New 1060 barely faster than my old 960

VincentHanna · 24 Aug 2016 at 10:46

In laymens terms:

720p is 1020x720 - 734,400 pixels
1080p is 1920x1080 - 2,073,600 pixels

Currently your GPU is underutilised because it's not having to do much work. It's able to render so many frames per second that it's waiting for your CPU to do the calculations

If you render at 1080p, suddenly the GPU is having to do a lot more work and is less reliant on the CPU to send the calculations.

Why not buy a 2nd hand 1080p plasma?

I have a Panasonic VT50 55" screen in my bedroom that is 1080p and probably worthless to most people now.

danoliver1 · 24 Aug 2016 at 10:50

What frame rates are you getting? Run fraps to see.

bongpig · 24 Aug 2016 at 10:51

VincentHanna said:
In laymens terms:

720p is 1020x720 - 734,400 pixels
1080p is 1920x1080 - 2,073,600 pixels

Currently your GPU is underutilised because it's not having to do much work. It's able to render so many frames per second that it's waiting for your CPU to do the calculations

If you render at 1080p, suddenly the GPU is having to do a lot more work and is less reliant on the CPU to send the calculations.

Why not buy a 2nd hand 1080p plasma?

I have a Panasonic VT50 55" screen in my bedroom that is 1080p and probably worthless to most people now.

Cheers. So, for example, if I set DSR to 1.5, are you suggesting I will likely get very similar performance to what im getting now? I would be happy with that as I like the effect downscaling has on aliasing.

varkanoid · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:00

VincentHanna said:
In laymens terms:

720p is 1020x720 - 734,400 pixels
1080p is 1920x1080 - 2,073,600 pixels

Think you need to shoot the laymen as 720p is 1280 x 720 which is 921,600 pixels.
Which Plasma does the OP have and how are you connecting to it ?

VincentHanna · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:01

Yes.

Do you play with V-sync enabled? Assuming the Plasma is 60hz.

If you do that you are limiting the work your GPU has to do as it's waiting for the screen to refresh before pumping out the next frame.

So even use DSR 4x.

VincentHanna · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:02

varkanoid said:
Think you need to shoot the laymen as 720p is 1280 x 720.

Which Plasma does the OP have and how are you connecting to it ?

oops! Yep, my bad.

921600 pixels.

bongpig · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:05

varkanoid said:
Think you need to shoot the laymen as 720p is 1280 x 720.

Which Plasma does the OP have and how are you connecting to it ?

Im using a pretty old Panasonic panel. A PX70. I love the old thing.

Im connecting via HDMI. Can using HDMI make a difference?

VincentHanna said:
Yes.

Do you play with V-sync enabled? Assuming the Plasma is 60hz.

If you do that you are limiting the work your GPU has to do as it's waiting for the screen to refresh before pumping out the next frame.
So even use DSR 4x.

YEs, I pay with vsync. But for my tests, ive had vsync disabled so I can see the differences. I just did a complete driver clean and re-install and run the Hitman Absolution benchmark again. The results were *exactly* the same as my old 960.

Im going to try some DSR funk when I get a chance today.

varkanoid · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:13

bongpig said:
Im using a pretty old Panasonic panel. A PX70. I love the old thing.
Im connecting via HDMI. Can using HDMI make a difference?

Which size is it as the 37/42" is 1024 x 768 and the 50" is 1366 x 768
Although it says its 1080p via HDMI.

bongpig · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:16

varkanoid said:
Which size is it as the 37/42" is 1024 x 768 and the 50" is 1366 x 768
Although it says its 1080p via HDMI.

Its a 37". So internally its actually 1024. Pretty crap resolution, but then, resolution has never been important to me. Im far more interested in colour and lighting/shader quality as opposed sharpness.

Dunno about 1080p. Seems it will accept 1080i, but ive never managed to get it to play nice with 1080p.

