We already have that - they're called NHS England. Sometimes the government comes along and changes things (like the Tories with the Health and Social Care act in 2012), but for the most part the Department of Health don't really get involved as much as people think.
NHS Rant
- Thread starter Ace Modder
- Start date
We already have that - they're called NHS England. Sometimes the government comes along and changes things (like the Tories with the Health and Social Care act in 2012), but for the most part the Department of Health don't really get involved as much as people think.
Soldato
- Joined
- 30 Sep 2005
- Posts
- 16,693
I don't think people mind paying a bit more, it's just that they don't feel confident in the government not peeing it up the wall
Caporegime
Unfortunately this doesn’t provide anywhere near the amount of distance between NHS function and government that is needed.
In what way?
Caporegime
Even simple things such as the Government dictating Doctor’s contracts/training numbers have vast implications on day to day running of the NHS. The DoH also meets out targets to NHSE.
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A lot of blanket blame going on here. Just because you've had a negative experience in one department doesn't necessarily mean that the whole Trust will be the same, let alone the NHS as a whole.
Speaking as someone that's worked in the NHS for over 10 years now, as well as having a mother that worked VERY high up in one particular Trust, more money only solves the issue for so long.
Drug and engineering companies CONSISTENTLY raise the prices of their products to exorbitant levels. A single Bilimeter which measures for jaundice on the skin can cost over £3000... it's a bit of plastic with a sensor on. Reads 4 numbers on a tiny digital screen... This problem will only become worse as time goes on, what with improvements in medical science and equipment in general.
Then there's the fact that with an ever increasing population, not too mention an increase in the number of elderly people, the numbers just keep getting bigger and bigger.
Private healthcare can be just as bad if not worse as well. 2 people I know have had horrific experiences with regards to their treatment via BUPA. The experience in general as well as the mortality rates are often comparatively higher when compared to the NHS. They just don't have the experience or the infrastructure to cope half the time.
I'm not saying the NHS is perfect, but you're an ignorant fool if you believe it harms more people then it helps.
Speaking as someone that's worked in the NHS for over 10 years now, as well as having a mother that worked VERY high up in one particular Trust, more money only solves the issue for so long.
Drug and engineering companies CONSISTENTLY raise the prices of their products to exorbitant levels. A single Bilimeter which measures for jaundice on the skin can cost over £3000... it's a bit of plastic with a sensor on. Reads 4 numbers on a tiny digital screen... This problem will only become worse as time goes on, what with improvements in medical science and equipment in general.
Then there's the fact that with an ever increasing population, not too mention an increase in the number of elderly people, the numbers just keep getting bigger and bigger.
Private healthcare can be just as bad if not worse as well. 2 people I know have had horrific experiences with regards to their treatment via BUPA. The experience in general as well as the mortality rates are often comparatively higher when compared to the NHS. They just don't have the experience or the infrastructure to cope half the time.
I'm not saying the NHS is perfect, but you're an ignorant fool if you believe it harms more people then it helps.
I don’t see how making all of that private would help (except to take money out of the system). Maybe I’m just old fashioned though and don’t believe you should profit excessively from people’s ill health.
Caporegime
I don’t want to make anything private, I just want the NHS made independent of being a political football.
The Government over the last few years has out its blinkers on and attacked cost at the expense of patient care across the board. We all sit there on the shop floor and watch the damage done as the short sighted strategy wreaks havok.
This isn't "great news", it's common sense, and frankly I'm staggered so many seem to have skipped the part whereby, you pay for something, it happens sooner.
Now, let's move the entire NHS away from a free model, to a pay for model, and see how long it takes before everyone screams that they miss free healthcare. I'm guessing hours, not days.
Now, let's move the entire NHS away from a free model, to a pay for model, and see how long it takes before everyone screams that they miss free healthcare. I'm guessing hours, not days.
Man of Honour
And if every body paid we'd be back at square one
My daughter was born with duplex kidneys which not all that uncommon; however, she had the worst form of it possible. Of the four kidney's she effectively had, only one was working, another running at 10%, and the two others completely dead. She also had duplicated ureter's. What was the result? Within a week of being born she had her first bout of sepsis, which I probably don't have to state is about as serious as it gets for anyone, let alone a newborn.
Over the following year she wasn't at home for more than a few weeks, and was constantly getting life-threatening UTI's and sepsis. Her second year was marginally better - she underwent major surgery to remove the two dead parts of each kidney, totalling around 20 hours of major surgery over two instances. She had to put up with armies of nurses forcefully pinning her down every couple of hours, day in and day out, for all the various tests that needed to be done (she now struggles to be in a room with anyone in a doctor or nurses outfit). She's been in ICU. She's still on 5 different medications three times a day... some of those only normally prescribed to adults.
