Not Available whilst on Call - Sack able Offence?

I thinks it's good that the law is being looked at, a lot of people don't really get a choice when asked to go on call - kick up a stink about it and your cards are marked as it were.

But no drinking/going out socialising, concerts, cinemas, trips to see family etc etc is a big thing to ask of people when its say one week in 3 or 4 - not healthy even if there not actually being called regularly.
 
BongoHunter said:
I thinks it's good that the law is being looked at, a lot of people don't really get a choice when asked to go on call - kick up a stink about it and your cards are marked as it were.

But no drinking/going out socialising, concerts, cinemas, trips to see family etc etc is a big thing to ask of people when its say one week in 3 or 4 - not healthy even if there not actually being called regularly.
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On-call you are supposed to make yourself generally available to contact - if you are spending a large chunk of an "on call" period fielding calls regularly that isn't on-call that is working.
 
I work on call for an IT firm, but it's reasonable. Do one week in every four or so on a rota. We get paid by the week so if the rota changes and you do it more often, you get paid more.

In general going out drinking if you are on-call is a bad idea and it's not something I do.

I don't get called very often, we are mainly on call in case **** hits the fan.

Hear about people who are basically permanently on call and get called all the time, it must be hard to get a decent work/life balance with that kind of scenario. I would not be happy if I was on-call all the time and wasn't being paid well for it, even then I like my current rota as it gives me some downtime.
 
Pudney said:
It's pretty easy to get rid of anyone with less than 2 years in the employment.
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This is the key, they can get rid of him in the first two years with a simple "it's not working out" (as long as the real reason isn't a discrimination one), all they have to do is pay what ever notice he's on.
 
I did give a clarification earlier (and thought i'd explained in the op), but he was dismissed on the day i posted the thread.

On the plus side he's found another job and is due to start a week on Monday. No mention of references at the moment so we'll see what happens with that, he's only been asked for a CRB check. The new job works out around £2k extra salary and is more local to home. Only downside is it almost 100% removes his wish to move to Manchester as the commute would be grim. We've told him that he just needs to stick with it for around 12 months and then he'll have a decent chance of looking for something new in the area he wants but he's been lucky to find something after being sacked and another short term role would really hurt him if he doesn't sort himself out in this one.
 
Telecaster said:
I get no standing charge, I just get paid if I have to go out to a call. So I could stay at home all weekend (and sober, booo!) with no calls and no pay.
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This seems like a pretty bad deal for you, is it standard they pay no retainer for the inconvenience? Is this written in your contract? Are they paying you very well for what you do to make the inconvenience worth it?
 
Telecaster said:
I get no standing charge, I just get paid if I have to go out to a call. So I could stay at home all weekend (and sober, booo!) with no calls and no pay.
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Was this something you agreed to as part of the job i.e. your basic salary offered at the start reflects this in addition to your regular hours or is this something that got dropped on you later? In which case WTF??? Why would you agree to that without getting something in return?
 
It was something that came afterwards, I knew we did weekend call out but my job didn't involve that side of things. Now as I've started taking on greater responsibilities and doing two different roles I have been dragged into weekend call out.

No I'm paid terribly and it isn't worth my while, I just agreed as we're a small firm and the same bloke doing it most of the time seemed unfair to me so at least he now gets the odd weekend off.

I think there is a massive difference here about what is expected of you from a small family firm of a few people, and big company.
 
Telecaster said:
I get no standing charge, I just get paid if I have to go out to a call. So I could stay at home all weekend (and sober, booo!) with no calls and no pay.
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Why did you agree to this? If you have to stay sober or stay close enough to home to work when called then I wouldn't do it without agreement to pay a retainer to do so.

I am available 24/7 for escalations but it's a fairly senior role, I knew that when I negotiated the salary and it's high enough to account for it. But for specific on call I wouldn't do it wouldn't agree to subsidise the company with my own time.
 
Telecaster said:
No I'm paid terribly and it isn't worth my while, I just agreed as we're a small firm and the same bloke doing it most of the time seemed unfair to me so at least he now gets the odd weekend off.

I think there is a massive difference here about what is expected of you from a small family firm of a few people, and big company.
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There shouldn't be, it might feel that way but they're making money from providing this service, if they can't afford to pay you appropriately then it is up to them to adjust how much they charge clients etc...

Being a small firm is no excuse.
 
Rexton said:
I work IT on-call, in the office 8am-4pm, on call 5pm-8am at home.

We're unofficially told to "live our lives as normal" while on-call, and we're given an hour to respond to any missed calls.

I've missed a few due to being in deep sleep at 4am, however management is pretty understanding and I've never had anyone say anything about it.

I'd see if he can get the terms of his on-call, but I'd agree dismissal would be incredibly harsh.

With the amount of calls I take we're essentially working 5 day long shifts. We only get a few hours of sleep during the night in between calls.
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Typically nowadays the teams look after the service and the systems have a primary, secondary and then escalation contact. If the primary is asleep. The secondary gets called and then gives them a load of crap the next day for missing a call. If both fail then the escalation occurs and then everyone gets it.

As a multiple service owner as part of my role, I'm the escalation point. Everyone has a life, but it's also up to the team to work together.
 
Lopéz said:
Sounds fairly reasonable to me. We do not retain people who have more than two sickness or lateness instances in their first thirteen weeks.

Generally speaking, away from HR policies and so on - employees who are off sick or late during their induction are almost never worth retaining.

Every time I've seen a manager make an exception for someone who they think is really promising/has potential blah blah blah they end up on the phone to employee remains a few months later along what they can do with this nightmare of a person who rocks up when they feel like it, rings in sick all the time and so on.

Recruiting is expensive, but people with a poor attitude and a bad work ethic are even more costly over time.
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That sounds like a call centre where you are micro managed. I am late occasionally, certainly more than twice in 13 weeks (never been off ill though, in fact I didn't even take my paternity leave) but the company would have been stupid to let me go given the fact that I finished my first years employment on 286% of my revenue target.

The management team pretty much just leave me to get on with it and in return I work my arse off, although i do get told off for forgetting to sign in just in case the place catches fire which is understandable.

If they want to micromanage then they can find someone else to give hassle to as I want to go to work not school.

People are sometimes ill, an employer who can't accept this isn't worth my time.
 
It isn't a call centre. We have everything from sales people on the road, to call centre staff, to van drivers, to marketing directors. It's the same for everybody with regards to sick and lateness.
 
Telecaster said:
Because it's just how the other two do it so believed it to be normal. Like I say when it's a small firm and a family friend you feel obliged to help out more than you would if it's a faceless OmniCorp.
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It's still crazy. You are crazy for doing it. They are taking you for a mug and they know it. Family friend or not I would not let them walk all over me as you are letting them. If anything it's even more reason to tell them WTF.
 
Lopéz said:
It isn't a call centre. We have everything from sales people on the road, to call centre staff, to van drivers, to marketing directors. It's the same for everybody with regards to sick and lateness.
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It sounds like one though, binning someone for lateness twice in 3 months is ridiculous. Thankfully I work for a company that is driven by results, at the end of the day that is what matters.
 
Personally I think it depends on the nature of the role. If you are a driver, work in a contact centre, or any other resource driven/time specific role then you need to be on time or find another job to be honest.
 
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