My DC5 track toy

Man of Honour
Joined
20 Sep 2006
Posts
35,274
Never started a thread about this car, can't remember why!

September 2016

Here I am, back in another Honda and my second DC5. As much as I enjoyed driving the Evo, I never really gelled with it. I should have learned after my first one; they’re quick, there’s no doubt about that however there’s some things which really detract from the ownership experience. As a point to point car they’re a complete weapon, there really isn’t much on the road that could keep with one. Pick the right gear, usually 3rd or 4th, as long as you are above 3500 rpm, point in the direction you want to go and squirt. Some magic 4WD stuff happens and before you know it you’re doing insane speeds for the public road. Therein lies part of the problem.

As a drivers’ car they can feel a little soulless, you don’t really have to work for the performance. A lot of people will say that it’s like driving a PlayStation on wheels. I don’t agree with that, but for outright fun, for me at least, I get more out of wringing the neck out of something. Then there’s the interior, the IX is based on a car that came out in 2001 and it shows. I distinctly remember when I viewed it, I thought to myself ‘why on earth am I spending £16k on something that’s got this interior?'. I almost walked out that day without buying it. They’re not comfortable either, there’s little cushioning under the arse of the Recaro and anything over an hour really grates. I remember doing a stint up to Croft for a track day and I got out barely able to straighten my back or walk properly. Because racecar I said.

On track it’s extremely capable, with the right tyres, some brake upgrades and suspension mods you will be faster than 90% of things that turn up. Okay, that figure is made up, but you get the idea. The weight of the car soon takes its toll, though. If you’re a crap driver, like me, you’ll overdrive the car and go through brakes and tyres quicker than you can max your credit card. 2 sessions and you need fuel; I think I was getting 5pmg on track which is a little disturbing for a stage one car. I did a full day at Spa and I went through 5 or 6 tanks at a cost of £300 or so. The track day itself was only £150 I think? Then there’s the tyres afterwards, and the brake refurb, and the SAS valve broke and… you get the idea. One final thing that I couldn't get out of my head is the overwhelming sensation that something would break. Driving an Evo on track is like dating a stripper, it’s good fun however you soon realise it isn’t the best idea and you expect the worst to happen.

The older I get the less interest I have in having an uncomfortable and noisy car to potter about in. The Evo was sat outside the garage not getting used. I’d take it out now and then for the sake of it. I loved driving it then, but it felt more of a case that I was doing it to justify owning it. Of course when I took it out I’d cane it which involved high fuel usage and speeds on the public roads which could see me losing my license. More track days must be the answer; I always enjoy going to them. But the Evo is a heavy car. I could have stripped it, but I looked at its value and thought better of it. I guess in the end I never really gelled with it either. So I decided to sell it and get something that I could wring the neck of and not worry too much about.

I’d spoke to a few people about this I’d originally looked at a track EG with a K20 in it. They’re quick cars, but there’s something about the image of the EG that I don’t like so I was never 100% on the idea. I’d spoken to a good friend about it and he mentioned that a DC5 was at TGM and needed some TLC. To this day I miss my old one, there’s something about the DC5 that I’ve always loved.

1 owner from import, 66k miles and pretty much off the road for the past 3 years as the owner got banned. I made an offer in the £5k region and it was accepted. So here it is, in its far from perfect paint finish. The sun really has done some work on it!

Here’s the spec:

01'C/W Red seats Black oem wheels.
Gruppe M
RBC
Mapped by Romain @ Eurospec 243bhp.
Full DC Sports system. DC Battery tie bar.
Front and rear Mugen struts, Mugen oil filler/radiator caps.Mugen gear knob.
Eichbach springs TGM FRSU. Oem springs inc (if you want them).
B&M short shift.
Spoon ETD, Spoon Front brace,
Genuine Seibon C/F Rear spoiler.
C/F Bonnet. (Make unknown-oem style).
And some other bits.

Plan at the moment is to get it back on the road so I can use it! There’s an issue with the brakes so I have bought a 332mm Brembo kit, not cheap but worth it I hope. Once it’s on the road and I know what budget I have to play with I’ll start looking at coilovers, seats and maybe some weight loss.

