Overclocking when I don't want to.

MoridinUK

MoridinUK

MoridinUK

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Joined
16 Jun 2014
Posts
396
Hey all so I seem to have an issue.

I was poking about in my old pc.

i7-7700k on an asus rog maximus VIII Gene.

It had 16gb of DDR4-3200 corsair vengeance ram. cl36
I upgraded to 32 gb corsair vengeance DDR4-3200 cl38

Both use XMP to get to their speeds. Basically just the same ram but twice as much.

I can't get the system stable.

The mainboard is using xmp to set the voltage and dram timings and has them right, I have the bios set to let the processor run at stock speeds 4.2ghz normal 4.5 boost.

It's boosting all the time according to HWMonitor.

I'm struggling what to do to try to make it stable, normal use seems ok and hyperpi runs fine, But prime95 (with AXV turned off) either stops due to rounding errors or once gave me a blue screen. I'm a bit lost as to what to try. The bios seems to want to do everything for me.

Any tips on benchmark software and monitoring software to figure this out?
Is memtest still a useful app?

The system was not 100.00000% stable when the old ram was in there, but it was very rare, it may be that I'm seeing that issue as I'm looking harder.

I also installed a new cooler and the system is running nice and cool, hyperpi can't get my processor over 52 degrees c...

I'm stumped, an actual fault on the memory is so rare and unlikely.
 
Dg834man said:
The cpu boosting part is normal, but you were crashing with your old ram and now crashing more often with your new ram, have you tried running without xmp to see if the crashing stops? it suggests the memory controller is a bit naff but hard to say with certainty.
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I was crashing like once every week, and I had no reason to think it was ram.

I turned xmp off and set everything to auto. Prime95 got through more tests, cpu made it to a whooping great 64 degrees and then blue screen (a messed up one where you could see the blue screen and the information that the system was creating a report for microsoft, but it was all distorted and repeated.)

Tomorrow when I have more time I'll put the old ram back in and see if it can prime 95. I'd do it now but to get the fan off the cooler so I can reach the ram means removing the gpu (got to love mATX!) It's possible I've got some setting in the bios that's upsetting the cpu, I've been fiddling a lot today.

If I have the same issue with the old ram, then it's either the board or the cpu. I do have an i5-6600k and it's in another board, so I could fit it in a case and test the memory on that, but that still wont answer which component is the issue. I really don't want to swap the cpu's out again it's fiddly (though less so now I've got a better cooler in there)

Old config

i5-6600k (overclocked)
Dark rock pro 3
16gb 3200 corsair vengeance ram.
Occasional but rare crashes (assume software)

Changed to

i7-7700k (not overclocked)
Dark rock pro 3 (not happy with temps Prime95 would push cpu to 100 degrees)
16gb 3200 corsair vengeance ram.
Once a week cadence for inconsistent crash

Changed to

i7-7700k (not overclock)
Dark rock pro 5 (temps are nice now)
32 gb 3200 corsair vengeance ram
Crashes in prime95. not in hyper pi, crashed while my kid played slime rancher 2...
 
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Quartz said:
Is the BIOS up to date?
Click to expand...
Yep latest!
jigger said:
Clear the CMOS. If using two kits of memory install the cas 18 (?) kit first and set XMP. Test and then try the cas 16 kit at the cas 18 profile.
Click to expand...
I'm using just one 2x16gb kit. :(
Quartz said:
Given how old the system is @MoridinUK might want to test and change the CMOS battery.
Click to expand...
Wouldn't I see setting being lost? Not sure how to test it but I could swap it out, it's not the original one though, I don't think.

Thanks all for the suggestions
 
Tetras said:
Can you take a screen of hwinfo, 'cos it shows what things are enabled/displayed in the bios like EIST/speedshift, though always worth checking your windows power plan and be aware some monitoring software can pin your CPU.
Click to expand...
I will do so when I next have it running I'm at work right now. I need to install HWinfo but no issue.
Quartz said:
Only if you remove the battery.



Use a multimeter. Red probe on top of the battery, black probe on a ground point.
Click to expand...

I don't have a multimeter and I also don't have a spare 2032 battery, though i think maybe I can pull one from somewhere else.


So I reset the cmos this morning, and put the old ram back in, left it on stock not xmp. It seemed stable and ran prime95 for about 40-45 mins before I got the crash with the messed up crash report screen. So that's not very encouraging. But suggests the ram itself is probably fine.

I could replace the cpu with the old i5-6600k or build a new pc with that cpu on a different board and check the ram in that, but in that situation I still don't know if the issue is a cooked board or cpu. (The i7-7700k is second hand from ebay with no returns, it's possible it got cooked or damaged, there is a strange mottling on the metal on the lid and one core runs a few degrees hotter than the others.)

Not really sure how best to proceed.
 
nah there is a little start up window that lets you check to get sensors only for _reasons_ on mine the sensors were checked.

