Indeed. Sad really that he has no time for a real life.
Receiving calls from customers.
- Thread starter Admiral Huddy
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Indeed. Sad really that he has no time for a real life.
I would say it's skilled labour, it requires knowlege on how things work, it's something not everyone can do.[TW]Fox;12979552 said:
Unskilled work is stuff literally ANYONE can do, clean rubbish, pour drinks, clean toilets, pack boxes etc etc.
Soldato
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[TW]Fox;12980205 said:
As if I'd waste more time discussing it with you
We both know it's pointless, you are utterly incapable of rational debate because in your mind there is no other opinion than your own. 
I think one thing, you think another. I'm quite happy to leave it there rather than try to sway opinion
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Actually, I did
What's the laptop model so we can get an idea of the work involved in getting the harddisk out?
Actually, I did
To be pedantic, and in an utterly friendly way, you asked whether he worked from home or whether he had a workshop. Once he had answered that question, you immediately responded saying that although you didn't know him, you would guess he was 17-20 and doing it as a hobby
maybe not but if you get it wrong then your families lives could be at stake as well as the very building you carried out the work in. For this reason people pay a Corgi registered gas fitter, the price includes some peace of mind.
Again if you make a mistake your home and contents may be at risk of damage. I would happily do basics such as u-bends etc I'm even going to tackle fitting a new toilet and bath at some point but as for re-routing pipework through my house, I'll give that a miss.
I'm not fussed about in house electrical or plumbing (of course I've not done any electrical since the rules changed) but then again I don't do work on the car - I don't have the time, tools or workshop to do it in, plus I need it to get me to work every morning and can't have it off the road for long periods. Plus I'm a little bit scared of it
And this is what people have overlooked I think, even with my knowledge of PCs, let's say I had a whole years worth of accounts or maybe something even more valuable on my PC, a huge list of customer contacts that I needed to keep a business afloat, I may consider paying someone to sort it out. People do forget to back things like that up assuming the PC will always be there.
As people, myself included, have said a full re-install is easy, however, I suppose a PC is often worth more to people than the sum of it's parts.
£35 per hour to sort my gaming PC out is unthinkable when I could simply wipe it and start from scratch, If it was the heart of my business I would maybe get a pro in.....but I'd haggle
after all it's someone else to blame if it all goes wrong!......which we all know can happen.
Soldato
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The thing is that flat rate pricing and no-fix no-fee guarantees are becoming far more common and can be a big plus for your business - it reassures the customer that there willl be no extra fees for the labour.
The first thing i said when i heard the hourly rate (recently this was when i required a plumber) was 1) "ok but how can i be sure the problem is fixed in a timely fashion?" and 2) "what is the average timing / cost for this kind of problem?" now you can image that these issues are amplified when the customer cannot see you work and / or has very little knowledge of the computers problem - this is not so truw with plumbing and electrical faults.
The first thing i said when i heard the hourly rate (recently this was when i required a plumber) was 1) "ok but how can i be sure the problem is fixed in a timely fashion?" and 2) "what is the average timing / cost for this kind of problem?" now you can image that these issues are amplified when the customer cannot see you work and / or has very little knowledge of the computers problem - this is not so truw with plumbing and electrical faults.
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My local computer shop charged a tenner to test a CPU and a few quid to clean the pins with a solvent. Hardly skilled work.
Skilled computer work would involve diagnosing a very rare problem that can't be googled AT ALL like getting old software working on vista.
EDIT: Example: get Quake 4 to run with ATI 3xxx in Vista. No known solution, I've already asked on the AMD forums, this is a genuine skilled problem involving OpenGL.
Skilled computer work would involve diagnosing a very rare problem that can't be googled AT ALL like getting old software working on vista.
EDIT: Example: get Quake 4 to run with ATI 3xxx in Vista. No known solution, I've already asked on the AMD forums, this is a genuine skilled problem involving OpenGL.
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Not skilled but you can hardly expect them to waste time doing it for free can you. If they started doing that they could spend all day testing bits for people then make no cash and go out of business
True.
The bottom line here, is that people should be asking friends and relatives for recommendations rather than cold calling people through Yellow Pages or whatever.
Not always possible if you have moved to a new area, but you could always ask the neighbours.
My nextdoor neighbour tried to pay me £20 for ordering some DVD's from Amazon for him because he thinks computers are something to do with witchcraft.
He doesn't care that he could easily teach himself how to use one in about 5 minutes, he doesn't care that if he read a few books and watched a tutorial he'd know how to build his own system. He has no knowledge and no inclination to gain that knowledge, he'd rather just pay someone to do it all for him.
Many jobs are easy when you know what you are doing (although many do remain difficult regardless of experience!) Knowledge is power.
