Police 1 - Cyclists 0

I've spent the last year cycling to work and have been knocked off my bike twice by people in cars who just pulled out without seeing me.

Once was in broad daylight the other was at night with flashing LED's and hi-vis jacket on, as well as hi-vis patches on my helmet.

I think that there are bad road users, and it doesn't matter if they are driving cars or riding cycles.
 
Stolly said:
I've spent the last year cycling to work and have been knocked off my bike twice by people in cars who just pulled out without seeing me.

Once was in broad daylight the other was at night with flashing LED's and hi-vis jacket on, as well as hi-vis patches on my helmet.

I think that there are bad road users, and it doesn't matter if they are driving cars or riding cycles.
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Question is, is two times enough for you to stop assuming drivers always see you? I'll stick to my train of thought I repeat all the time.

Don't trust other drivers.
Don't trust peds.
Don't trust motorcycles/bikes.

Basically, everyone else on the road is a moron so avoid at all costs ;p
Don't know how many times I've escaped from a bump by thinking "this **** isn't going to indicate is he?" or "yup, they're blind, can't see me, better slow down/stop".
 
Let me start my comments with 'I once got knocked off my bike by an ambulance', true story.

Anyway, there are always going to be idiots on bikes much like there will always be idiots in cars who somehow got past their test, I have seen regular crack-downs in Loughborough on cyclists who use the pavement where there is a cycle lane available and no traffic that would deter them from being in the road otherwise. It's nice to see the police doing something other than putting up more high-vis boxes including an increase in manned ANPR checkpoints: they really seem to pull a lot of drivers over in those!
 
I'm a cyclist.

Fairly fast, I sometimes cut lights*, I often use pavements and road**, I've never caused an accident***.

*Main roads, no. No X junctions or controlled roundabouts anywhere either, on straight sections when pedestrian crossings are on and they've crossed back to the pavement, yes.

**The road is packed (and the pavement is empty or good as), and more importantly, cars are so close to the kerb that wing mirrors are interfering with filtering down the side. I don't do high speed on pavements and yes, I will ask to be excused and allowed past if I am on a decently wide pavement and I'm unable to pass a group of three abreast in front of me. If it's unreasonably narrow I'll be walking til I can get on the road. In my location many paths and roads are also designed to accommodate cyclists in their own lane. But where that isn't the case I use the roads.

***I have however been twice in serious accidents due to the actions of drivers:

#1: Cycling along a main road with cars parked along the side, car door swings open a few metres in front and I slam into it.

#2: Cycling along a main road, passing a side road containing a car waiting to pull out, it does pull out and does so into me. I took some time out to paint the road red after that.

Neither saw me as is almost always the case, not many people intentionally set out to kill someone.

Cyclists always end up winning the "battle" (unless they die) between any skirmishes with cars
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You'd have to be insane to think that any impact between a bike and a car can EVER come out in a cyclists favour. Car on car is reasonably fair odds but you are on an inherently unstable metal skeleton frame on a bike, any kind of impact means at the least, a crash with the ground at whatever speed you were moving at and with a car impact, the higher energy it can transfer with it's potential speed and mass can make it much worse. There's no energy absorbing shell around you on a bike.

Anyone who likes to moan about cyclists from the comfort of a car seat should try cycling a route every day which involves a right turn through least one non-traffic light 4+ exit roundabout in rush hour times. You obviously have no idea how crap being a cyclist among many impatient, fast accelerating and quite possibly oblivious to your presence cars can be. The lack of road presence on a pedal bike is dire at times.

Cyclists have a legal right to be on the road too and if the police catch them doing especially dumb moves which cause practical problems (I don't count internal ranting about harmless movement abuse as one) they should get done for it, I watch cars perform worse manoeuvres every day in rush hour. There's no policeman round every corner, it's down to road users to behave themselves with respect to other road users 99% of the time.

I am also a driver ;)
 
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This thread indicates why I hate cycling in this country, and places like Holland and Austria are so nice to be in.

1. Those other countries and most european countries a higher percentage of the population cycle.

2. The cycling infrastucture is a joke, give cyclist separation from traffic that what they want thats that drivers want. Again go to Holland makes our system look pathetic.


Freefaller said:
Problem is as fun as it would be to crush 'em, it's always the driver's fault :(
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Oh nice one. Take it if was brother, sister, mum, dad, son, daughter, nephew, niece....... you would want them to be on the same road as drivers with that attitude?
 
ChrisJSY said:
Question is, is two times enough for you to stop assuming drivers always see you? I'll stick to my train of thought I repeat all the time.