I think you mean the summary here?

Right the bios is set to use auto for everything, I've no idea why there is XMP on some bits
 
The timings and speed for the ram is all wrong but I don't know what they should be as I only know the target timings when set to xmp (3200mhz, 16,18,36 1.35 volts)
Bios says it's running at 2133 mhz lower timings and 1.2 volts but hwinf isn't showing that
 
Tetras said:
Oh, I meant the main screen that shows the CPU area, not the sensor tab.
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nah there is a little start up window that lets you check to get sensors only for _reasons_ on mine the sensors were checked.

I think you mean the summary here?

Right the bios is set to use auto for everything, I've no idea why there is XMP on some bits
 
freddie64 said:
Have you checked the Power Plan?

Control Panel/System and Security/Power Options/
Select Balanced and click on Change Plan Settings and then Change Advanced Power Settings on the next screen.

In the Power Options window make sure Minimum Processor State is set to 5%.

JW1VJAH.jpeg
Click to expand...
Yes ok so I'm an idiot! Thank you!
 
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Tetras said:
Can you restate the problems again please?

You have fixed the CPU downclocking, right?
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Yeah I thought the failure to down clock may have been because of a overclocking setting inthe bios.

The actual problem is system stability, I get crashes occasionally and prime95 can not run any test for long before either a broken blue screen is displayed (I can read that it was trying to build a report to send to microsoft but it's repeated a few times and has coloured distorted boxes underneath) Or the workers stop due to rounding errors.

I've tried with two different sets of ram and the cpu and ram are running at stock (not even XMP). I even gave the ram at stock speeds some extra voltage as I've only seen rounding errors once and that was the only time I've ever experienced bad ram.

The mainboard is an old Asus ROG Maximus VIII Gene.

Not sure what else to try next
 
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Tetras said:
Hmm, quite hard to diagnose from what you described.

Sorry if I'm repeating, but have you totally ruled out software issues by using a fresh install with nothing installed?

RAM is in the slots suggested by the motherboard?

Do you have any significant errors being reported in the event viewer (especially WHEA)?

Your temps look fine in the pictures, power use looks fine. Only other thing I can think of is your PSU, is it known good?

You can download a CPU diagnostic test from Intel (I think yours would use a legacy version, but not 100% sure), though I don't think it is a particularly thorough test.

You could try turning off the turbo and seeing if the CPU runs stable at the base speed.

I can't imagine what would break on the motherboard to show those symptoms, but I suppose can't rule it out either.
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I have not tried a fresh windows install because I can't really wipe my drive. I could maybe try to install on a fresh ssd though I guess.

Ram is in the slots the MB wants

Errors: apart from the critical ones for an unexpected shutdown not really. I see this error around the time of the crashes :
The System Guard Runtime Monitor Broker service terminated with the following error:
%%3489660935

And some issues with permission on every start up


The application-specific permission settings do not grant Local Activation permission for the COM Server application with CLSID
{6B3B8D23-FA8D-40B9-8DBD-B950333E2C52}
and APPID
{4839DDB7-58C2-48F5-8283-E1D1807D0D7D}
to the user NT AUTHORITY\LOCAL SERVICE SID (S-1-5-19) from address LocalHost (Using LRPC) running in the application container Unavailable SID (Unavailable). This security permission can be modified using the Component Services administrative tool.

And some service always seems to fail:


The Freemake Improver service failed to start due to the following error:
The service did not respond to the start or control request in a timely fashion.

No idea what the heck that is to be honest.

I may try to find the cpu diagnostics. I did swap out the cpu a month or so back, (i5-6600k out i7-7700k in) and there were occasional crashes but very rare and nothing I could replicate. I know I shouldn't but I always feel like that's almost normal with windows.

PSU was replaced only 6 months ago when I swapped out a 1080 gtx for the radeon 6800 xt (which the 8 year old 600 w psu seemed to struggle with)
 
Tetras said:
If the install is very old, I'd recommend it, because you could easily have picked up some problems over the years. Obviously make sure you have back ups before you mess with it, blahblah.


None of those sound important. WHEA errors are the ones I usually pay attention to for hardware related issues.


It is a quick and simple tool to run, so worth a pop.


Hmm, depends on what exactly you mean by crashes. BSODs and CTDs should be very rare on a stable system, outside of specific driver or app issues. Black screens should never or very rarely happen. Resets, the same (never or very rarely). I'm familiar with PCs that are left on for weeks, or even months and the only crashes during that time are related to the apps crashing within Windows and having to be restarted, due to bugs in their code.
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I'll girde up my loins for an reinstall. It's at least 7 years old I think,

I'm downloading the tool.

Mostly they have been screen lock ups or BSOD. :thinking: I think it's not been well for a while
 
Boom.

Intel cpu diagnostic tool, everything passing until the cpu load test and then the same messed up BSOD crash as when I run prime95.

So it may be the darned cpu?
 
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