Questions - Diesel engine and transmission / gearbox reliability circa 2014-2019 -BMW - Mercedes - Audi ( on small hatchback or coupe models)

[DJMK4]

Hi all

May need to look at refreshing my car at some point.

Car history last has been



BMW e82 120d coup m sport (2010)
BMW e92 320d (2004)
VW golf Mk5 tdi 2.0
VW golf MK4 tdi1.9


Engine wise on BMWs I always oil and filter serviced them at 7-8k

I am possibly looking for something newer to replace my current car 120d later in the year. I am not going to be spending £15-20k on a car. But I could spend up to £10k possibly..

Usually I buy cars with 60-65k ish miles. May stretch to 70k

I want people's opinions on the reliability of engines from.BMW and things to aggressively look for.. think major catastrophic issues (n47 timing chain issue I had to look for when looking for current car) for example .. is the engine reliability in the 1 and 2 series BMWs pretty decent between 2014 -2019? What's the transmissions like ?

One thing that annoys me a little about BMW is things like clutch system, I'm having issues atm where I can't really hear clutch noises or rattle but one thing that's rearing its head at the moment on 126k is the clutch peddle won't depress properly. Hoping a bleed will sort

With regards to other manufacturers do we have clear winners in terms of engine and transmission/ gearbox reliability BMW Vs Merc ( A or C? Class type cars) or even some Audi models.?



I know it's and outs of so far the BMW side of things. I'm pretty not up to par with info on Merc and even Audi these days to help make a decision

 

[DJMK4]

Why does it have to be a BMW or an Audi? At this budget it's difficult to see what you're getting for your money that's much better than your current car.

Because i like BMW and Audi's

Also, having owned two BMW's , i also liked how the 120d E82 coup felt on the road, for the model of car, it handled and drove pretty well. OK it didnt have some of the idrive stuff but i know later models do, i also heard the 2 series was a pretty good model to go for.

What would you reccomend ? Im not going to go for something like a Focus ST or an Astra if this is what your thinking


The reason why i am looking is because my car is currently on 127k, in a year or so it will be on possibly 130-140k... Yes it may live to 169k like my previous 320D did, but i am getting feels of a potential transmission issue on this current one, so im trying to avoid going down having to pit money in to repairs, and seeing what else was about so i can chop it in before i start having to spend thousand on repairs etc, pretty simple really.

 

[DJMK4]

I can't see how any 10k BMW will be much different. It's not going to buy you a reasonably new or low mileage car and if yours has been well looked after I doubt there will be much difference in expected reliability.

I looked after my 320d well, it got serviced a lot, the oil changes were very frequent, unfortunatly it lasted until 169k when i had bottom end engine failure.

I have also looked after my 120d e82 well.

If i look around im pretty sure i could pick up another 60-65k milage, just like i picked up the above two models on, and it will probably be a circa 2014-2016 model.

Not no by all means, i wouldn't be expecting a 2022 car for that price no. What you have to remember is that yes my current 120d is a 2010 model, but it still has the later variant of the N47 engine.

I dont have idrive etc.


Whats the alternative ? keep my car, i would have a possible pending clutch replacement coming up, circa £1-1.2k, then what? keep it for another year, maybe year and a half or two, then have to chop it in as it could be on circa 135-140k miles, before it starts to deteriorate more.

The reason i am asking about transmission, clutch, gearbox and engine reliability is i want to try and see if some of the newer engines are more reliable than the N47, also, my journey is a mixture of motorway driving, but also can also be some annoying start stop traffic which means i am using the clutch quite a bit, and don't want something that's going to fall apart easily when the clutch can be heavily used.

 

[DJMK4]

So will a 10k 3 series.

I'd be surprised if you can find a 60k mile example unless it's an older car and really age can be as much of an issue as mileage in reliability terms anyway.

I just don't think it'll be enough of an improvement to be worth it.

See reply above, so i guess keep the car until 150k then ? and then see how things go ? with potential repairs in between what im on now, and 150k. or spend more money,

I would probably be able to (if i look hard enough) be able to find a 2 series example,

 

[DJMK4]

Have you actually looked at what £10k might buy you? Whilst the market has corrected a bit in recent months, I think you might be unpleasantly surprised by just how far £10k doesn't go these days...

Whats the alternative ? im not buying a Focus ST, or an Astra

I also kind of disagree that keeping my current car would also be the best choice, it maybe, but it also maybe not, i could turn in to a money pit , or it may not.

Its a 50/50 chance.

 

[DJMK4]

Just while i am on here, new starter motor (Bosch) and clutch bleed done on the 120D this morning, Hopefully this cures a bit of the clutch pedel depressing problems i had and gives it a bit of life, and also the car now starts after i had starter motor issues.

 

[DJMK4]

More money or lower expectations - I think you'd be looking at 2013/4 120ds at that budget with that mileage, so not getting away from the N47. 2015/6 models that you mentioned look to be proper scraping the barrel examples, Cat cars etc.

Doesn't seem like it'd be a substantial enough jump to me to avoid the things you're trying to get away from.