VincentHanna · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:32

I know what you mean, I used to swear by Plasma screens and to be honest they still look far more cinematic than any LCD i've used (Not used an OLED yet)

But gaming wise I now run a 34" Acer IPS LED and it's really good.

Seanspeed · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:38

bongpig said:
Its a 37". So internally its actually 1024. Pretty crap resolution, but then, resolution has never been important to me. Im far more interested in colour and lighting/shader quality as opposed sharpness.

Dunno about 1080p. Seems it will accept 1080i, but ive never managed to get it to play nice with 1080p.

Oi.

That's quite a problem you have there. For one, you dont need a 1060 at 1024x768 by any means. You can downsample using the GPU's scaler(so it doesn't matter what your TV does or doesn't accept), but if resolution isn't something you prioritize at all, then that's not exactly going to bring you much improvement.

I'd sell the 1060 and reinstall the 960(if you still have it). Because without spending a lot of money, you're not going to find anything to match the black and color depth of a plasma if those matter that much to you. And most TV's that do compete are typically only found at 4k nowadays. I suppose you could try and source a 1920x1080 plasma if you want to brave the used TV market.

bongpig · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:38

VincentHanna said:
I know what you mean, I used to swear by Plasma screens and to be honest they still look far more cinematic than any LCD i've used (Not used an OLED yet)

But gaming wise I now run a 34" Acer IPS LED and it's really good.

Yeah, plasmas have a more natural picture than LCDs. Although LCDs have made huge strides, they are not quite there yet when it comes to colour reproduction.

Seanspeed said:
Oi.

That's quite a problem you have there. For one, you dont need a 1060 at 1024x768 by any means. You can downsample using the GPU's scaler(so it doesn't matter what your TV does or doesn't accept), but if resolution isn't something you prioritize at all, then that's not exactly going to bring you much improvement.

I'd sell the 1060 and reinstall the 960(if you still have it). Because without spending a lot of money, you're not going to find anything to match the black and color depth of a plasma if those matter that much to you. And most TV's that do compete are typically only found at 4k nowadays. I suppose you could try and source a 1920x1080 plasma if you want to brave the used TV market.

I can certainly dig some downsampling. So even though Im not looking for higher res, I would certainly appreciate the improvement in alasing.

My 960 could run most games at almost max settings at 60fps. I just wanted an extra little push to allow me those max settings. I wasnt expecting a massive jump. Just enough to give me those extra 5-10fps I was after. And seeing as the 1060 was only £30 more than a 970, I figured, why not? I was surprised I didnt even get the 5-10fps, even considering the bottleneck.

imginy · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:48

My old 7790 could max out any game at 720p.

Upgrading to 1060 is a complete waste of card as the 960 was already far too powereful.

I think you need to upgrade your screen

Seanspeed · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:50

bongpig said:
Yeah, plasmas have a more natural picture than LCDs. Although LCDs have made huge strides, they are not quite there yet when it comes to colour reproduction.

High end IPS monitors and TV's can certainly rival plasma in terms of color reproduction, but not black levels. High end VA monitors and TV's can rival plasma in terms of black levels, but not color reproduction. OLED is the only tech that can do both equally well(or better).

bongpig said:
I can certainly dig some downsampling. So even though Im not looking for higher res, I would certainly appreciate the improvement in alasing.

My 960 could run most games at almost max settings at 60fps. I just wanted an extra little push to allow me those max settings. I wasnt expecting a massive jump. Just enough to give me those extra 5-10fps I was after. And seeing as the 1060 was only £30 more than a 970, I figured, why not? I was surprised I didnt even get that, even considering the bottleneck.

Well then definitely give it a go. Use Nvidia's DSR options(using Nvidia Control Panel) and push your resolutions in-game to 1080p. This should bring the extra GPU power back into play.

