Non Fault Claim

Spartacus

Spartacus

Spartacus

Associate
Joined
28 Oct 2005
Posts
733
Hi, yesterday afternoon someone pulled out on me whist I was on an A road and it looks as though my BMW F30 could be written off due to the amount of damage (air bags going off etc). The Third party have admitted liability and today their insurer had tried to contact me and send text messages explaining how they want to help with my claim and provide a like a like hire car etc.

My own insurance company (RAC) have started the ball rolling with my claim and say Enterprise will be in touch to arrange repairs to my vehicle (if not written off) at a local garage/body shop we agreed on whist I reported the accident.

Is it generally better to let the third party insurance deal with the claim when they are liable or to go through my own insurance and let them claim it back from the other insurer?

I’m also hoping to get a reasonably fair payout for my car so I can replace like for like, (not a low trade in value) and can hold out for payout if necessary due to owning another car.
 
Spartacus said:
Hi, yesterday afternoon someone pulled out on me whist I was on an A road and it looks as though my BMW F30 could be written off due to the amount of damage (air bags going off etc). The Third party have admitted liability and today their insurer had tried to contact me and send text messages explaining how they want to help with my claim and provide a like a like hire car etc.

My own insurance company (RAC) have started the ball rolling with my claim and say Enterprise will be in touch to arrange repairs to my vehicle (if not written off) at a local garage/body shop we agreed on whist I reported the accident.

Is it generally better to let the third party insurance deal with the claim when they are liable or to go through my own insurance and let them claim it back from the other insurer?

I’m also hoping to get a reasonably fair payout for my car so I can replace like for like, (not a low trade in value) and can hold out for payout if necessary due to owning another car.
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Difficult to say. My father had someone T-Bone him about 3 years ago and both insurance companies were absolutely hopeless. He got a hire car straight away through our insurers but it took 3 months for them to assess his car! The other party then queried the cost, sent another assessor out which took another month. After another month they finally agreed to the costs and sent it to their approved bodyshop for repair.

Where it stayed for 6 months.

When it came back they'd been unable to source some cosmetic parts so had removed them (even from the undamaged side of the vehicle). It was covered in overspray. They'd missed damage to a panel which they later claimed hadn't actually been missed but they couldn't get the panel due to stock issues and would replace it when it came in to stock, they couldn't say why we hadn't been informed of this. The decals hadn't been replaced. Oh and it hadn't even been cleaned.

Raised a complaint through their insurers who did nothing. Raised a complaint through ours who basically said contact theirs. Complaint raised through the ombudsman who kicked ours in to touch and another 3 months later it was partially resolved but we never received the cosmetics so instead received £1k to buy an alternative set.
 
The ‘at fault’ insurance company will prefer to deal with you directly as it will certainly be cheaper for them as it will minimise charges from your insurance company. It’s difficult to know who will treat you best tbh.
 
Do not accept any hire car from any third party contract hire company that your own insurer suggests. I fell into this trap last year and 6 months later am currently awaiting a court date as the third parties insurance is refusing to pay the ridiculously high hire car prices and I'm liable
 
XeNoN89 said:
Do not accept any hire car from any third party contract hire company that your own insurer suggests. I fell into this trap last year and 6 months later am currently awaiting a court date as the third parties insurance is refusing to pay the ridiculously high hire car prices and I'm liable
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Thats odd, I had my previous E43 was smashed into by a drunk driver and had a hire car from my insurer. It was a V6 Touareg which cost a fortune to hire and I had it for a few weeks and my claim was fully recovered from the third party insurer.

Edit: Just did a search for the thread and I had the Touareg for 11 weeks with the invoice for the first week of £1285, although the rental price probably went down over the 11 weeks
 
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Bear said:
Thats odd, I had my previous E43 was smashed into by a drunk driver and had a hire car from my insurer. It was a V6 Touareg which cost a fortune to hire and I had it for a few weeks and my claim was fully recovered from the third party insurer.

