**** Official Microsoft Flight Simulator Thread ****

[Zeeflyboy]

They do, you can adjust sensitivity (like an expo curve) and dead zone, but Morfinel is saying the curves are broken for him, or not working well enough anyway.

Have to say your experiences don’t precisely jive with mine. Without going into too much detail I find individual aircraft definitely suffer from some issues, generally my feeling is the more complex the aircraft the more issues you find (which I guess is logical!) and the flight model as a whole certainly isn’t perfect yet but I think the potential is there to be really good with some spit and polish to remove some oddities.

Lack of mushy controls at low speed is actually something I also pointed out during earlier alpha... out of interest I just took a savage cub out to test it and I think it’s actually pretty good now (for that aircraft at least). Fly fast and level wiggling the ailerons back and forth and it’s responsive and tight, as you slow (still wiggling!) the roll rate progressively slows and gets noticeably poorer very rapidly as you pass through 10-15kts above stall. Keep doing it during the stall and you can find yourself in the situation where you need rudder to bring it back to level. So for that one example I just tried it seemed overall pretty good... Perhaps give that a try and let me know what you think? External view can help visualise roll response a bit better.

There is definitely some apparent springiness to rapidly releasing pitch inputs in the flight model, might be related to your control sensitivity issues that it is causing excess bother though?

Just a few thoughts - what controllers are you using? Did you check weight and CG aren’t daft? Did you try other aircraft than the TBM?

 

[8myers8]

Cannot wait to test this out on gamepass, not played a flight Sim in years, bet it will be weeks before I can take off and get in the sky's lol

 

[peahead]

Well i have just ordered my first ever flight stick the Thrustmaster T flight hotas x and just pro ordered the game of steam

While i am waiting for the game to be released what other flight sims can i try ?

 

[andy_mk3]

Well i have just ordered my first ever flight stick the Thrustmaster T flight hotas x and just pro ordered the game of steam

While i am waiting for the game to be released what other flight sims can i try ?

Nice Xplane11 has a demo. You can also pick up FSX steam edition for pennies.

 

[PlanetBBQ]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LUs56eDQys

 

[andy_mk3]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LUs56eDQys

His fps seems low, especially for 1080p.

I have a gtx1080 at 1440p getting better fps than him with world traffic sliders maxed out and all high settings.

 

[DanTheMan]

The few videos comparing I've seen comparing graphics and fps seem to suggest it's way less optimised for amd. I'm dreading how badly my 4800 / 5600m will perform.

I just hope 30 fps will be sufficient for most flying!

 

[andy_mk3]

The few videos comparing I've seen comparing graphics and fps seem to suggest it's way less optimised for amd. I'm dreading how badly my 4800 / 5600m will perform.

I just hope 30 fps will be sufficient for most flying!

Honestly I don't think you will have an issue.

It's hard to say what actual performance will end up like too, there's no optimised drivers yet which should make a difference.

There's been nothing I've seen in the alpha forums to suggest amd cards having issues though.

 

[Morfinel]

There is definitely some apparent springiness to rapidly releasing pitch inputs in the flight model, might be related to your control sensitivity issues that it is causing excess bother though?

Just a few thoughts - what controllers are you using? Did you check weight and CG aren’t daft? Did you try other aircraft than the TBM?

I'm using Saitek Pro Flight Yoke and I tested it on cyborg evo joystick as well . So I took 152 again for a spin, I did spend a lot of hours in this plane had my first solo in it but due to uni I never completed my PPL. Set one passenger, fuel 50% plane takes off at 34 knots never tried it in real life but I'm sure you gonna have a ride across runway with your nose up. Then I bank 70 degree again in real plane you will lose attitude and at 70 degree very rapidly due to lack of lift well in FS2020 you can actually climb flying in circles. Then we go in Cessna caravan. Pilot, copilot and 10 passengers 170 lb fuel 100% plane is overweight. I mange to successfully take off at 65kts Whaaaaat... female voice tells me I'm stalling but plane is climbing whaaaat... I can go vertical in Cessna caravan at 500 feet stall and recover without hitting a ground in overweight plane not a chance in real world. For me all planes feel the same only cockpit change maybe that's why we don't have something like Douglas D-3 I'm going to quote someone from Alpha forum "They made scenery simulator not flight simulator" Asobo did great job on scenery but there should be someone else who have expertise in flight sims for the flying.

 

[robfosters]

The few videos comparing I've seen comparing graphics and fps seem to suggest it's way less optimised for amd. I'm dreading how badly my 4800 / 5600m will perform.

I just hope 30 fps will be sufficient for most flying!

