Quick creatine question

Oakesy2001uk · 9 Jan 2007 at 17:02

A friend of mine is using creatine, (I personally dont see the benefit past water retention but he may prove me wrong), but he has a question regarding ammounts etc...

He currently has 2 protein shakes a day like myself, one a breakfast and one after workout/at night on rest days, he is currently putting 5g in each shake every day, is this ok, or is he supposed to do the load/maintain cycles, (i.e lots for a week, little for a week and repeat).

He is using Reflex creapture creatine, and is obviously too lazy to find out for himself so I thaught I would ask you very knowledgeable chaps on here.

Styles · 9 Jan 2007 at 17:32

Never used the stuff myself, but will it not say on the label of the product?

Chong Warrior · 9 Jan 2007 at 17:37

5g-7g in his PWO shake is fine, no need to load and don't really need to take everyday, though it won't do him any harm. Just make sure he takes it with something that will cause an insulin spike to ensure maximum uptake. Whey in water or with simple carbs will be fine.

PikeyPriest · 9 Jan 2007 at 17:48

5 days loading at 20g should allow your muscles to reach optimal concentrations rapidly. After that 3-5g daily is adequate to maintain high levels. Take it with carbs as mentioned and avoid caffeine as studies show it negates the any benefits of creatine.

Chong Warrior · 9 Jan 2007 at 18:06

PikeyPriest said:
5 days loading at 20g should allow your muscles to reach optimal concentrations rapidly. After that 3-5g daily is adequate to maintain high levels. Take it with carbs as mentioned and avoid caffeine as studies show it negates the any benefits of creatine.

Please show me proof that 20g a day for 5 days is required.

That's something found printed on a Maximuscle tub

Oakesy2001uk · 9 Jan 2007 at 18:10

PikeyPriest said:
5 days loading at 20g should allow your muscles to reach optimal concentrations rapidly. After that 3-5g daily is adequate to maintain high levels. Take it with carbs as mentioned and avoid caffeine as studies show it negates the any benefits of creatine.

so is 10 grammes each in his 2 shakes for 5 days ok, then 5g in his nightly/pwo shake once his muscle are full of it. or does it have to be 4*5g for 5 days. is 10g too much in one sitting when loading?

Chong Warrior · 9 Jan 2007 at 18:18

Oakesy2001uk said:
so is 10 grammes each in his 2 shakes for 5 days ok, then 5g in his nightly/pwo shake once his muscle are full of it. or does it have to be 4*5g for 5 days. is 10g too much in one sitting when loading?

5g a day is plenty and is all that's required, no need to load.

A2Z · 9 Jan 2007 at 18:18

http://www.muscletalk.co.uk/article-creatine.aspx

has some good info

Morba · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:06

PikeyPriest said:
5 days loading at 20g should allow your muscles to reach optimal concentrations rapidly. After that 3-5g daily is adequate to maintain high levels. Take it with carbs as mentioned and avoid caffeine as studies show it negates the any benefits of creatine.

there were tests a while ago that showed that over a 2 week period, the people that loaded had better gains, however, over a 4 week period both sets of testers gains were the same.
result - there is no need to load.

Morba · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:08

Oakesy2001uk said:
A friend of mine is using creatine, (I personally dont see the benefit past water retention but he may prove me wrong),.

the benefit is from water retention. you retain water and can lift a small percentage more because of it, this helps build larger underlying muscle.

Skull · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:19

If you load you'll be using 170g of the stuff, if you don't you'll only use 105g, and have the same benefits at the 4 week stage. No sense in urinating thirteen teaspoons of the stuff out is there.

Nazbit · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:21

Oakesy2001uk said:
A friend of mine is using creatine, (I personally dont see the benefit past water retention but he may prove me wrong),

Water retention has its advantages, yes the water retention will mean that you loose a little when you come off the creatine, you will have gained more mass in the time that you were on it than you would have in the same amount of time without it.

As for doses 5g a go is fine. With regards to loading, yes you might think that you are seeing results faster from loading, there is an endless stack of research suggesting that there is no difference at the end of a cycle, loading is in my opinion a way for the company to shift more.

brocksta · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:29

i thought creatine was meant to be taken before a workout?

Nazbit · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:36

brocksta said:
i thought creatine was meant to be taken before a workout?

It depends on the type of creatine.

If its creatine monohydrate then most manufacturers will suggest that 5g an hour before a work out is a good dosage, but research shows that it has better results when taken at the end of a session.

The theory is that the end of a session is when your muscles are depleted and crying out for creatine, lots will be absorbed and the muscles will b fully loaded and ready to go again next time.

If you take it before a workout it is less likely to enter the muscles as your muscles will already be holding a fair amount, and they can only store so much.

More advanced creatines have very different dosages.

brocksta · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:45

blimey, so that applies for CEE too?

Nazbit · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:53

No CEE is a bit different. It has a much better rate of absorbtion in the body per gram taken.

This means that you only need a smaller dosage to get the same results as you would from mono.

Therefore its often standard practise to take smaller dosages of CEE both before and after the workout. Although here, different forms of CEE will vary slightly.

Mark A · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:54

PikeyPriest said:
avoid caffeine as studies show it negates the any benefits of creatine.

is this true?, looks like i'll have to start buying decaf from now on. Would one cup of coffee in the morning cancel the effects of creatine then?, i need a coffee in the morning to wake me up.

benjo plz. · 9 Jan 2007 at 21:56

Which form's best?

Nazbit · 9 Jan 2007 at 22:02

Phnom_Penh said:
Which form's best?

A long fought debate.

It depends where you are in your training. If you feel that you are ready to start taking creatine and that it will help you to acheive your goals then you should start with creatine monohydrate.

Its important that you understand, not everyone responds to creatine, its estimated for 1/3 of people are non responders. This is the rate for mono, rates for more advanced creatines such as CEE and CEO are a bit lower.

So you should start with mono and go from there.

Later on in your training career you might consider CEE or similar creatine complexes, but you should spend *atleast* 6 months cycling the mono on and off before you consider anything more advanced, you simply wont need it.

PikeyPriest · 9 Jan 2007 at 22:26

Mark A said:
is this true?, looks like i'll have to start buying decaf from now on. Would one cup of coffee in the morning cancel the effects of creatine then?, i need a coffee in the morning to wake me up.

The study was using 5mg/kg/day - so it should be fine as long as you arent a *crazy* coffee addict.

Think starbucks is 250 mg for a small coffee though, compared to 70ish mg for instant (depends how strong you make it though).