I struggled recently to get a half passable plastered finish on a small wall having watched videos, read books, spoken to plasterers for advice. But the guy who did the kitchen did the same job, better, with less waste, in about a tenth of the time.
Replacing a neighbours starter motor took me 15 minutes, even though I'd never worked on his particular make of car before. He asked me what I wanted as payment and I told him I didn't want anything because it was easy. He told me it might have been easy for me but he wouldn't even know how to open the bonnet and would have happily paid a garage £100 to confirm his amateur diagnosis and swap the part (which he supplied)
Just because you find something easy does not mean the same will go for everyone.
Oh and Huddy, 17 years old? In the head maybe
He doesn't care that he could easily teach himself how to use one in about 5 minutes, he doesn't care that if he read a few books and watched a tutorial he'd know how to build his own system. He has no knowledge and no inclination to gain that knowledge, he'd rather just pay someone to do it all for him.
Many jobs are easy when you know what you are doing (although many do remain difficult regardless of experience!) Knowledge is power.
I struggled recently to get a half passable plastered finish on a small wall having watched videos, read books, spoken to plasterers for advice. But the guy who did the kitchen did the same job, better, with less waste, in about a tenth of the time.
Replacing a neighbours starter motor took me 15 minutes, even though I'd never worked on his particular make of car before. He asked me what I wanted as payment and I told him I didn't want anything because it was easy. He told me it might have been easy for me but he wouldn't even know how to open the bonnet and would have happily paid a garage £100 to confirm his amateur diagnosis and swap the part (which he supplied)
Just because you find something easy does not mean the same will go for everyone.
Oh and Huddy, 17 years old? In the head maybe
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Thought still £35 per hour
I don't see it as overpriced, especially considering his location. My brother is a freelance graphic designer and he charges a lot more than £35 and hour. Most of the work he considers to be easy. Put me in front of Photoshop and it would take me about a week to do his simple task.
So it's all relative and seeing as peoples time is valuable (very valuable) I'd be happy to pay somebody to do something that would take up a lot of my time. I can do basic pointing but no way would I do all the work (a whole wall) so I'll pay somebody.
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Personally I charge my time on the values of what they can afford and what the job deserves.
![[TW]Fox](/data/man-of-honor/2009.png){kind=avatar}
As if I'd waste more time discussing it with you
It's not really a matter of opinion, the concept of skilled versus unskilled labour and what sort of jobs fall into each category is something thats been enshrined in society for many years. Are you arrogant enough to think you know better?
Skilled labour = master craftsman. Not the guy who fixes your washing machine, replaces the oil filter on your car or puts a new hard drive in your PC.
I was going to make a similar point. There may not be much knowledge or skill involved in installing a hard drive or upgrading Windows, but being able to effectively troubleshoot some of the more obscure hardware or software problems is something which only really comes with experience. If I were paying for someone to fix a non-trivial problem on my PC, I'd be paying for their experience and their ability to employ it in a problem-solving process, not their ability to poke about in my case with a Philips screwdriver. That, to my mind, puts it on the 'skilled' end of the spectrum.
what do you think of someone who rebuilds engines and transmissions for a living, thats just swapping parts after all[TW]Fox;12982403 said:It's not really a matter of opinion, the concept of skilled versus unskilled labour and what sort of jobs fall into each category is something thats been enshrined in society for many years. Are you arrogant enough to think you know better?
Skilled labour = master craftsman. Not the guy who fixes your washing machine, replaces the oil filter on your car or puts a new hard drive in your PC.
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Oh and Huddy, 17 years old? In the head maybe
Absolutely haha I can't even remember being 37, let alone 17!
As for the skilled/ unskilled debate, basically I would have thought that any job that entails some kind of long term training would classify one as being a skilled worker. This includes car mechanics, plumbers, electricians etc. Of course, it's all relative so I wouldn’t expect the aforementioned to be on same king of rate as doctor, for example. Conversely, I wouldn’t expect a complete novice to make a visit to a client who might be experiencing problems.
As I said before, I’d happily pay a mechanic £35 plus to fix my car and I have done. I pay for two benefits in this case: 1. I don’t have clue what I’m doing and 2: It spares me the time. So why would a PC technician be any different?
You have to remember too, unlike most people on these boards, most people I deal with are not only computer illiterate but are actually frightened of doing some thing wrong. So trust also comes into play and it’s important to obtain their trust. Therefore, I don’t tend to charge for my advice and a lot of customers do return because I have gained their confidence and trust.
That said, regardless of that debate, I completed my research before embarking on the work. A majority of people are more than happy to pay £35 to repair their broken or otherwise bugged systems. Remembering too, that this price includes visiting their home or office.
What surprises me is the stark contrast of some peoples expectations from value to “I’ll call you back” but as already answered, people have to find out they are getting the best deal before committing.