New system for gaming and VR

[Tetras]

Ah. I like to consider myself brand agnostic - but I have to admit I've always had Intel, because they've always been the suggested best at the time I was putting together a system. And, probably largely because of that, I understand their naming patterns better!

As Quartz mentioned, the Intel CPUs have been replaced by a new generation and since they're potentially problematic there's not much reason to buy one apart from a great deal.

The 15th gen is not called 15th gen, it is "Core Ultra". The Core Ultra CPUs are not bad CPUs, for productivity or mixed usage they're actually pretty good and improvements over 14th gen. Unfortunately their gaming performance is not great (relatively, they're not terrible) and their performance (even after all the fixes/updates from Intel) remains somewhat inconsistent.

We're learning what memory works best for them and they do appear to respond to that, but the AMD X3D CPUs are still what I'd pick for a gaming focused build.

I guess the same question holds true for the motherboards though - just the AMD compatible equivalents. What would they be? Something like the MSI X-870P and the ASUS X-870F?

The 2nd gen boards are: X870/X870E and B850/B840. 1st gen boards (670/650/620) will still work for a 9000 series CPU (were meant for 7000), but they might need a BIOS update for full support.

If you want PCI-E 5.0 graphics: you will need B650E, B850 or X870/X870E.

PCI-E 5.0 M.2 can be available on any board, but it depends.

X870/X870E has mandatory USB4, but B850 does not.

If you plan on a lot of storage (filling the m.2 slots) X870/X870E can be more problematic than B650E/B850 because the USB4 steals (on most boards anyhow) 4 CPU lanes.

There's a detailed spreadsheet of the features linked to here, which has been updated for the latest boards:

https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/xvvl9b/comment/ir6koh8/

Same is true of nVidia for the GPU for that matter.

The 9070 XT/9070 are competitive on price (if you can get one and at the price they're supposed To be) and I'd normally suggest you check them out and see if they can be good enough,.. but I don't know how they do with VR.

You may want to read this thread:

AMD 9070XT VR good idea?

Looking to get a new GPU for mostly VR and I was going to go with 5070TI, but it's crazy £900+ prices don't seem like a good idea. Only thing not being 100% on AMD is I read it's not as supported in VR as NVIDIA over wireless using virtual desktop. Using my RTX 2070 in VR been very good with...

forums.overclockers.co.uk

 

[Subliminal Aura]

The X3D models have extra cache, which boosts game performance considerably.

In some games ... not all

Also as above I would strongly suggest the 9070XT too, providing you can get it at a good price
The Nvidia cards are a nightmare to get hold of

 

[Subliminal Aura]

X870/X870E has mandatory USB4, but B850 does not.

I've been looking at this board which also has USB4

ROG Crosshair X670E Gene Motherboard

The ROG Crosshair X670E Gene is a micro ATX (mATX) powerhouse that is tuned and optimised to get the most out of AMD Ryzen™ 7000 Series processors. With bulked-up power delivery and heatsinks and PCIe 5.0, DDR5, WiFi 6E, and USB4 for enthusiasts that want a compact AM5 build on the desktop.

rog.asus.com

 

[Tetras]

I've been looking at this board which also has USB4

ROG Crosshair X670E Gene Motherboard

The ROG Crosshair X670E Gene is a micro ATX (mATX) powerhouse that is tuned and optimised to get the most out of AMD Ryzen™ 7000 Series processors. With bulked-up power delivery and heatsinks and PCIe 5.0, DDR5, WiFi 6E, and USB4 for enthusiasts that want a compact AM5 build on the desktop.

rog.asus.com

Yeah, a few of the first gen boards had it too. Though, the spreadsheet notes that they do also share bandwidth with M.2 slots (same as X870), it just isn't mentioned in the manual

 

[bazzabear]

Thanks, you guys are awesome!

Can you critique this build then?

The motherboard I've picked because it seems more future proof - maximum m.2 slots, and USB 4 and wifi 7 compatible. Overkill though?
The CPU - should I want to spend the extra for the 9950? Or is there a law of diminishing returns there? I don't mind spending the money if there's a genuine benefit to it.
The GPU - I've just picked the cheapest available 5080. But are there others which are better - whether that be performance, customer service, etc?
The fans - not sure about this. Was thinking to replace the case-included with known low noise fans. Maybe not necessary?

My basket at OcUK:

• 1 x Lian Li Lancool 207 M-ATX case - Black (SKU: CAS-LIA-02814) = £74.99
• 1 x Corsair HXi Series HX1000i Fully Modular Ultra-Low Noise ATX Digital Power Supply (CP-9020259-UK) (SKU: CA-27Q-CS) = £219.95
• 1 x AMD Ryzen 9 9900X3D Twelve Core 5.50GHz (Socket AM5) Processor - Retail (SKU: PRO-AMD-04503) = £599.98
• 1 x PNY GeForce RTX 5080 ARGB OC Triple Fan 16GB GDDR7 PCI-Express Graphics Card (SKU: GRA-PNY-03927) = £1,289.99
• 1 x Corsair NAUTILUS 360 RS All In One CPU Cooler - 360mm (SKU: COO-CRS-03514) = £109.99
• 2 x Asus ROG STRIX X870-F GAMING WIFI (Socket AM5) DDR5 ATX Motherboard (SKU: MOT-ASU-03086) = £400.00
• 1 x Corsair Vengeance 64GB (2X32GB) DDR5 PC5-41600C40 5200MHz Dual Channel Kit - Black (CMK64GX5M2B5200C40 (SKU: MY-4DC-CS) = £139.99
• 4 x be quiet Pure Wings 3 120mm High Speed PWM Fan (SKU: COO-BEQ-01129) = £9.95
• 2 x WD Black SN7100 2TB SSD NVME M.2 2280 PCIe 4.0 Solid State Drive (SKU: STO-WDC-04135) = £125.99