Don't trust other drivers.
Don't trust peds.
Don't trust motorcycles/bikes.

Basically, everyone else on the road is a moron so avoid at all costs ;p
Don't know how many times I've escaped from a bump by thinking "this **** isn't going to indicate is he?" or "yup, they're blind, can't see me, better slow down/stop".
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That's exactly my mantra too, when on a bike everyone is out to kill you.

With car drivers in particular I assume they are blind, stupid and don't indicate. Half the time it's accurate. Having said that it's just as bad being a pedestrian a lot of the time too, a huge amount of car drivers don't indicate if there is no car following them, fine when you're in the countryside but when you are in towns around pedestrians who cross roads it's really not!
 
Edinho said:
This thread indicates why I hate cycling in this country, and places like Holland and Austria are so nice to be in.

1. Those other countries and most european countries a higher percentage of the population cycle.

2. The cycling infrastucture is a joke, give cyclist separation from traffic that what they want thats that drivers want. Again go to Holland makes our system look pathetic.




Oh nice one. Take it if was brother, sister, mum, dad, son, daughter, nephew, niece....... you would want them to be on the same road as drivers with that attitude?
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I agree cycling in this country is not good because we haven't got a decent way of doing it and because the rules are too open to abuse and people don't do it properly. In holland and elsewhere they stop for traffic lights, they have their own cycle lanes WITH traffic lights - they have added special lanes ONLY for them, and not for pedestrians etc... if we had the same system, it would be fine. :)

As for the last one, what attitude? :/ Being on the road is a dangerous place - and it was a bit of a flippant but tongue in cheek comment. Get over yourself. :)
 
Teifiterror said:
Firstly riding two abreast is perfectly legal according to the highway code, any more than this though is not allowed. We allways ride two abreast on the roads as it means drivers more often give the required distance to pas us and makes them think twice about ridiculous manouvers. Also according to the highway code a pssing car should allow the same space it would as if it was overtaking a car.

I find cyclists that jump red lights are attrocious, there is no excuse for it as we expect other road users to addere to the rules that also apply to us, what if a car jumped red lights and smacked the cyclist? I allways wait at the lights, if I am training and require a continuous uninhibited run with no stops then I go to one of the many stretches of road that are suitable or ones where there is a junction that only required a brief stop.

I don't like the anti-cycling sentiment that seems to allways crop us and I think it is likely a minority of cyclists, or also the large number of new cyclists who have no idea of the rules etc that are giving the rest of us a bad name, I would like to think I am helpful and will indicate if it is safe to pass to drivers behind or move out of the way so long as it doesnt mean I have to stop completely. Problem is I see a greater majority of drivers taking ridculous risks to get past, a large number of people who cannot understand that bikes can actually go very quickly and pull out or cut accross me at junctions causing me to often skid to a stop or now and again smack the side of their car. Also people who strive to overtake then immediately cut left at a junction, that 5 seconds whould have meant I wouldnt have had to brake suddenly!

The problem is with both sides, and often a lack of understanding of the rules that govern both road users, a bit of concideration from both sides can go a long way and also not breaking blatant rules that give other cyclists a bad name.
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If everyone had your attitude that cycled in London I think this thread would never have been prompted as no one would have been caught jumping lights as there would not have been a need for the traffic cop to be there in the first place. :)
 
Hotwired said:
You'd have to be insane to think that any impact between a bike and a car can EVER come out in a cyclists favour. Car on car is reasonably fair odds but you are on an inherently unstable metal skeleton frame on a bike, any kind of impact means at the least, a crash with the ground at whatever speed you were moving at and with a car impact, the higher energy it can transfer with it's potential speed and mass can make it much worse. There's no energy absorbing shell around you on a bike.

Anyone who likes to moan about cyclists from the comfort of a car seat should try cycling a route every day which involves a right turn through least one non-traffic light 4+ exit roundabout in rush hour times. You obviously have no idea how crap being a cyclist among many impatient, fast accelerating and quite possibly oblivious to your presence cars can be. The lack of road presence on a pedal bike is dire at times.

Cyclists have a legal right to be on the road too and if the police catch them doing especially dumb moves which cause practical problems (I don't count internal ranting about harmless movement abuse as one) they should get done for it, I watch cars perform worse manoeuvres every day in rush hour. There's no policeman round every corner, it's down to road users to behave themselves with respect to other road users 99% of the time.

I am also a driver ;)
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Of course they'll come out worse, but if they are breaking the rules of the road and cycling like a complete **** and get knocked off their bikes why the **** should the drive be prosecuted? It's unfair and disgusting - for a start most people would feel horrendously guilty in spite of being innocent.

