Platypus' Beginners Guide to Running

neilw · 10 Sep 2018 at 09:52

ci_newman said:
I completed the New Forest half today, 1hr 54mins. It was my first half and I'm happy with that time, the summer holidays and looking after the kids really ruined my training plan!

Trying to decide whether to book onto the GSR in a few weeks time... that is all tarmac and perfectly flat, great for achieving a PB

Well done that's a great time. The Forest looked amazing yesterday. Hope you missed the dead squirrel in the middle of the road!

I the marathon in 3hr 44mins a little faster than expected. I think with more experience and training over that distance I can go faster, my pace dropped off after mile 20 and it got harder and harder, it felt like I was stilling going along at 5:20km pace but I'd look at my watch and it would be over 6, I felt like walking at times in the last few miles but was determined to keep running. I didn't feel like I'd run out of energy, just fatigue in my legs. You can't really train for how it feels, you just have to get us to doing it I guess.

I'd be interested in seeing what I can do on a flat road marathon.

Ian_Eb · 10 Sep 2018 at 09:59

I am going to guess that the HR may just be a peak value and if you were to check the data in the file it would probably only be one or two readings.

I have struggles to find motivation for a month or three but am slowly getting back into it. 16km last night in 1Hr 50Min is slow compared to some of you but I am reasonably happy in that it isnt my slowest time on that route. 4 weeks to the next 1/2 so some room for improvement

Blackvault · 10 Sep 2018 at 09:59

NoNameNoNumber said:
Congrats Black vault on the PB, great progress... I'm very dubious of that HR though- I'd be checking the HR strap out and/or changing the battery.

Cheers. The average would be about right, whether the max is truely correct or not, I'm not sure. My sister is a cardiac nurse and she said the heart shouldn't be able to go above 220, but either way I was close to Max lol. I'll check the battery, as I've had it about 5 months, how long doe those CR2 batteries usually last?

On Saturday I went out and tried to run a little long than I usually do which is, 30mins - 5km, but at a slower pace than usual. I managed to get in 10.25km run at 7:08min/km, with a PB of 1hour 11mins for the 10km, and the first time ever that I did it without any walking blocks! I'm pretty pleased with the pacing of it, however I turned onto a country road with no pavement and ended in pumping in 6:00min/km - 6:30min/kms for the length of the road (3km), I think subconsciously as the cars were flying past me as I was on the grass verge, but otherwise it was all nice and steady.

Blackvault · 10 Sep 2018 at 10:00

Ian_Eb said:
I am going to guess that the HR may just be a peak value and if you were to check the data in the file it would probably only be one or two readings.

I have struggles to find motivation for a month or three but am slowly getting back into it. 16km last night in 1Hr 50Min is slow compared to some of you but I am reasonably happy in that it isnt my slowest time on that route. 4 weeks to the next 1/2 so some room for improvement

Yes, the 223, was right at the end, sprint finish to the line. Average for the run was 206bpm which is about my usual, going hard value.

ci_newman · 10 Sep 2018 at 10:36

neilw said:
Well done that's a great time. The Forest looked amazing yesterday. Hope you missed the dead squirrel in the middle of the road!

I the marathon in 3hr 44mins a little faster than expected. I think with more experience and training over that distance I can go faster, my pace dropped off after mile 20 and it got harder and harder, it felt like I was stilling going along at 5:20km pace but I'd look at my watch and it would be over 6, I felt like walking at times in the last few miles but was determined to keep running. I didn't feel like I'd run out of energy, just fatigue in my legs. You can't really train for how it feels, you just have to get us to doing it I guess.

I'd be interested in seeing what I can do on a flat road marathon.

Congratulations! You're right, the Forest was beautiful yesterday and yes I missed the dead squirrel

I know exactly the feeling you are describing about your legs, my chest and breathing was fine but it felt like I was running through tar on the final miles! I tried a final speed-up for the final straight and quickly gave up on that idea

and for me, that was all on a half-marathon! You marathon runners are nutters

The marathon leader ran past me at about mile 10, and he passed me as if I was stood still

D.P. · 12 Sep 2018 at 08:47

neilw said:
Well done that's a great time. The Forest looked amazing yesterday. Hope you missed the dead squirrel in the middle of the road!

I the marathon in 3hr 44mins a little faster than expected. I think with more experience and training over that distance I can go faster, my pace dropped off after mile 20 and it got harder and harder, it felt like I was stilling going along at 5:20km pace but I'd look at my watch and it would be over 6, I felt like walking at times in the last few miles but was determined to keep running. I didn't feel like I'd run out of energy, just fatigue in my legs. You can't really train for how it feels, you just have to get us to doing it I guess.

I'd be interested in seeing what I can do on a flat road marathon.

That is still a good time. A properly raced marathon is never easy and post 20 miles takes a huge mental commitment to maintain pace.

Training wise, volume is the number one goal to feel stronger at the end and reduce fatigue. Long runs are also very important. Over time you can build up to a state where you can do weekly 20 mile long runs, You can then start adding goal pace miles, something like 6 easy, 12 at goal pace, 2 easy.

Of course, with better training and higher volume you will do the race faster and once you hit 20 miles you will still be exhausted and fighting a huge mental battle... but physically your legs will be more capable of continuing on.

For males 20-55 without health issues, 70-80 miles a week is a good sweet-spot with low injury risk and big gains.Above that you tend to suffer diminishing returns in trainign effectiveness, and finding the time to do additional miles gets harder.

D.P. · 12 Sep 2018 at 08:50

Blackvault said:
Cheers. The average would be about right, whether the max is truely correct or not, I'm not sure. My sister is a cardiac nurse and she said the heart shouldn't be able to go above 220, but either way I was close to Max lol. I'll check the battery, as I've had it about 5 months, how long doe those CR2 batteries usually last?