Total: £3,538.64 (includes delivery: £11.98)​

 

[bazzabear]

I've immediately spotted that the ASUS TUF version of that motherboard seems to have very similar spec for significantly less money.

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/asus-tuf-gaming-x870-plus-wifi-socket-am5-ddr5-atx-motherboard-mot-asu-03088.html

 

[bazzabear]

Oh, and the fans. If I do go with replacing them - I've realised I should probably be aiming for 140mm ones for the front.
So I'd be aiming for 2x140mm for the front, 2x120mm for above the PSU, and 2x120mm for the back - I think.

 

[Tetras]

1 x Lian Li Lancool 207 M-ATX case - Black (SKU: CAS-LIA-02814) = £74.99

If you're going with a high-end build with water cooling and a 5080, I'd be inclined to get the 216 instead. It also has better stock cooling. If you like ARGB, consider Antec's C5 ARGB, which has 7x 120mm ARGB fans included.

Asus ROG STRIX X870-F GAMING WIFI (Socket AM5) DDR5 ATX Motherboard (SKU: MOT-ASU-03086) = £400.00

I've immediately spotted that the ASUS TUF version of that motherboard seems to have very similar spec for significantly less money.

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/asus-tuf-gaming-x870-plus-wifi-socket-am5-ddr5-atx-motherboard-mot-asu-03088.html

Yeah, £400 is much more than you need to pay here. What does VR need in terms of USB, sound jacks and such? Do you need SPDIF and a Type-C?

The CPU - should I want to spend the extra for the 9950? Or is there a law of diminishing returns there? I don't mind spending the money if there's a genuine benefit to it.

1 x AMD Ryzen 9 9900X3D Twelve Core 5.50GHz (Socket AM5) Processor - Retail (SKU: PRO-AMD-04503) = £599.98

In the previous gen, the 12 core model was generally the slowest (at gaming) of the three CPUs and it looks like this gen is the same.

But, there's no way I'd fork out for the 9950X3D on a gaming build, just to overcome the small loss in performance. If you're ONLY gaming, the 9800X3D is the most competitive CPU.

That said, I don't know if VR puts any extra demands on the CPU, that would help the 12 core CPU come out on top. Though, the 8 core CPU is hardly weak at multitasking.

1 x Corsair Vengeance 64GB (2X32GB) DDR5 PC5-41600C40 5200MHz Dual Channel Kit - Black (CMK64GX5M2B5200C40 (SKU: MY-4DC-CS) = £139.99

The X3D CPUs are not sensitive to memory speed so not a big deal, but, this is pretty much a baseline kit. The recommended/optimal speed for AMD AM5 CPUs is 6000/C30.

1 x Corsair NAUTILUS 360 RS All In One CPU Cooler - 360mm (SKU: COO-CRS-03514) = £109.99

If you like AIOs for looks, fair enough, but these CPUs don't need a 360mm AIO. A decent tower cooler like the peerless assassin/phantom spirit can handle them.

1 x PNY GeForce RTX 5080 ARGB OC Triple Fan 16GB GDDR7 PCI-Express Graphics Card (SKU: GRA-PNY-03927) = £1,289.99

Did you check the 9070 XT's competitiveness for VR?

From what I'm aware, the 5080 is only around 15-20% faster in raster.

 

[Subliminal Aura]

If I were building a new machine ... sexy RGB RAM would be a must - Are the g.skills still the best looking ? The dominator plats didn't do it for me

Also a curved tempered glass case something along the lines of

Antec C8 Curve Wood Full Tower Case - Black

Order Antec C8 Curve Wood Full Tower Case - Black now online and benefit from fast delivery.

www.overclockers.co.uk

 

[bazzabear]

If you're going with a high-end build with water cooling and a 5080, I'd be inclined to get the 216 instead. It also has better stock cooling. If you like ARGB, consider Antec's C5 ARGB, which has 7x 120mm ARGB fans included.

Thanks!

216 is just a mite too tall for my needs.
In fact, I have no interest in RGB at all, as the case will be tucked away in a (vented front and rear) cupboard. What I am interested in is as good cooling as possible (because of the cupboard) and as quiet as possible.

Yeah, £400 is much more than you need to pay here. What does VR need in terms of USB, sound jacks and such? Do you need SPDIF and a Type-C?