As long as it’s steady, 30fps is fine for flight sims.

 

[Beer_MonsterUK]

Any word on a open beta?
Be nice to dust the old x-55 off and give it another whirl.

 

[Mr_Sukebe]

Any word on a open beta?
Be nice to dust the old x-55 off and give it another whirl.

pretty unlikely when it’ll be available in 2 weeks

 

[Zeeflyboy]

I'm using Saitek Pro Flight Yoke and I tested it on cyborg evo joystick as well . So I took 152 again for a spin, I did spend a lot of hours in this plane had my first solo in it but due to uni I never completed my PPL. Set one passenger, fuel 50% plane takes off at 34 knots never tried it in real life but I'm sure you gonna have a ride across runway with your nose up.

C152 power off, flaps down, stall speed is around 43kts... power on you could get down to around 35Kts, so definitely not beyond the realms of possibility to get airborne at 35kts or so with full power if you try hard enough.

Then I bank 70 degree again in real plane you will lose attitude and at 70 degree very rapidly due to lack of lift well in FS2020 you can actually climb flying in circles.

I haven’t tried this, will give it a go when I get a chance. I have done some lower angle steep turns and the nose drops into the turn as you would expect requiring back pressure to maintain horizon, but I haven’t actually tried climbing while doing it.

Then we go in Cessna caravan. Pilot, copilot and 10 passengers 170 lb fuel 100% plane is overweight. I mange to successfully take off at 65kts Whaaaaat... female voice tells me I'm stalling but plane is climbing whaaaat... I can go vertical in Cessna caravan at 500 feet stall and recover without hitting a ground in overweight plane not a chance in real world.

That certainly sounds slightly wonky, could be due to bug in the weight system? If it was basing stall warnings etc off the weight you selected, but the aircraft in the sim was actually unchanged in weight that could explain why it could still climb while shouting stall at you, why it took off at lower speeds and why it recovered more quickly. Just a guess

For reference from the PoH of a caravan:


Takeoff:
Flaps: 20°.
Trim: 20%.
Rotate: 70kts.

Landing:
Stall speed w/flaps 30°: 61kts.

So again, in general getting airborne in one at 65kts is definitely going to be doable... especially if there is a bug that prevents the weight being set properly or prevents overweight conditions.

 

[Zeeflyboy]

Any word on a open beta?
Be nice to dust the old x-55 off and give it another whirl.

Just get one of the £1 gamepass deals August and you can give the release version a go.

 

[Morfinel]

C152 power off, flaps down, stall speed is around 43kts... power on you could get down to around 35Kts, so definitely not beyond the realms of possibility to get airborne at 35kts or so with full power if you try hard enough.

Incorrect, put Cessna on a tow rope and with engine off it will lift off at lower speed than when using engine due to turbulence air from propeller effecting low and high pressure around wings another example is during PPL they teach you to fly as long as possible above runway and let the plane land itself and if it doesn't they tell you to open throttle and this will sink plane down. Propeller doesn't make plane go up, lift does, IRL drop down to speed of 43kts and no matter what you do your plane is going down like a brick.

That certainly sounds slightly wonky, could be due to bug in the weight system? If it was basing stall warnings etc off the weight you selected, but the aircraft in the sim was actually unchanged in weight that could explain why it could still climb while shouting stall at you, why it took off at lower speeds and why it recovered more quickly. Just a guess

For reference from the PoH of a caravan:


Takeoff:
Flaps: 20°.
Trim: 20%.
Rotate: 70kts.

Landing:
Stall speed w/flaps 30°: 61kts.

So again, in general getting airborne in one at 65kts is definitely going to be doable... especially if there is a bug that prevents the weight being set properly or prevents overweight conditions.

With 2 pilots 100% fuel you can take off at 55kts in cessna caravan and use that speed to climb 2000 feet at rate exceeding 1200 fpm.
Cessna Caravan with exceed max weight will not rotate at 70kts you are probably looking at 90-100 and very long runway to get you there. climb rate 300 fpm max.

 

[Zeeflyboy]

Incorrect, put Cessna on a tow rope and with engine off it will lift off at lower speed than when using engine due to turbulence air from propeller effecting low and high pressure around wings another example is during PPL they teach you to fly as long as possible above runway and let the plane land itself and if it doesn't they tell you to open throttle and this will sink plane down. Propeller doesn't make plane go up, lift does, IRL drop down to speed of 43kts and no matter what you do your plane is going down like a brick.

My real life experience of light aircraft specifically is limited to C172, R2160, DA20, DA42 (oh and a few hours in a PA28 warrior when I first started) so if you say that is the case with the C152 I can’t really give any input from personal experience.