I dont think so, bearing in mind 4 years ago (granted it was before covid and the cost of living) i picked up my 120d E82 2010 on 65k miles @ £5500

I am not sure what the market is like at the moment, to be honest i havnt really started looking properly. The N47 timing chain issue was apparently improved after the 2010 models, but im not sure on the reliability of this "chat" about it. Apparently the 2010 model i have is one of the more improved models but id take that with a pinch of salt.

I believe you would be paying what you would be paying, if a garage wont budge on a price, then i wont go over the budget, simples, they can leave the car on the forecourt, if they want to sell the car they will find a way of bargening on price.

If i have time to look around, then i will look around to see what is about. Just because a cost of living crysis has happened, i dont think that everything in the world has gone up, it probably just takes a bit more effort on searching, if you want a spefic type of car why lower the standards and go with a medocre manufacturer ?

Have you found any particular cars that you are considering?

Not at the moment, i dont really know enough about mercs or Audi's engine reliability this is what im trying to find out. And i don't want to sacrifice for a non german car.

I don't think you would get me buying like i said a ford, astra, etc

I am too much of a fan of german cars. I believe i have been in many chats with forum posts about this before so i dont want to keep repeating myself.


I feel comfortable with BMW, there are still extras that i could gain with going with a new model, idrive etc. so even if i do go for a newer model id still be getting an upgrade on something.




Anyway, lets see how the 120d goes for the moment. and i will just scan the market searching.

 

[DJMK4]

I think you'll be in for a rude awakening when you actually start looking then

There has to be a deal out there somewhere.

I'm not going to go for a non-German car


I have not owned one in a long time


Either i look around, or don't look around, and keep my car for longer, adding more miles, more repairs and eventually run the risk of it running out of steam in its later years.


The reason why i want to try and pro-actively keep my eye on the market as my last car (the 320D) died on me unexpectedly, leaving me without a car, this all happened on a boxing day in December) and it ruined my xmas and new years about 5-6 years ago as i then had to reactively find a replacement during the xmas and new year period.

 

[DJMK4]

I'd be looking for an m sport coup model generally. And want to check if the clutches/ pedal system have improved on the newer models . And less anxiety about engine even though my engine seems fine atm. But there's always a thought in the back of your head. Just keep to good servicing regulaly.

 

[DJMK4]

So in summary you're ideally looking for a 2015 or newer 220d Coupe M Sport (Manual) with 60,000 miles (ish)?

Unless someone can persuade me to go for a different model of car then I guess I'll stick with what I know, Iv been having a look and there are models out there if 2 series varient, Iv spotted a few that have had clutch replacements and selling at 60k which is worrying. And I'm looking somewhere around 60-70k miles 2016 or newer

 

[DJMK4]

Merc, BMW and Audi use a zf gearbox, very reliable, however don't believe the sealed for life gumph the dealer puts out. Transmission service every few years (new fluid and filter) works wonders.

None really produce reliable diesel's that won't cost you a packet when they go wrong and they will I can assure you.

However the BMW 3.0d is probably one of the best.

If you want a smaller engine then the 2.0 TDI in the Audi is the cheaper of the 3 to run and repair costs will be much lower (as the 2.0 is fitted in everything vag)

The BMW 2.0d needs to be avoided

I have no comments on the Merc om654 in terms of reliability

I did a transmission gearbox oil change on the e82 120d i own now but now but it's the clutch thats not feeling right atm.

Audi I'd probably want to still do oil/filter changed changes 7-9k, and back to timing belts and water pump intervals

With my previous 320d series I bought it on 67k and it died on 169k that's a good 100k miles out a a car. Which isn't bad.

I will continue having a think

 

[DJMK4]

N20 engines in BMW then seem to be agressivly worse in terms of timing chains. I have spotted a few on auto trader with 50-70k miles saying timing chain replaced.

Looks like a lot more of a earlier than the n47 timing chains used to fail ?

 

[DJMK4]

All depends on how they are looked after - apparently the key to preventing chain stretch is regular (~10k miles) oil changes to reduced oil channels blocking, whilst the F series (2012/13 on) has the replacement chain kit which is more durable (but still susceptible if oil changes aren't done early).

My F30 320D is going strong at 186k (bought at 7k), but looking to change as it's getting a bit tired (not engine related). I have been doing oil and filter every 10k from about 50k miles, with air and fuel filter changes every other oil change.

Yep I know

Iv owned 2 x BMWs

BMW 320d 2006 E90
BMW 120d 2010 E82

Iv always serviced the oil and oil filter after 7-8k miles . I think there has only been one time where I let it slip to 10k before it was changed


Even if I wasn't a BMW owner id still stick to under 10k oil and filter servicing

 

[DJMK4]

Hi all.

Bit of a bump again as I'm still thinking about next car.

As I have not had a VAG car in a long time (looking at Audi) .. is correct in saying cam belts and water pump need replacing still after 50-60k on the clock ? If I was to go down the route of buying one I would usually buy something that's had the cambelt and water pump done on 60k ish miles , but I'd have to change again at around 110-120kish?