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11th October 2016

Some more pics. I think Mr Dott lives at TGM. I'm tempted to leave the sticker on the intake for lol's.

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New front brake kit fitted with Pagid RS29 pads and TGM lines all round. Tom's put some race car wheels on the front on as the standard wheels need 15mm spacers. On the shopping list.

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New OEM rear discs and Project Mu HC800 pads.

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Front arches have had a quick mop, paint is coming up well. The red bonnet isn't mine, my CF one is getting fixed/painted so it needs something on it for the time being.

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I've had an update from TGM, all seems well with the car. It's been serviced, cleaned, the lip, bonnet and spoiler have been painted or are in the process.

Just ordered some Bilstein B16's, Rota (fake Rays) Fighter in bronze and Federal 595 RSR to go on, should hopefully be able to pick the car up next week
 
22 October 2016.

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Few more parts needed then she's ready. Would have picked her up yesterday but have been let down by a supplier.
 
28th October 2016.

Just picked her up. Bite to eat then driving home. The front bumper is a bit yellow but I didn't want to pay to paint it. It'll do for track.

Loving the wheels and how they sit on the car. Also love the size of the front brakes.

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29th October 2016

Donington on Monday.

Tidied the engine bay by removing the torque damper, earth kit and McDonald's sticker. Plus I've ripped out the amp and cabling.

Annoying the left speaker doesn't work. I swapped them over and it stayed so the fault is at the head unit end but I'm not sure what as all cabling is good.

Oh yeah, toe eye has also been removed.

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01st November 2016.

First track day.

After picking the car up on Friday, I was relishing going out on track. Donington had been booked for some time for yesterday, so I was itching to try the DC5 out in anger. I haven't been really impressed with it on the road

I decided to travel up on the Sunday and then stop overnight in a hotel near the circuit so I'd be fully rested. Well, that didn't work because as usual I barely slept a wink in the Premier Inn. Sad face. I was however over the moon with the 38 mpg on the way up, sat at 70-80 most of the way with no VTEC.

I didn't enjoy Donington previously, as it was a wet and miserable day and I was in an S2000, which was hard work. I wasn't sure what to expect, both about the car and the circuit. It was a foggy start and the track didn't open till around 10 am, a full hour after it should have done. I went out with Kevin up front to get some heat into the new brakes, new tyres and to get a feel for the new suspension. We did a couple of quick ish laps and came in. I had dropped the pressure's to 27 all round and the rears got up to 32 and stayed there all day. I had to do another one or two sessions to get the fronts settled to the same pressures.

Sitting behind Kevin gave me a lot of confidence, he's a very quick driver with a fair amount of experience driving on circuit as well as a lot more in a DC5 on track than I have. We were soon dropping into the 1m24's (guessing here, timing isn't allowed). Traffic ended up splitting us up, Kevin broke into the 1m23's while I remained in the 1m24-1m26 area. A few more tweaks on the car and I think I could knock a few seconds off. Kevin an I run almost identical brakes, the only difference he has AP calipers and I have Brembo, but the same pads and same discs up front. Rears are just standard discs with a basic uprated pad. He's on JDM spec Ohlins and some castor mods, I'm on B16's although my car's been mapped so I have about 20 more bhp than him. Really doesn't make that much difference on circuit to be honest!

In the afternoon I was pretty much out alone and I started to really, really enjoy the car. Much more fun than my Evo and I'd say the S2000 as well. It's also easier to drive than the S2000. I love how the back end moves around and how you can turn the car on the throttle. So far I definitely think I've made the right move.

I was hit by a gear change issue in the afternoon though, I missed 4th a few times and it turns out I've bent a rod that connects to the short shifter. After a bit of faffing about I used a wrench to hammer it straight is again. That'll need investigating further as well as some other minor issues.

So far, so good than. I had really a really good laugh yesterday and I can't wait to go back out on track.