She's now three years old and hasn't had a UTI that we have detected in bang on a year. She is still under the care of several different specialists at two different hospitals, and has regular appointments to check progress. We also have direct access to the wards on one of the hospitals - there is no waiting around a local GP for a cold... straight into hospital and onto heavy duty antibiotics (many UTI's have similar symptoms to the common cold).
Whilst it may feel shambolic at times, the doctors and nurses in it have kept my daughter alive. No ifs, no buts... she would not be here. No amount of taxes I ever pay that go towards the upkeep of the NHS will ever come close to repaying what those wonderful folk have done.
Having been part of something like this, it has also given an insight into how overworked and understaffed the front line is. Nurse salaries should be doubled on the spot - it's a criminally underpaid sector. The doctors live and breathe their work. On more than one occasion our daughters surgeon travelled back to hospital in his own time, once at 11pm at night specifically to check in on my daughter. On the occasion where he did turn up late one night, he looked utterly destroyed and genuinely as upset/ concerned as we were.
If we were living in America, my daughter would be dead. It's that simple. Some of the regular procedures and tests she has had/needs would cost tens of thousands outside of the NHS. She's almost certainly had something in the region of £500k - 1m in care so far. The NHS is doing the best it can with the painfully inadequate resources successive governments have given it. It is literally performing miracles on a daily basis.
Over the following year she wasn't at home for more than a few weeks, and was constantly getting life-threatening UTI's and sepsis. Her second year was marginally better - she underwent major surgery to remove the two dead parts of each kidney, totalling around 20 hours of major surgery over two instances. She had to put up with armies of nurses forcefully pinning her down every couple of hours, day in and day out, for all the various tests that needed to be done (she now struggles to be in a room with anyone in a doctor or nurses outfit). She's been in ICU. She's still on 5 different medications three times a day... some of those only normally prescribed to adults.
She's now three years old and hasn't had a UTI that we have detected in bang on a year. She is still under the care of several different specialists at two different hospitals, and has regular appointments to check progress. We also have direct access to the wards on one of the hospitals - there is no waiting around a local GP for a cold... straight into hospital and onto heavy duty antibiotics (many UTI's have similar symptoms to the common cold).
Whilst it may feel shambolic at times, the doctors and nurses in it have kept my daughter alive. No ifs, no buts... she would not be here. No amount of taxes I ever pay that go towards the upkeep of the NHS will ever come close to repaying what those wonderful folk have done.
Having been part of something like this, it has also given an insight into how overworked and understaffed the front line is. Nurse salaries should be doubled on the spot - it's a criminally underpaid sector. The doctors live and breathe their work. On more than one occasion our daughters surgeon travelled back to hospital in his own time, once at 11pm at night specifically to check in on my daughter. On the occasion where he did turn up late one night, he looked utterly destroyed and genuinely as upset/ concerned as we were.
If we were living in America, my daughter would be dead. It's that simple. Some of the regular procedures and tests she has had/needs would cost tens of thousands outside of the NHS. She's almost certainly had something in the region of £500k - 1m in care so far. The NHS is doing the best it can with the painfully inadequate resources successive governments have given it. It is literally performing miracles on a daily basis.
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pray, tell, how much should us,servantsdoctors earn then?
my on-call shifts are 1 in 2 (ie 7 12.5h day shifts and 7 12.5h night shifts every 4 weeks) in addition to my normal 8-5 working days to make up the rest.
this is my pay slip for reference.
£26.37/h gross pay.
this is me after working 6 years, and as a medical registrar covering ~450 patients during on-calls, granted, with (up to, not always guaranteed due to rota gaps) 3 other more junior medical doctors.
This is per week right? I didn't think people still earned so little monthly
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Associate
- Joined
- 15 Oct 2015
- Posts
- 1,480
That's per month. Nurses makes way less than that. I actually make more a month as a HCA than some of the nurses I work with (but ok, I get a lot extra due to my night shifts and weekends I do, plus worked for NHS for 8 years now).
You aren't making profit from ill health, you're making profit by providing an excellent health service that people want to use, you're so good at that people choose to use your health service over the other options available.
Soldato
Yeah. Nah.
Yeah profit is bad, Corbyn, Corbyn, Stalin!
Caporegime
How many people complaining about the NHS have actually experience healthcare in countries where it is privatized?
As a saffa immigrant, I am all for the NHS, even with it's issues, better than people dying in the streets (which I literally would have done in SA had my dad not been able to get to the hospital an put a deposit on his credit card for my emergency appendectomy).
As a saffa immigrant, I am all for the NHS, even with it's issues, better than people dying in the streets (which I literally would have done in SA had my dad not been able to get to the hospital an put a deposit on his credit card for my emergency appendectomy).
Soldato
Err yeah. Nah.