The VR itself doesn't particularly need USB - although I might play it physically connected for racing games, now I think about it. Don't have any particular need for SPDIF as far as I know. I have an external DAC/soundcard which will be connected too.
So you think the TUF motherboard? Or is even that overkill?

In the previous gen, the 12 core model was generally the slowest (at gaming) of the three CPUs and it looks like this gen is the same.

But, there's no way I'd fork out for the 9950X3D on a gaming build, just to overcome the small loss in performance. If you're ONLY gaming, the 9800X3D is the most competitive CPU.

That said, I don't know if VR puts any extra demands on the CPU, that would help the 12 core CPU come out on top. Though, the 8 core CPU is hardly weak at multitasking.

That's interesting! OK, I definitely won't push for the 9950 then.

The X3D CPUs are not sensitive to memory speed so not a big deal, but, this is pretty much a baseline kit. The recommended/optimal speed for AMD AM5 CPUs is 6000/C30.

Great info, thanks. I'd just picked out something that wasn't RGB on the basis of there being no point paying for that! Struggling to find 6000 set without RGB, but it's not a problem having it, just no benefit! So something like this?

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/kingston-fury-beast-rgb-64gb-2x32gb-ddr5-pc5-44800c40-5600mhz-dual-channe-my-29v-ks.html

If you like AIOs for looks, fair enough, but these CPUs don't need a 360mm AIO. A decent tower cooler like the peerless assassin/phantom spirit can handle them.

That's interesting too! I had picked an AIO (and as you see, one with no RGB again!) just because I assumed better cooling and quieter.
Would something like this match an AIO in both those terms? (I keep picking out Be Quiet stuff where air movement is concerned, as I've found them very quiet in the past):

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/be-quiet-dark-rock-pro-5-cpu-air-cooler-coo-beq-01057.html

EDIT: Obviously not that one - just realised I picked one for an Intel CPU.
In my defence, OC have it listed when you look for AM5 coolers!

Did you check the 9070 XT's competitiveness for VR?

From what I'm aware, the 5080 is only around 15-20% faster in raster.

I've not found much, beyond a general perception that nVidia cards work better for driving VR, which is why I stuck with one. Oh - I also have a gSync monitor.

 

[bazzabear]

If I were building a new machine ... sexy RGB RAM would be a must - Are the g.skills still the best looking ? The dominator plats didn't do it for me

Also a curved tempered glass case something along the lines of

Antec C8 Curve Wood Full Tower Case - Black

Order Antec C8 Curve Wood Full Tower Case - Black now online and benefit from fast delivery.

www.overclockers.co.uk

Ooooo. That is definitely pretty! I would agree with you entirely, if it wasn't that my case will be completely tucked away!

 

[Tetras]

So you think the TUF motherboard? Or is even that overkill?

Personally, I would be reluctant to pay more than £250 for an X870 board, preferably as close to £200 as possible, unless there's specific features you want/need from a higher-end board.

The VRM quality is pretty much irrelevant on these boards too.

The spreadsheet linked here can be used for comparison:

https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/xvvl9b/comment/ir6koh8/

Note that ASRock have had reported issues with the X3D CPUs (meant to be addressed with a BIOS update), so best avoided for the moment.

That's interesting too! I had picked an AIO (and as you see, one with no RGB again!) just because I assumed better cooling and quieter.
Would something like this match an AIO in both those terms? (I keep picking out Be Quiet stuff where air movement is concerned, as I've found them very quiet in the past):

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/be-quiet-dark-rock-pro-5-cpu-air-cooler-coo-beq-01057.html

EDIT: Obviously not that one - just realised I picked one for an Intel CPU.
In my defence, OC have it listed when you look for AM5 coolers!

I wouldn't spend that much. If you pay nearly £100 for an air cooler you might as well just get the AIO. The peerless assassin/phantom spirit perform very well for their price, which is why they're widely recommended.

The freezer 36 (£23 at OCUK) is also capable of cooling these CPUs.

I've not found much, beyond a general perception that nVidia cards work better for driving VR, which is why I stuck with one. Oh - I also have a gSync monitor.

From what I'm aware (I don't use VR) one of the big issues was their more limited encoding/decoding quality and codec support, but I think AMD have addressed that with RDNA 4. The thread I linked has more info than I can share here. If they are sufficient, a 9070 XT at £600(ish) is going to be way better value than a 5080 at £1300, but obviously if the 9070 XT doesn't work well for what you need, then the price/perf is irrelevant. You'd also have to find one, which is not easy to do either.

Great info, thanks. I'd just picked out something that wasn't RGB on the basis of there being no point paying for that! Struggling to find 6000 set without RGB, but it's not a problem having it, just no benefit! So something like this?

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/kingston-fury-beast-rgb-64gb-2x32gb-ddr5-pc5-44800c40-5600mhz-dual-channe-my-29v-ks.html

The kit I normally include in my non-RGB builds is this one:

My basket at OcUK:

• 1 x Corsair Vengeance EXPO 64GB (2X32GB) DDR5 PC5-48000C30 6000MHz Dual Channel (SKU: MEM-CRS-02841) = £179.99

Total: £183.98 (includes delivery: £3.99)​

You can get the non-RGB version of that Kingston kit pretty cheap when on offer.