a major plus. The fact the x1900xt-x is qualified to run with my psu is also a major plus.

2 questions if anyone cares to answer :

1. Will the Zalman cooler still preform at 5v under heavy load with a 1900xt. I want a quiet a system as possible. If not and I need to raise the rpms, what fan controller does the best job ?

2. Do case temps in peoples experiences go up much since you are not extracting the heat out the back ?

</edit>