Optically Flat

VaderDSL · 15 Oct 2006 at 16:41

FrankJH said:
hmmmmmm - Jokester I respect your knowledge and experience but this is laughable - yeah dotn get me wrong I know there will be miniscule peaks and troughs that when smoothed out will aid cooling ( and I am guessing water will benefit more than air) but by 20 degrees!!! I cant see it myself but hey ho

You really need to read the thread again, he is saying the IHS was not flat, he lapped the IHS which will now allow the waterblock to make contact.

I can believe easily the temperature drop of 20C.

Hmmm seems I was ages in typing a reply and was beaten to it

Steves_pc · 7 Jan 2007 at 00:08

Hmm, must say the thought of doing this had crossed my mind too, esp as the my Big typhoons finish was rough, lapping that did 6c or so.

Going slightly OT whats the chances of these c2d's being like the AMD's in terms of the heatspreader for removal :eek:

as i remember shaving nearly 10c off my X2 due to the poop thermal paste and bad contact, just seems to me if theyre fitting some warped it might be worth a look.

Jokester · 7 Jan 2007 at 00:09

The IHS are soldered on so it's a bit trickier and generally not worth the risk unless you've got deep pockets.

Jokester

Legend · 7 Jan 2007 at 00:36

The idea of lapping my new e6600 scares me! I agree, it's not the best of finishes, but I'd be too worried about ruining it. This isn't fool proof surely? I imagine you COULD destroy it if you're not careful? My concern would be keeping even pressure and the risk of taking too much off in one area and constantly trying to correct it until the whole thing is ruined!

joeyjojo · 7 Jan 2007 at 00:42

Legend said:
The idea of lapping my new e6600 scares me! I agree, it's not the best of finishes, but I'd be too worried about ruining it. This isn't fool proof surely? I imagine you COULD destroy it if you're not careful? My concern would be keeping even pressure and the risk of taking too much off in one area and constantly trying to correct it until the whole thing is ruined!

That would be ideal, eventually you'd reach the die itself

(don't do that really)

Legend · 7 Jan 2007 at 00:48

I don't think water would necessarily be the best lubricant to use though. Surely something like baby oil would be better suited to the task?

ns400r · 7 Jan 2007 at 00:55

Jokester said:
You look at the surface of the chip at an angle so it reflects what's on the screen. If the surface is flat the reflection will be a perfect image of what's on screen. If it's not flat the lines will appear curved.

Jokester

Maybe someone could polish a CPU that ISN'T flat so that a demonstration could be seen. I'd like to see what a concave (or convex) heat spreader looks like using this method.

Legend · 7 Jan 2007 at 02:05

ns400r said:
Maybe someone could polish a CPU that ISN'T flat so that a demonstration could be seen. I'd like to see what a concave (or convex) heat spreader looks like using this method.

I've just checked my brand new E6600 against this image and the lines are straight. Unless I'm looking at it wrong, I don't see any curving or anything. It's not a perfect mirror look as the surface isn't mirror smooth, but the lines look straight. I'll try and take a picture later and put it up...

pieman109 · 7 Jan 2007 at 10:20

I'd have thought if the HIS was concaved bad enough, you could've seen the gap using the edge of a credit card or steel rule? No need to use a screen image.

Jokester · 7 Jan 2007 at 10:34

As far as I'm aware, there's two variants of the IHS, one that's concave and one that's not, if you use the credit card method for applying paste you'll notice that on the concave one that the heatsink doesn't actually touch the centre of the chip from the inprint.

When sanding you'll also notice that it takes about 5mins to wear the edges down before you reach the centre.

Jokester

DJKahuna · 7 Jan 2007 at 10:37

pieman109 said:
I'd have thought if the HIS was concaved bad enough, you could've seen the gap using the edge of a credit card or steel rule? No need to use a screen image.

Not actually the same. The difference is the grid is designed in such a way with lines in a pattern the mind recognises easily and it can compare the two (the on screen image and the reflection). Obviously your own judgement is required. I do see what you are saying though.

Noxis · 7 Jan 2007 at 11:48

Can I point the gentlemen at exhibit A -> http://gallery.richard5.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=5126

This is what Jokester was removing. Improved mine fantastically, I realised there was a contact problem when TAT said "85c<" and briefly said something along the lines of 125c.... after changing my boxers I decided it was definitely time to do some lapping.

pastymuncher · 7 Jan 2007 at 13:59

Bloody hell!! I did'nt realise they were that bad. One of these will be my next upgrade in a couple of months so obvoiusly i am interested in this thread. My water blocks are lapped and i still have loads of wet and dry from 400 down to 2500 grit along with a flat piece of glass. The only thing i would be worried about is that if the IHS is that bad, then surely you would be in danger of wearing through the edges of the IHS? Don't get me wrong, i would do it for decreases in temps like you are all seeing. It's just, well, different to doing a block or heatsink. It's a cpu that cost's a hell of a lot more.

ns400r · 7 Jan 2007 at 14:58

Nice example but what would a IHS that bad look like, polished, against the image?

ns400r · 7 Jan 2007 at 14:59

pastymuncher said:
Bloody hell!! I did'nt realise they were that bad. One of these will be my next upgrade in a couple of months so obvoiusly i am interested in this thread. My water blocks are lapped and i still have loads of wet and dry from 400 down to 2500 grit along with a flat piece of glass. The only thing i would be worried about is that if the IHS is that bad, then surely you would be in danger of wearing through the edges of the IHS? Don't get me wrong, i would do it for decreases in temps like you are all seeing. It's just, well, different to doing a block or heatsink. It's a cpu that cost's a hell of a lot more.

The IHS is quite thick and you'll not sand through it.

Jokester · 7 Jan 2007 at 15:00

ns400r said:
Nice example but what would a IHS that bad look like, polished, against the image?

On a bad IHS, you'll get pretty bad curvation of the lines round the edge where it's raised.

Jokester

Edit:-

That's what you're looking for

Trox · 7 Jan 2007 at 16:58

Slightly of topic, not much though!

What waterblock are you using Jokester?

Jokester · 7 Jan 2007 at 16:59

I'm using a Storm at the mo, but will be shortly upgrading to the Apogee.

Jokester

Trox · 7 Jan 2007 at 17:56

Nice same block as mine

What way do you have it sitting on the motherboard, if i remember correctly you have a evga 680i ?

I had mine sitting horizontally but i have switched it now so its sitting vertically. The block seems to overhang the caps sitting in the horizontal position, but then it over hangs the caps at the top of the board, which get very hot.

edit
Isnt the Storm block better than the apogee ?

MikeTimbers · 7 Jan 2007 at 18:15

Jokester said:
I'm using a Storm at the mo, but will be shortly upgrading to the Apogee.

Jokester

Although I would normally disagree with an Apogee being an upgrade for a Storm, certain cpus - generally those with heat spreaders - benefit from blocks that are not "jet impingement" blocks. However, I do wonder what you might be going to do with the Storm