Are you looking about £500 for this to be done these days ?

Iv got a to weigh up this or continue with BMW and the possibility of timing chain replacement and clutch/ transmission issues . I'm looking at a lot of BMW adverts which mention timing chain replacements which is scaring me abit

 

[DJMK4]

Started searching more recently now, autotrader etc,


Looking at some A5's

found one - (2.0TDi S-line) i think the prices i seem to be getting for say a 65-70k mileage car (2014) sline for instance is around £9-10k although some of them havnt had things like cambelt and waterpump done , some of them have . Tried one place and said he wouldnt budge on price on something that hasnt had the cambelt and waterpump done.

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Another question, usually i try and stick with trade places (for security and assurance, and if they offer it warrenty)

How many of you guys have delved in to private sales? or steered clear of them and stuck with trade only.

 

[DJMK4]

From what I have been reading it's been preferencial to go for some audis over the Skoda

I'm not a fan of Skoda so probably out of the question . Or lexus

When you say dsg you mean gearbox ? It can't be as bad as the BMW gearboxes I have had in the past 2 cars. I have had a quick sit and go in an a4 before not an a5 I felt it was a lot smoother than the current and past BMW gearboxs I have used


With the rac / aa checks do they do code reading checks ?

I'm not sure if id go private yet as I may part ex and may chuck down 3-4k deposit and maybe £1-2k on 0% card rest on finance with overpay to clear within 6 months

I don't think anyone would convince me to go for anything else out of the BMW, Audi , VW group

Merc is another option but I found in prefer the interior dash etc on Audi's


If you go via a trader,.how often these days do they have wiggle room on the price If things like cambelt and water pump have not been done ? Iv not owned a car with cambelt or waterpump In years .

Would they be likely to drop the price or include the service as part of the deal ? Rather than you having to then absorb the cost yourself ?

 

[DJMK4]

Iv got suspension knocking on my current 120d m sport. starting around 95k . I'm sure I had it on my old 3 series at 100k

The used market is a little depressing yes. But what's the alternative..I don't think I'd go for an different make other than what's been specified.

Has anyone taken on any purchases which are cat n - like door need replacing ? Seen an a5 in birmingham on 50ish k miles grey 2017 but private seller.


Or auctions to bring the price down abit ?

Usually I wouldn't mind traders but like with everything at the moment in the current climate people are trying to profiteer on inflated prices

 

[DJMK4]

The F30 330d does look nice although I'm not seeing any really that's within budget and doesn't have lots of miles or is only 2 years older than the car I currently have. Not necessarily looking for a 3.0 but reading reviews a lot of people including yourselves seem to think the engine Is reliable and shouldnt suffer timing chain issues .

I agree though on the other point. Driving some previous BMWs around uneven potted roads there is so many knocks . Not sure what the later ones are like.


Yes I understand MOT generally is for general purpose testing. Suspensions, breaking , safety, awareness indication etc


In most cases a code reader at the point of viewing and test driving is what I would normally do. On my previous purchase as the car before was also a BMW I had a code reader. But the rest would be instinct and checking yourself.

.
My main aims at the moment at

- want a reliable engine
- want a reliable transmission and gearbox
- want something that handles both well with a hybrid of city and motorway driving
-good suspension/ shock system

-new features and not the same feel BMW dashboard Iv been staring at for the past 8-9 years..

I'm still torn between BMW and Audi atm, also still torn between petrol Vs diesel

I live on the edge of a city , so use a mixture of dual carriageway, and single a roads, also motorway. However milage is not huge at the moment.

 

[DJMK4]

Sorry if I've missed this, but why diesel? Your milage seems very low to try and justify it and as someone posted about diesels tend to be expensive to repair when they go wrong. I know modern petrols have more bits in them too, but I'd have thought it would be the safer choice (although I'm not sure if that would cost more than a diesel).

The last 4 cars I have owned have been diesel..

Golf MK4
Golf Mk5


BMW 320d
BMW 120d

My usage fluctuates.

Yes at the moment I'm working pretty close to home..but I also do some.dual.carrageway and motorway stints..also who knows my milage could change although I'm.hoping it doesnt.


Iv not owned a petrol in so many years now I don't really know reliability etc. They don't last aslong as diesel engines typically do they ? But they don't come with as many issues like getting carbed up, dpf and egr

If you service it well what's the possible life expectancy to keep the car say If you bought a petrol tfsi or something on 60-65k miles , could you run it up to 160k without having a catastrophy?

 

[DJMK4]

If you're not already aware, BMW replaced the N series engines around the 2016 year (depending upon the model) with the B48 series (for the 4 pots). I get the impression that it's a good deal more reliable than the N series.

Ill have a look more at F30 engines models and 4 pot B48 when I get a chance .thanks

On another note

I think a test drive in a petrol car will probably sway me over, I just don't want it to start costing loads. I am a driver of not only city but dual carriageway and motorways. So I can't be placed in to an specific urban catagory.