Edit: Just did a search for the thread and I had the Touareg for 11 weeks with the invoice for the first week of £1285, although the rental price probably went down over the 11 weeks
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I had the hire car (M135i) for almost 2 months the bill at the end was around £9k! The issue is that the third party insurance can just refuse to pay it, even if they admitted liability for the actual crash and paid out to cover the car.
 
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XeNoN89 said:
I had the hire car (M135i) for almost 2 months the bill at the end was around £9k! The issue is that the third party insurance can just refuse to pay it, even if they admitted liability for the actual crash and paid out to cover the car.
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Wow, I didnt think they could do that. Obviously, they want to stop people taking the mick and hiring something outrageous but if what you are hiring is similar in class to your car, I would have thought that was reasonable. If I took the first week hire cost of £1285 for the Touareg which I had for 11 weeks that would come to a touch over £14k!! No doubt they got a bit of discount due to the length of the hire, but they paid up all the same and that included a £16k bill for fixing my car
 
Bear in mind if you go through your own insurer, it may well be treated as a 'fault' claim until such time as they actually recover their costs from the third party insurer - can be more troublesome if you're around renewal time, as they will then want to renew/quote on the basis you come with a fault claim.
 
Thanks for the reply’s guys. I’m leaning towards getting in touch with the third party insurer and letting them handle the claim so it’s a more straightforward no fault claim from the start.

The only thing that puts me off a little is that the third party insurance is Haven and the parent company is Acorn which has horrendous reviews online.

Also, if the third party take the **** and offer a really low value for my car which is no where near enough to replace like for like can I go back to my own insurance and ask them to intervene with Haven or do I only have the Ombudsman to turn to?
 
Spartacus said:
Thanks for the reply’s guys. I’m leaning towards getting in touch with the third party insurer and letting them handle the claim so it’s a more straightforward no fault claim from the start.

The only thing that puts me off a little is that the third party insurance is Haven and the parent company is Acorn which has horrendous reviews online.

Also, if the third party take the **** and offer a really low value for my car which is no where near enough to replace like for like can I go back to my own insurance and ask them to intervene with Haven or do I only have the Ombudsman to turn to?
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you can always go back to your own insurer. as you are not in contract with them then you can change your mind. they will offer market value for the vehicle so it wont take in to account the garage profit etc. The third party insurer will mostly challenge Credit Hire company hire rates, whereas if they are arranging a hire vehicle for you, using someone like VRG or enterprise then usually those ones go through without issue.
 
SGWills said:
you can always go back to your own insurer. as you are not in contract with them then you can change your mind. they will offer market value for the vehicle so it wont take in to account the garage profit etc. The third party insurer will mostly challenge Credit Hire company hire rates, whereas if they are arranging a hire vehicle for you, using someone like VRG or enterprise then usually those ones go through without issue.
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Yeah this is where it gets complicated. Technically I’m supposed to be able to replace my car like for like from a car dealer, without being out of pocket. For that I will need around 14k minimum.

We buy any car currently values my car at £11400, but that would leave me considerably out of pocket even if I buy from a private seller because there’s nothing the same age and mileage with the 3 litre engine anywhere near that price unless it’s a repaired write off on eBay.

I can hold out for a fair offer though.
 
Don't overcomplicate things. Go through your insurance and let them deal with the other insurance company. That is the advice your insurance would give too. You have no 'contract' with the third party at all.
 
Spartacus said:
Yeah this is where it gets complicated. Technically I’m supposed to be able to replace my car like for like from a car dealer, without being out of pocket. For that I will need around 14k minimum.

We buy any car currently values my car at £11400, but that would leave me considerably out of pocket even if I buy from a private seller because there’s nothing the same age and mileage with the 3 litre engine anywhere near that price unless it’s a repaired write off on eBay.

