Myleene Klass + 2yo daughter confronted by intruders; warned by police

semi-pro waster said:
Thanks, I'm aware of the law regarding self defence. The point I'm making is that whoever has communicated that information to Mr Shalit is quite clearly wrong in what they have said, the law does explicitly allow you to defend yourself in your own home (and external to your home as well for that matter) provided the measures you take are reasonable and proportionate to the risk (nb there's a fair degree of leeway applied to this measure as well to allow for heightened emotions).

But if you're not in any direct danger (and by the sounds of it Ms Klass was not) then you should not put yourself in greater danger then claim that your actions were in self defence.
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Indeed and i did jump on your post by mistake tbh ;)

Also this has been reported differently by other papers, Miss Klass was merely given words of advice etc - but the Daily Mail got the responce they wanted from their readers (and lots of mail readers seem to be in this thread)
 
BigBl00 said:
I think this is more endemic of society than the police. The police work with in the laws passed by the judicial system. We've all seen and heard of the politically correct world that lets criminals walk on some legal loop hole or soft sentencing.

Socialy no longer respects, hard working public servants like the police and other emergency services ( stones being throwen at firemen etc ).....with the exception of our armed forces.

In many of those roles, your damned if you do and damned if you dont !
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i agree completely - something needs to change - what with our economic problems just beginning this is a turning point for british society, for better or worse.
 
[TW]Fox;15702270 said:
Obviously the sensible thing to do would be to call the police and let them continue - the car is insured and my life isn't.
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That's a ridiculous argument. What if, for example, that particular car had been lovingly restored, and was priceless from a personal point of view.

Sorry, anybody trying to steal it deserves a boot in the balls, a punch in the guts and their teeth knocking out when they "fell over".

At the very least.
 
ElvisFan said:
That's a ridiculous argument. What if, for example, that particular car had been lovingly restored, and was priceless from a personal point of view.

Sorry, anybody trying to steal it deserves a boot in the balls, a punch in the guts and their teeth knocking out when they "fell over".

At the very least.
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And that's why you'd be arrested.
 
[TW]Fox;15702114 said:
What happens when a kid gets stabbed for climbing a garden fence to retreive his football?

'But I thought it was a hoody coming to steal my strimmer!' screams home owner.
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Holy straw man, I can't even begin to imagine how those situations could be seen as comparable. Chavs breaking into a shed vs a 10yr old kid picking up their football, I'm sure that's going to elicit the same reaction from a homeowner, not. Secondly, it's someone waving a knife at someone on the other side of the garden from behind a window in the hope they will run off and not try to break into their house as well, harmless, it's not some maniac running towards a random person in the garden trying to stab them. You speak of common sense but don't use it yourself!
 
Energize said:
Holy straw man, I can't even begin to imagine how those situations could be seen as comparable. Chavs breaking into a shed vs a 10yr old kid picking up their football, I'm sure that's going to elicit the same reaction from a homeowner, not. Secondly, it's someone waving a knife at someone on the other side of the garden from behind a window in the hope they will run off and not try to break into their house as well, harmless, it's not some maniac running towards a random person in the garden trying to stab them. You speak of common sense but don't use it yourself!
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According to the article, she screamed and waved a knife. The article unfortunately doesn't say what she screamed. I'm not suggesting she would have taken the time to ponder a proper response but screaming...

"Get away from my shed I'm calling the police" is not the same as " Get away from my shed, I HAVE A KNIFE *wave shiny knife*", the latter is threating behaviour.

The article also at no point suggests the house was also a target or this was anything other than a spir of the moment theft from a shed where they got caught red handed.
 
Energize said:
Holy straw man,
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Wow this term is getting annoying.

I can't even begin to imagine how those situations could be seen as comparable. Chavs breaking into a shed vs a 10yr old kid picking up their football, I'm sure that's going to elicit the same reaction from a homeowner, not.
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Sorry 10 year old? Who mentioned that? I'm talking about two youths of similar age...?
 
[TW]Fox;15702670 said:
I wonder how long until the first bayliff is murdered...

'I THOUGHT HE WAS ENTERING WITHOUT MY PERMISSION!'
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Judging by your attitude around here I personally can't see you sitting idly by waiting for the cops whilst people jumped in through your kitchen window to get to a garden shed to then perhaps steal. :p
 
LeJosh said:
Judging by your attitude around here I personally can't see you sitting idly by waiting for the cops whilst people jumped in through your kitchen window to get to a garden shed to then perhaps steal. :p
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Have you never heard the term keyboard warrior, I'd run a mile :p
 
BigBl00 said:
"Get away from my shed I'm calling the police" is not the same as " Get away from my shed, I HAVE A KNIFE *wave shiny knife*", the latter is threating behaviour.
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In either case it's an understandable response to an intrusion on ones property as it makes the homeowner feel threatened and fearful for the safety of their child, regardless of attempt to gain entry to the house, it's human nature and the police should not be lecturing people on it.

The article also at no point suggests the house was also a target or this was anything other than a spir of the moment theft from a shed where they got caught red handed.
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No, but when you have a 2 year old child in the house instinct kicks in.

[TW]Fox;15702640 said:
Wow this term is getting annoying.
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If you learnt some critical thinking skills you wouldn't have the term directed at you so often. You can't make flawed analogies and then complain when people inform you of it.

Sorry 10 year old? Who mentioned that? I'm talking about two youths of similar age...?
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You didn't mention an age in that post so I assumed a realistic situation. ;) It doesn't matter what age they are, one is a threatening criminal activity one isn't, to suggest people would respond in the same way to both situations is not based in reality.
 
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I really think we should include the term "straw man" in Godwins law. It's turning into the same argument as that of Hitler and a way of not actually posting an answer...
 
VaderDSL said:
Because then she'd get charged for indecent exposure to a minor :D:p
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Meh, she can just say she was sunbathing naked... It's warm enough in Hertfordshire, although it is a bit cloudy...:p

Energize said:
No, but when you have a 2 year old child in the house instinct kicks in.
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So when you see a group of kids in your garden you instantly think they are going to gut your child? You have issues...
 
Amp34 said:
I really think we should include the term "straw man" in Godwins law. It's turning into the same argument as that of Hitler and a way of not actually posting an answer...
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The entire point of the straw man term - do you even know what it means? - is that someone is arguing an easy point even though it isn't actually the point in hand. You can't argue against it if it's not even relevant.
 
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