05 December 2016

Not a huge update but this will probably be it for this year. The car went to Performance Autoworks the other week to have some work done. I booked it in for the following:

  • Oil change. Yes, it was done at TGM before the track day, but I figured I'd get it done anyway considering how long the car had been sat previously.
  • Investigate steering wheel wobble.
  • Remove steering rack, fit SHG slider and flush the fluid. It was low and I needed to top it up, but I only had Halfords fluid so I wanted Honda back in.
  • Check/adjust geo - I was a bit exuberant with the kerbs at Donington.
  • Overall health check of underneath, bushes etc.
  • Fix lights as they were bog eyed.
  • Fix EML - I read the code at home so already knew it was the O2 sensor.
  • Fit KTuned shifter cables.

First off, the lights. I drove to Donington in the dark and it was comedy, one of the headlights was pointed upwards I think and the other was pretty much a candle. It was the first time I'd driven it in the dark so I didn't have much of a choice but to continue. Luckily there was enough for me to be able to see, and for the most part the roads between mine and the hotel near the circuit are well lit. I didn't fancy taking the bumper off myself in the cold so I had Rich look at it.

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I'll just quote Rich's email for an explanation.

Headlamps (pics attached) – I’ve sorted these as best as possible, it has non OEM HID bulbs and ballasts “installed” – I say installed but quite frankly the bulbs are too small and were just poking through the mounting hole with nothing to hold them in place. I have fabricated some adapters, bonded the bulb bases to these and then installed them using the OEM retaining clips. This is about as good as it can be, the light pattern is much better now but the lens could do with a good polish to improve things further.

I can't really add to that. I may get the headlights done next year, but having driven it in the dark the other evening, I can say that they are substantially improved! Still, not as good as I remember the OEM lights being. Sadly they are expensive and few and far between, so I think I'll leave it after a polish has been done.

Onto the wheel wobble. I'm not sure if I'd mentioned, but I was getting steering wheel wobble when I picked it up from TGM. They'd balanced the wheels so I figured a weight had come off. I took it to my local and trusted tyre place, they did it again but the problem moved to a different speed. I'd asked Rich to look into it confident it couldn't possibly be the balancing. He checked everything over and couldn't find anything. The last thing on the list was driveshafts, these can only be visually inspected so far and at over a grand for new items for Honda I decided to sleep on it. Rich suggested to get the wheels balanced again but use a stud pattern mount instead of the centre bore. So after I picked the car up I drove back to the tyre place for them to do just that. They said they always use a stud pattern mount anyway, but they also said they were quite a way out. I explained I had it done by them before so they let me on my way without charging me. I'm glad to report that the wobble has gone.

Rich said the car is in good health. It's been well serviced in its life although no paperwork exists sadly due to 'cash in hand' servicing. Doesn't bother me for the price. He did notice some corrosion though. Again I'll quote his email:

Found some corrosion and paint/underseal stripped on o/s chassis leg under brake reservoir – looks like someone had a major brake fluid spill at some point. I have cleaned off the worst of flaking rust/paint/underseal and have coated with a waxoil underseal to prevent it getting worse – I’ll forward some pics in another email

Before:

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After:

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I don't think there'll be many updates over the winter, I'm even tempted to SORN the car till the end of March and tuck it away in the garage after a clean.

As for plans I've been looking into the following modifications:
​ACT Stage 1 organic clutch kit.
Spoon 5.3 Final drive.
FD2/EP3 (same) 0.738 6th gear.
Kaaz plated diff.
Clockwise Motion gated baffle.

Nice cheap shopping list! I'm also looking at a polybush and a quieter intake, possibly a Mugen.

Massive thanks to Rich at Performance Autoworks for yet again outstanding work.

27th January 2017

Finally fitted a surround to the new head unit. Not the best fit but better than a gap. I had two others to try and this was the only one I could get to fit. However it was freezing so I didn't exactly spend much time on it!

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Genuine 'that'll do' moment.

Also I fitted a new gear knob a few weeks ago as I am not a fan of the Mugen one.

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These are such a cracking car. Fairly bullet proof and epic to drive. Still to this day the best FWD car I have ever driven.
 
08 February 2017

All packed for Brands Hatch.