I can hold out for a fair offer though.
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If there's concerns over the value placed on the vehicle then claiming via your own insurer might be better as like mentioned above, you wont be in contract with the third party insurer so holding out or complaining might not change anything.

Been a few years since i needed to resolve total loss side of things however i would wait to see whats offered, hopefully what is put forward is acceptable. If not, submit them examples of vehicles of same age, mileage, spec and ask them to take it in to consideration, but you might be met with the response about market value/garage or seller profit margins etc
 
Insurance is there to put you back to a position that you were in before the accident or claim with no material loss or inconvenience. Of course some Insurers won’t want to do that and will try and lowball you to save themselves money. As said by @SGWills above, gather evidence of similar age and mileage cars and their value.
 
Spartacus said:
Yeah this is where it gets complicated. Technically I’m supposed to be able to replace my car like for like from a car dealer, without being out of pocket. For that I will need around 14k minimum.

We buy any car currently values my car at £11400, but that would leave me considerably out of pocket even if I buy from a private seller because there’s nothing the same age and mileage with the 3 litre engine anywhere near that price unless it’s a repaired write off on eBay.

I can hold out for a fair offer though.
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WBAC are buying your vehicle to then sell on, this isn't fair market value regardless how many insurance co's would like us to think it is.

My understanding of Fair market value is what it would cost if you went to a business to purchase it.

Check over the sales of your vehicle (as close as poss spec wise) over the last few month and use this as evidence of what yours is worth ballpark.
 
Absolutely go through the 3rd party insurance company. If you do this:

- you'll get a like for like hire car
- you'll not have to pay an excess
- you'll not have your NCD suspended

If you go through your own insurance company they'll potentially treat it as a fault claim until it is fully settled and paid for by the other insurance company. This may mean:

- you'll have to pay your excess
- you'll have you NCD reduced or suspended
- you'll get a crappy 3dr hatchback Hyundai i10 as your courtesy car

3rd party insurance companies like to deal straight with the non fault party because they can then be in charge of all the costs and don't get billed ridiculous amounts for ridiculous things. I got treated like royalty when my car was damaged and the other party admitted fault. They told me I could take the car anywhere I wanted to be fixed and wanted to give me a BMW 7 Series as my hire car.
 
Gaygle said:
Absolutely go through the 3rd party insurance company. If you do this:

- you'll get a like for like hire car
- you'll not have to pay an excess
- you'll not have your NCD suspended

If you go through your own insurance company they'll potentially treat it as a fault claim until it is fully settled and paid for by the other insurance company. This may mean:

- you'll have to pay your excess
- you'll have you NCD reduced or suspended
- you'll get a crappy 3dr hatchback Hyundai i10 as your courtesy car

3rd party insurance companies like to deal straight with the non fault party because they can then be in charge of all the costs and don't get billed ridiculous amounts for ridiculous things. I got treated like royalty when my car was damaged and the other party admitted fault. They told me I could take the car anywhere I wanted to be fixed and wanted to give me a BMW 7 Series as my hire car.
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Deffo this is the best way.

I made a mistake of using my own insurance when my parked car was hit by a milk float (I was asleep)… CCTV to the rescue.

My insurance faffed big time about me being injured and all kinds.

Had a similar thing happen since to the wife’s car and we used the third party people. Was absolutely seamless.
 
XeNoN89 said:
I had the hire car (M135i) for almost 2 months the bill at the end was around £9k! The issue is that the third party insurance can just refuse to pay it, even if they admitted liability for the actual crash and paid out to cover the car.
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That's an absurd rental rate for 2 months.

Was that with a large hire car chain? Or a dodgy one with absurdly high rental charges aimed at scamming insurance companies (used solely by claims management companies).

I'd be furious at your own insurance company. (The OPs company is using Enterprise, so it will all be above board and hard to dispute)

A lot of brokers, who just resell insurance, make money this way, devising extra income streams. They are often the ones with ridiculous fees, "arrangement fee", "renewal fee" etc. even though they are already earning commission.
 
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