What I can give you is that the reference Vso from the PoH is 35kts as compared to a flaps out power off stall at 43kts. https://wayman.net/files/Cessna-152-POH.pdf

With 2 pilots 100% fuel you can take off at 55kts in cessna caravan and use that speed to climb 2000 feet at rate exceeding 1200 fpm.
Cessna Caravan with exceed max weight will not rotate at 70kts you are probably looking at 90-100 and very long runway to get you there. climb rate 300 fpm max.

Not debating that, I showed the reference figures from the PoH to show that what you said (airborne at 65kts) is not out of the realm of possibility if the sim’s flight model is effectively ignoring your weight settings as a bug.

edit - just to add there are definitely also some bugs around too much available thrust (or perhaps around drag, eg side slipping is very ineffective), try the citation and it’s insane. To me it is a question of polish and refinement rather than game breaking flight model though.

 

[Morfinel]

My real life experience of light aircraft is limited to C172, R2160, DA20, DA42 so if you say that is the case with the 152 I can’t really give any input from personal experience.

What I can give you is that the reference Vso from the PoH is 35kts as compared to a flaps out power off stall at 43kts. https://wayman.net/files/Cessna-152-POH.pdf

Short field take off is 54kts which is nowhere near of in game take off at 35kts with positive climb rate and stall warning you can hit 35kts on landing and still be flying but on take-off you are crashing. I hope you are right about polishing.
I just tried 747 at Gatwick ant I was able to take off using only engine 1 and 4 at 130kts, again positive climb went negative and then while climbing on two engines recovered back to positive.
I'll txt my instructor who was a 747 captain and tell him I'm better than him for being able to take-off at Gatwick on two engines, lets see what he says.

Edit: Does anyone have some video links of youtubers who are in to flight sim and talk about flying rather than scenery? Would like to know what they have to say on MFS2020

 

[garsands]

Most that I have seen are just showing off the scenery or showing the frame rate.
I have been trying to find someone using the G1000 GDU glass cockpit setting up navigation and then using it.

 

[Zeeflyboy]

Short field take off speed is on the basis you don’t want to die though... my point is simply that if you were to try to discover a theoretical absolutely minimum no margin Vmu for the 152 I reckon it’d not be that far off 35kts in the right conditions which means the flight model isn’t necessarily completely borked for it to happen in game.

I can’t say I know anyone who has ever tried it lol, but I bet there’s a chance you could just about get an empty 747 airborne from Gatwick on 2 engines (as long as they weren’t both on the same wing). Unfortunately I doubt anyone I know will be going in a 747 sim again otherwise it’d be fun to ask them to try. Again though it could point to a weight system bug combined with the excess thrust or insufficient drag I noted - ultimately drag, or more specifically wheel drag, is the only thing that might prevent you from doing it in reality as a 747 will indeed fly on 2 once off the ground.

I have a (very!) newborn baby so not exactly flush with time to test at the mo but I suspect you are encountering a bug with weights and how they interact with the flight model, I haven’t personally tried messing with weights and cg much.

If you have the time and inclination could you try with minimum and maximum (or over) weight and see if the speeds at which you get airborne or stall change (not when the warner goes off, but when it actually stalls).

The majority of my flying has been more “normal” than what you are trying, and I’ve found the flight model and how it reacts to atmosphere etc pretty reasonable within that envelope. Certainly not perfect, but not bad given it’s only just gone into beta... I also don’t have the same control issues you seem to have (I’m using a thrustmaster warthog and mfg pedals for reference).

I also suspect 3rd party aircraft will improve upon the base level ones in flight model as well as systems.

 

[Morfinel]

I can’t say I know anyone who has ever tried it lol, but I bet there’s a chance you could just about get an empty 747 airborne from Gatwick on 2 engines (as long as they weren’t both on the same wing). Unfortunately I doubt anyone I know will be going in a 747 sim again otherwise it’d be fun to ask them to try. Again though it could point to a weight system bug combined with the excess thrust or insufficient drag I noted.

Did try the same in FSX and I crashed at the end of the runway going 140kts. Is it too much to ask xD, even if the problem is with weight it does not explain how you can recover from a stall on take-off with two engines not pointing plane down unless you are in fighter jet and how on steep turn you can gain altitude, no mater if the object is 1000lb or 10 000lb this wings do not have a lift.

I have a (very!) newborn baby so not exactly flush with time to test at the mo but I suspect you are encountering a bug with weights and how they interact with the flight model, I haven’t personally tried messing with weights and cg much.

Congratulations !!!!