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There's 4 spare wheels with AD08R's on, two more wheels in boxes without tyres, a Mugen airbox, jack, axle stands, toolbox, oil, washer fluid, torque wrench, impact gun, helmet/gloves, warm jacket, workshop gloves, small suitcase in the passenger footwell and some other random crap.

10 February 2017

Well, Brands Hatch. I was always weary of booking a track day in February, however there have been some warm (ish) dry days so there was always a chance it would be nice. Well, it wasn't - it was trying to snow all day and I think it stayed at about 0 degrees. When it wasn't attempting to snow, it was raining. The circuit as a result was like an ice rink, barely any grip and I could feel the back of the car twitching going into a lot of bends including Paddock!

I had a choice of two tyres with me, Federal RS-R's and AD08R's. I tried both out, I think maybe the Federal's warmed up a little easier but in reality in the conditions, they were both as bad as each other. I couldn't get any warmth into the rears at all and the fronts were nearly as bad. Still, I had fun and it's nice to drive the car in such low grip conditions to really get a feel for it. I think something like Uniroyal Rainsports would have been suited better to the conditions!

As I've posted in here I was always weary of the Gruppe M causing noise issues at circuits. I don't think I've ever been anywhere as bad as Brands, that said I wasn't all that surprised to have got black flagged. I had the Mugen with me and the plan was to swap them over lunch, however that was brought forward somewhat! It should have been an easy job, however I managed to round one of the bolts on the strut brace which then took about half an hour to remove. It seems some idiot (me) over-tightnened them... top tip, don't try and fit a Mugen airbox with a brace fitted as it's far from easy. Massive thanks to Carl Hammond on the teg forum for the help he gave and to his mates that gave some tips on removing the bolt etc. I'm an IT guy, not mechanic! All fitted, ignore the breather hose, I've had to borrow the GM one till I get a proper one sorted. The box is also fitted with a single bolt so that needs rectifying.

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Once the new box was fitted it was pretty much lunch time, however I had no further issues with the marshal's thankfully. So it wasn't a massive waste of money. In terms of difference between them, obviously the Mugen is a lot quieter but still sounds really good. I think perhaps the car is a little less eager to rev but that could just be due to the quietness of it as the noise of the GM does make you feel like you're going faster. Also, the car hasn't been mapped in like 5 years, and I've now changed the airbox and exhaust so it definitely needs mapping soon!

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I do have more videos, I'll try and get them uploaded this week.

 
At Doni or Brands? Only used them once or twice at Brands and on the straight bits. The laps of Doni above are a little messy, I did have some cleaner sessions but haven't edited them yet.
 
ChrisD.;30498378 said:
At Doni or Brands? Only used them once or twice at Brands and on the straight bits. The laps of Doni above are a little messy, I did have some cleaner sessions but haven't edited them yet.

I only watched a bit of Dony and seemed you had the line fairly well. Obviously we can all be smoother and consistent, but starts with getting the lines right. Coppice is always the challenge there, blind turn in and you always come out thinking you should be flat on the exit and the Craners.....they are always to be taken faster...in your head. Few missed apexes but again that's easy to pick out from my comfy chair.
 
Yeah I know what you mean. I watch the videos back and I think why am I lifting in Craners as I think the car can take it flat to the bottom, but you never think that behind the wheel on the day. I'm my own worst enemy when it comes to critiquing but I guess it's all about having fun and staying safe, rather than setting sub 1m24's to please the internets.
 
ChrisD.;30498394 said:
Yeah I know what you mean. I watch the videos back and I think why am I lifting in Craners as I think the car can take it flat to the bottom, but you never think that behind the wheel on the day. I'm my own worst enemy when it comes to critiquing but I guess it's all about having fun and staying safe, rather than setting sub 1m24's to please the internets.

Craners are a proper challenge. For me in my slower MX5 race car, it's flat from the exit of Redgate, both rights easily flat (as they would be in yours) and then a slight lift into the left before the old hairpin. I followed a very handy friend in an MX5 there for 10 laps or so and he was flat from Redgate to the old Hairpin, but I found that was no quicker in the end as he was slower through the old hairpin due to having to lose more speed and in doing so, messier. I found a slight lift at the left helped my braking. I never really got Coppice right either, he was quicker through there but I was able to nail the chicane and he was not able to so our laptimes were about the same.
 