You just have to ask yourself whether the improvement in aliasing is worth the cost of the GTX1060, I guess? I certainly wouldn't say it is, but that's up to you. My recommendation would still be to reinstall the 960 if you still have it and sell the GTX1060, which you could probably get near enough full price for it.

chroniclard · 24 Aug 2016 at 11:59

I would take 1080p gaming over 720p with marginally better colour reproduction/black levels(does it even matter that much when gaming).

JediFragger · 24 Aug 2016 at 12:01

Try DSR'ing upto 1080/1440p maybe? It'll improve the visuals and load up the gfx card a lot more...

bongpig · 24 Aug 2016 at 12:06

Seanspeed said:
High end IPS monitors and TV's can certainly rival plasma in terms of color reproduction, but not black levels. High end VA monitors and TV's can rival plasma in terms of black levels, but not color reproduction. OLED is the only tech that can do both equally well(or better).

Well then definitely give it a go. Use Nvidia's DSR options(using Nvidia Control Panel) and push your resolutions in-game to 1080p. This should bring the extra GPU power back into play.

You just have to ask yourself whether the improvement in aliasing is worth the cost of the GTX1060, I guess? I certainly wouldn't say it is, but that's up to you. My recommendation would still be to reinstall the 960 if you still have it and sell the GTX1060, which you could probably get near enough full price for it.

I only just got the 1060 yesterday from ***********, so I assume im still covered by 7 day returns. But in truth, I may keep it regardless as im confident ill upgrade some of the other components before the year is out.

After I do some more tests today, and if I can confirm the CPU is bottlenecking, I may well fork out for a 4670k in a few months.

chroniclard said:
I would take 1080p gaming over 720p with marginally better colour reproduction/black levels(does it even matter that much when gaming).

Its super important to me. Immersion is king. I love atmospheric/horror games. Without the black levels and subtle colours, it goes from being an immersive experience that I can disappear into, to simply sitting in my living room playing video games.

Razor Time · 24 Aug 2016 at 12:20

The black levels on your PX70 wont be that great, I have a PZ80 50" (the later model than yours) in the bedroom and the black levels are not as good as my local dimming display, in fact no where near. The blacks look grey in comparison to a local dimming display. Also black levels with your display would have reduced over the years. Your display if I am correct was released in 2007. Trust me a decent new display will kick your ageing plasma to the curb.

http://www.cnet.com/uk/news/2010-pa...s-but-should-remain-blacker-than-competition/

bongpig · 24 Aug 2016 at 12:27

Razor Time said:
The black levels on your PX70 wont be that great, I have a PZ80 50" (the later model than yours) in the bedroom and the black levels are not as good as my local dimming display, in fact no where near. The blacks look grey in comparison to a local dimming display. Also black levels with your display would have reduced over the years. Your display if I am correct was released in 2007. Trust me a decent new display will kick your ageing plasma to the curb.

http://www.cnet.com/uk/news/2010-pa...s-but-should-remain-blacker-than-competition/

Its not just the blacks. Its all the colours. I just dont dig the tones I see on most LCDs. Maybe im blind! But thats how it seems to me.

I just spoke to a chap at ***********, and he seemed to think theres something very off with my results. While he accepted that my CPU could cause some bottlenecking, he insisted it wouldn't be so bad as to see no improvement at all over a 960. He suggested a few benchmarks which im going to try. It may be that the card is faulty.

Razor Time · 24 Aug 2016 at 12:33

bongpig said:
Its not just the blacks. Its all the colours. I just dont dig the tones I see on most LCDs. Maybe im blind! But thats how it seems to me.

I think you will find no issues with colours if the display is decent and calibrated or well setup. When you see a display in a shop its in Store Mode which is ultra vibrant which over saturates colours to catch shoppers eyes and to compete with bright shop floor lighting. This is not how displays are setup in the home.

The PX70 will be very limited in its colour and picture setup/customisation compared to more modern displays. I know my PZ80 has always seemed very limited in this regard. Therefore as long as you buy a decent display you will be able to tweak to hearts content and find the colour settings which is suitable to your eyes.