Look, I ride a motorbike, and I've had more than my moans about car drivers on here and between friends. However there is a simple difference. Motorbikes are faster than cars, bicycles aren't - bicycles are an obstacle on the road, motorbikes aren't... but anyway. If i get knocked off my motorbike for something I did wrong I don't expect to be let off... if I get knocked off by someone being a **** then if I surive, I expect that person to be done.

The reason the law needs to be tougher on bicycles is because the risk is significantly higher to the bike rider than to the car drivers. We need to protect the numpty car drivers who don't have my sort of observation skills for example (one you develop when you ride motorbikes) , from the cyclists that do ride badly and cause a danger to themselves.

I'm not out to castigate cyclists, I think that it's fine, and a great way of keeping fit - however, there has to be more control - as the number of cyclists increase, it's getting a little daft now in town. In fact on the A and B roads, you have less problems because generally there's less chance of them making a stupid mistake! Anyone can go to a shop and buy a bike and go one the road - no rules, training etc.... I'm not trying to suggest we clamp down on the freedom that cyclists have, but we have to come to a balance.

However i agree I see people getting away with murder on the roads doing stupid manoeuvers - let's just not add cyclists to those people. There are enough morons on the road.
 
snowdog said:
You are joking surely :confused: ?

They are ignored as if they don't exist in many places, this is especially visible in Amsterdam where it's far worse than in other places.
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Well everytime I've been (several hundred times), the cycle lanes have their own traffic lights that are timed with the main road. The number of cylist death in holland is low - so they must be doing something right.
 
Freefaller said:
What's worse is the swarms of cyclists you get - you can't overtake because there is oncoming traffic so you have to drive at 10mph behind them as they wobble ahead of you.

Problem is as fun as it would be to crush 'em, it's always the driver's fault :(
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just accelerate verly slowly, when their about 10 cm from your bumper fear should kick in and they'll move :p
 
Problem is I see a greater majority of drivers taking ridculous risks to get past, a large number of people who cannot understand that bikes can actually go very quickly and pull out or cut accross me at junctions causing me to often skid to a stop or now and again smack the side of their car. Also people who strive to overtake then immediately cut left at a junction, that 5 seconds whould have meant I wouldnt have had to brake suddenly!
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Didn't see that the first time, sounds familiar.

A decent cyclist in favourable conditions can be doing the best of 30mph after all.

The only reason some utter ******* didn't get a me+bike shaped hole in his passenger side door after he tore past my bike in his BMW then made a sharp left with no indicator is because I locked the wheels and skidded for about 10 feet.

Week ago, going round a roundabout, a car decides I'm going too slowly and nips out onto the roundabout in front of me... ok, fine... I'm still going round... then the car behind that one ALSO tries to roar out but at this point my front wheel is moving out in front of the line of his bonnet and he's in line to broadside me. Screeches to a halt only a couple of feet away.

Setting new records for extreme heatbeat rate.
 
Who are we and what are our aims?

We are not sure, opinions seem to differ. There are probably as many aims of Critical Mass (CM) as there are participants. Each individual comes there with his or her own idea of what it's about, and the sum of this makes up the Mass. We have no organisers and no planned routes.

The London monthly rides started in April 1994 and take place on the last Friday of the month, starting at 6.00pm from the South Bank under Waterloo Bridge, by the National Film Theatre (next ride September 25th).

It isn't just for cyclists, sometimes there are wheelchairers, skateboarders, roller bladers, roller skaters and other self-propelled people. Cycle sound systems often play music on the ride.

http://www.criticalmasslondon.org.uk/main.html
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Excellent idea, it should be repeated in all major cities in the UK until the Government does something serious to encourage cycling here :)

Go Holland!
 
Critical Mass are a bunch of fools. Corking on critical mass rides is a stupid idea that just makes drivers angry and makes they hate all cyclists, including the decent ones. Mass riding is ok, but they should obey the rules of the road at all times.
 
Tute said:
I hate those cyclists that are also pedestrians, and swap from road to pavement and back again almost at will.
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Ones that dismount or ones that ride on the footpath? If they dismount, then what's the problem? If they ride on the footpath then they should have the book thrown at them.

Freefaller said:
Whilst I know we'll get a lot of cyclists saying "I never jump the lights" - I'd hazard a guess that in London, it's the minority that don't.
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Most cyclists are actually pretty good. Travel from Waterloo to Tower Bridge by car (or bike) one morning, or join the Embankment Peloton, and you'll see that the vast majority of cyclists are actually good about these things, it's jsut a minority that let us down.
 
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