Miami building collapse

Angilion said:
In the case of this building in Miami, there were reports of people saying they heard a noise that they said sounded like an explosion. I think that doesn't necessarily mean there was an explosion. There was in Ronan Point and probably in some other examples of multi-storey buildings collapsing, but not all of them. The noise of the collapse itself would make a noise so loud that many people who heard it would think of an explosion.
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People are quick to describe any loud "bang" type sound as an explosion. I remember seeing a structural engineer complaining about this on a TV documentary a few years back.

Drop a heavy book flat onto a hard surface and you get a bang...
 
potatolord said:
People are quick to describe any loud "bang" type sound as an explosion. I remember seeing a structural engineer complaining about this on a TV documentary a few years back.

Drop a heavy book flat onto a hard surface and you get a bang...
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We get the same thing at work all the time. We handle heavy cargo and have heavy manufacturing on site. Have had the police and other emergency services turn up on occasion and we're stood there like this :confused:
 
NY Post had a photo of the basement from 2 days before the collapse, shocking state for a building.

If there’s any justice folk will go to prison for it.
 
2 photos^^ Taken by a pool engineer who was surveying the pool house and basement toolroom etc below the pool. Essentially the pool was leaking for many years, the management replaced the pool room pumps every 2 years rather than sort out the leak. The leak eroded the concrete foundations and supporting beams even as far as the underground carpark.
 
mrk said:
2 photos^^ Taken by a pool engineer who was surveying the pool house and basement toolroom etc below the pool. Essentially the pool was leaking for many years, the management replaced the pool room pumps every 2 years rather than sort out the leak. The leak eroded the concrete foundations and supporting beams even as far as the underground carpark.
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It seems that there was widespread cracked steel reinforced concrete in an area that was subsiding and which was a crucial load-bearing part of the structure and which was being constantly exposed to water 24/7 and they did nothing. For years. Despite definitely knowing about it.

If that's true, it's negligence to an extent that should be criminal.
 
mrk said:
2 photos^^ Taken by a pool engineer who was surveying the pool house and basement toolroom etc below the pool. Essentially the pool was leaking for many years, the management replaced the pool room pumps every 2 years rather than sort out the leak. The leak eroded the concrete foundations and supporting beams even as far as the underground carpark.
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Pool leaks can be a complete nightmare to sort out however they are always solvable. Not sure what replacing the pumps was meant to achieve though, unless they were the source of the leak.

I wouldn't expect it to cause erosion of concrete beams/columns however. You might get corrosion of the reinforcement within and then cracking or spalling as a result. The only way you might get something resembling erosion is if the water in the area has exceptionally high levels of sulphates in which case the concrete just turns to dust. If that was the case though it would normally be evident in the pool itself as you'd see tiles coming loose.
 
Dis86 said:
Pool leaks can be a complete nightmare to sort out however they are always solvable. Not sure what replacing the pumps was meant to achieve though, unless they were the source of the leak.

I wouldn't expect it to cause erosion of concrete beams/columns however. You might get corrosion of the reinforcement within and then cracking or spalling as a result. The only way you might get something resembling erosion is if the water in the area has exceptionally high levels of sulphates in which case the concrete just turns to dust. If that was the case though it would normally be evident in the pool itself as you'd see tiles coming loose.
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The first paragraph of the wiki suggests pool leak + massive amounts of salt; presumably due to proximity to the sea.
 
dLockers said:
The first paragraph of the wiki suggests pool leak + massive amounts of salt; presumably due to proximity to the sea.
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The salt would contribute to the corrosion of the reinforcement. Rust occupies more volume than steel by a long measure so in that case its probably blown the concrete and that'll be the cause.
 
robfosters said:
How could it come down like that? Aren’t they checked structurally often?
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They are, and this one had been, and engineers had been warning about its lack of structural integrity for years. There was no excuse for allowing it to fall with a bunch of people inside.
 
The other side has been demolished in a control fashion so that the "recovery" search can continue. It's grim. It's grim on a Grenfell scale.
 
I know the investigation is still on going, but this engineer has done a series of very informative videos on the entire thing. His opinion now is that there were deficiencies in the original plans.

 
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