Soldato
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Well I did narrow it down to deaths by police shootings: approximately 5000 over a decade. The vast majority of which were legitimate killings.
Protect and Serve . . . yeah right !
- Thread starter Sliver
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Well I did narrow it down to deaths by police shootings: approximately 5000 over a decade. The vast majority of which were legitimate killings.
928 x 8 = 7424 = your chances of being killed by police in the US were higher than that of US servicemen being killed in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Soldato
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Your chances are not higher. Even if 20,000 people were killed by police in a decade, you'd still be vastly more likely to have been killed in Iraq or Afghanistan.
It might be true that the total number of victims is higher, but there is no good source for that and most estimates seem to place at under 10,000.
Not really how you would calculate it.
you would count the population and how many have died...for example 7424 in 319,000,000
then you would count how many were sent to Iraq Afghanistan and how many died there....
thats not even taking into account the time spent at location
As much as I would celebrate guns being removed from US society, it will never happen.
Firstly, do you realize how many guns there are in the US? How would you even begin to try and account for them all? Those guns would just disappear into the black market, then you're in an even more horrible position. As it is now, at least there is usually some sort of paper trail when tracing a gun. If those guns all went underground......nightmare.
Secondly, about half the US population would never give up their guns anyway. Those who are pro-guns tend to be vehemently proud of the constitution (as ridiculous as that seems to me, but whatever...) and are often heard saying "they'll have to pry my gun out of my cold, dead hand" and "there would be a revolution!", etc, etc. They're serious too, most of them.
tl;dr: there would be absolutely no desire to get rid of guns, the logistics of such a plan would be mind-boggling, and it would only make matter worse anyway.
As true as that may seem today, you never know what tomorrow will bring. Never say never.
Yes as I've already posted regarding this:
I reject your hypothesis that these guns will simply disappear into the black market and so the problem will remain/be worse. We have a black market in the UK where guns can be bought. Gun crime is not a problem in the UK. Change the law and you change the people by and large.
Again, a silly assumption. Change the law and the people will change by and large, those who resist will be prosecuted and forced to change. This is why we have laws. To force people to comply. A minority may resist but they will ultimately be forced to comply.
Nonsense. Sorry but nonsense.
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Very true, I realize the error in the statement. Would be more accurate to say that an American is more likely to be killed by police than they are to be (sent to fight and) killed in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Thanks for pointing that out, guys.
It's not a good sign that there is no entirely good source for accurate stats on people shot by police in the US. Perhaps that, in itself, speaks volumes about a nasty trend that needs checking.
So yet again I ask; how would you go about it? If a spate of school/university/public place shootings isn't enough to persuade to reconsider their stance on firearms ownership (if anything it just made the sentiment stronger in many cases) then what are you suggesting will?
Where is it you think they'll go? Either people will hand them in or they won't, and in a country with firearms as a part of their culture, many won't. Not to mention the already-plentiful number of illegal firearms already in circulation.
So having illegal firearms in circulation isn't considered a problem?
Again, no idea why you keep bringing the UK into this.
You're still looking at this as a ridiculously simplistic thing. How do you even expect such a law to get passed in the first place? Why would America want to do it, and how would they ever get it past the various levels of government? Hell, the NRA has 5 million members and is a powerful lobbyist, you really think they'd just roll over and hand their guns in?
No, it isn't. Unfortunately you're so fixated on your impossible fantasy of a gun-free USA that you refute any criticism made against it without even taking the time to consider the points people are making.
So yet again I ask; how would you go about it? If a spate of school/university/public place shootings isn't enough to persuade to reconsider their stance on firearms ownership (if anything it just made the sentiment stronger in many cases) then what are you suggesting will?
Where is it you think they'll go? Either people will hand them in or they won't, and in a country with firearms as a part of their culture, many won't. Not to mention the already-plentiful number of illegal firearms already in circulation.
So having illegal firearms in circulation isn't considered a problem?
Again, no idea why you keep bringing the UK into this.
You're still looking at this as a ridiculously simplistic thing. How do you even expect such a law to get passed in the first place? Why would America want to do it, and how would they ever get it past the various levels of government? Hell, the NRA has 5 million members and is a powerful lobbyist, you really think they'd just roll over and hand their guns in?
No, it isn't. Unfortunately you're so fixated on your impossible fantasy of a gun-free USA that you refute any criticism made against it without even taking the time to consider the points people are making.
I disagree with everything you said. You have your opinion I have mine. Go figure.
Soldato
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just saw on facebook a video of man holding a screw driver getting shot, The person is mentally ill and apparently threatening people but is this how ill people should be treated with?
VIDEO: Shocking moment police shoot dead mentally ill man holding screwdriver
VIDEO: Shocking moment police shoot dead mentally ill man holding screwdriver
That's actually pretty terrible - He didn't even threaten.
Better article and slightly more coherent video on Guardian;
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/mar/18/video-dallas-police-shooting-mentally-ill-black-man
Soldato
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yep it's disgusting
just a regular day
Man of Honour
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You don't know that, the BWV isn't clear enough to see if he threatened or not.
Man of Honour
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Being ill doesn't change how the Police use force, just like it doesn't change the threat level that someone poses. Some who is ill can kill just as easily as someone who isn't.
Whilst I am very much an advocate for better MH care, this is a complete red herring.
Soldato
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more than one way to deal with a "threat" than kill people
Soldato
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oh look
this cop did get charged, about ******* time
this cop did get charged, about ******* time
.