ChrisD.;30498394 said:
Yeah I know what you mean. I watch the videos back and I think why am I lifting in Craners as I think the car can take it flat to the bottom, but you never think that behind the wheel on the day. I'm my own worst enemy when it comes to critiquing but I guess it's all about having fun and staying safe, rather than setting sub 1m24's to please the internets.

Absolutely 100% this!

I do not even run semi slick tyres any more!

But to give you an idea, craners has always scared me, in my M3 think I have gone down their around 118mph on michelin cups, other tyres I am around 110-115ish on.

My mate with a GT3 on michelin cups was doing 114mph every time, he then pushed 116mph, and exited backwards at 114mph LOL and stopped where the marshal normally parks metres from the barrier. Needed a respray and new wheels and some pride.

My mate who has balls of steel and is in fairness a good driver takes his E46 M3 down their at 130mph but he is on slicks, but in fairness he was touching 125mph on michelin cups. But he wanted to show me what my car was capable off as suspension and geo terms were similar, but he has around 550HP in his car and at the time was doing around 1:16 laps compared to my slow 1:20-1:22 laps.

I am now back on normal tyres, MPSS, but the car is more powerful and lighter, so laps the same but is more fun, moves around more but with more control but about same times. Maybe I will try cups at some point in the future to get a solid sub 1:20 but just prefer having a car that drives epic on the road and can be driven to the track in that same setup and back home again. The only thing I change bewtween road and track now is I put 0.5 more negative front camber which takes 5 minutes per side to do, unless its wet I just leave it in road trim then. :)

As Housey says, DC5 is one of my all time favourite cars, the Megane R26 is damn good but it gets boring fast due to it sounding like a hoover under the bonnet, at least the DC5 has a proper sounding engine. :)
 
Love threads like this. Turning an unloved, forgotten about drivers car into a track toy looks so rewarding. You got a bit of a killer deal at £5k for the DC5, right? I haven't followed their prices for quite a while now, but I remember that they never really depreciated at all and are still similar prices to what they were 5-6 years ago.

That day at Brands looks miserable! Foggy, cold and greasy - everything you don't want on track. Donington looked glorious though. I did a track day in December and January and managed to get super lucky on both - clear, sunny, dry but nice and cold for the car.
 
NickK;30498571 said:
Track car... with plastic in the cabin and no roll cage! :eek:

I still have to drive to the tracks and back. I'm going to Spa in April and then the 'Ring, the journey will be bad enough as it is, not a fan of sat in a noisy tin can for 5 hours!

The DC5 is a very light car as it is, I'm really not sure how much weight would be lost, can't be more than 10-15 kg taking most of the rear out which isn't going to gain me much in the real world.

Gaygle;30498575 said:
Love threads like this. Turning an unloved, forgotten about drivers car into a track toy looks so rewarding. You got a bit of a killer deal at £5k for the DC5, right? I haven't followed their prices for quite a while now, but I remember that they never really depreciated at all and are still similar prices to what they were 5-6 years ago.

That day at Brands looks miserable! Foggy, cold and greasy - everything you don't want on track. Donington looked glorious though. I did a track day in December and January and managed to get super lucky on both - clear, sunny, dry but nice and cold for the car.

I paid £4800 IIRC. But I did get a good deal mainly as I knew the owner and he knew I wouldn't strip the car and make a profit out of it.

Brands was pretty dire, yeah, and with it being my first time there a little disappointing, that said it was very rewarding driving near the limit of adhesion.

There was a standard ish Accord R there on road tyres, he was lapping faster than most of the other cars there. Bit of driver knowledge and proper road tyres goes a long way in such conditions.
 
Gibbo;30498488 said:
As Housey says, DC5 is one of my all time favourite cars, the Megane R26 is damn good but it gets boring fast due to it sounding like a hoover under the bonnet, at least the DC5 has a proper sounding engine. :)

They do sound epic don't they :)

Nice to hear some heel/toe action going on too.
 
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