On Saturday I went out and tried to run a little long than I usually do which is, 30mins - 5km, but at a slower pace than usual. I managed to get in 10.25km run at 7:08min/km, with a PB of 1hour 11mins for the 10km, and the first time ever that I did it without any walking blocks! I'm pretty pleased with the pacing of it, however I turned onto a country road with no pavement and ended in pumping in 6:00min/km - 6:30min/kms for the length of the road (3km), I think subconsciously as the cars were flying past me as I was on the grass verge, but otherwise it was all nice and steady.

Youir HR almost certainly didn't reach that high. The ECG straps can sometimes get confused and over read, but in general work way better than optical HRM which are pretty useless when actually exercising.

What is your resting HR by the way? Gettign a true value is hard but you can put your HRM on early morning and lie in bed a little to get a rough estimate.

Blackvault · 12 Sep 2018 at 14:50

D.P. said:
Youir HR almost certainly didn't reach that high. The ECG straps can sometimes get confused and over read, but in general work way better than optical HRM which are pretty useless when actually exercising.

What is your resting HR by the way? Gettign a true value is hard but you can put your HRM on early morning and lie in bed a little to get a rough estimate.

I suppose there is no substitute to a proper 10-12 lead ECG machine?

My resting HR is around 57bpm on average. Its been as low as 30bpm the odd day but I'd imagine that might be a miss reading.

The Darkness · 13 Sep 2018 at 20:36

D.P. said:
For males 20-55 without health issues, 70-80 miles a week is a good sweet-spot with low injury risk and big gains.Above that you tend to suffer diminishing returns in trainign effectiveness, and finding the time to do additional miles gets harder

Sweet spot!!? I'm running 5-6 days a week for about 40 miles, job,kids and I don't know how I'd find time to double that!!

Ian_Eb · 13 Sep 2018 at 22:12

thought this was an interesting read https://strava.app.link/IoVu1GFGbQ

D.P. · 14 Sep 2018 at 10:53

The Darkness said:
Sweet spot!!? I'm running 5-6 days a week for about 40 miles, job,kids and I don't know how I'd find time to double that!!

All depends on priorities and goals. I have a full time job and kids and a wife with a very demanding job. I almost never watch TV, got to bed early and get up early to work or run. I work through my lunch break, and will catch up with work on evenings and weekends.

There is a lot you can do, run commute to work, run at lunch time, run once the kids go to bed. Heavily load the weekend (2 hours saturday, 4 hours Sunday). If you ran 7 days a week at your current distance per day you could hit 50-55 days. Wake up an hour earlier a couple of times and you can add 12 miles, now you are at 60-67 miles, an extra lunch time run and now your at 70+ miles.

D.P. · 14 Sep 2018 at 10:55

Ian_Eb said:
thought this was an interesting read https://strava.app.link/IoVu1GFGbQ

Only soemthing I have been preaching endlessly for several years. Not only does running slower make you much faster in races, it massively reduces injury risks. Also makes it much more enjoyable.

Ian_Eb · 14 Sep 2018 at 13:25

Well, yes...

And I have been going slower and I agree that it is easier etc. But the article goes off into explaining a bunch of physiological things as well.

D.P. · 14 Sep 2018 at 13:37

Which is what I have also being saying, training slower and racing faster. My advice is based on the physiological benefits, the fact that you are at less risk of injury is just the icing on the cake.

Edit: this is the book I read and which I have recommended to many new runners
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0451470885/ref=tmm_pap_title_0?ie=UTF8&qid=&sr=

The science behind the book is backed up with a large peer-reviewed meta-analysis looking at hundreds of independent studies of endurance performance and training ratios.

There are also some nice physiological studies that actually took samples of muscles, fat tissue, blood capilaries etc. That prove the benefits of running slow most of the time.

D.P. · 17 Sep 2018 at 06:00

Anyone else watch kipchoge's performance,probably one of the greatest sporting performances of the last 30 years.

Blackvault · 17 Sep 2018 at 08:53

D.P. said:
Anyone else watch kipchoge's performance,probably one of the greatest sporting performances of the last 30 years.

Can't say I saw it but what an achievement. Wasn't he one of the three that tried to break the 2 hour barrier in the Nike documentary?

neilw · 17 Sep 2018 at 12:20

Blackvault said:
Can't say I saw it but what an achievement. Wasn't he one of the three that tried to break the 2 hour barrier in the Nike documentary?

Yes, he did 2:00:25 I think but it doesn't count as a record because of the way he used pacemakers and the type of course he ran.

Amazing stuff, split down the pace, it's 14:28 5k pace for the whole marathon. 4:38Min/Mile or 2:52min/km average pace

It's faster than I do 400m reps at (69seconds)

semi-pro waster · 17 Sep 2018 at 12:21

Blackvault said:
Can't say I saw it but what an achievement. Wasn't he one of the three that tried to break the 2 hour barrier in the Nike documentary?

He was and finished on 2:00:25 for that attempt which is an astonishing time although it wouldn't have counted due to the use of in/out pacemakers. This performance is, if anything, even more special for my money - I didn't watch all of it but during the clips at the end of the marathon he was making it look very easy and comfortable. It's a quite ridiculous amount of time to take off a world record at the top level.

D.P. · 18 Sep 2018 at 09:26

Biggest drop in 50 years

Makes it one of the greatest sporting achievements of the last few decades

Admiral Huddy · 18 Sep 2018 at 11:08

Finally got my new runners back..

.. Neutral pronation Asiscs fitted with custom Orthotics to correct my slight height deviation..

I actually bought two pairs and have sent them off.

Like running on air.