Road Cycling Essentials

[Saundie]

Cheers for the inputs on the touring bike, I'm going to try and head up to London to take a look at the Kona Sutra. I've read quite a lot of favourable reviews and apparently Kona have been improving it year after year to make it more suitable to touring.

Thorn Sherpa is nice too, but at that price range I'd be opting for a LHT due to its reputation. Right now the LHT feels a little out of my budget because of all the extra stuff I'd need to buy to convert it into a full tourer (racks, panniers, etc).

It sounds as though you have your heart set on the LHT, maybe you should look into it if it's not too much over your budget. I bought my Pompetamine over a proper touring bike because it's what I really wanted, and I look forward to riding it because of that. When I ride my other bikes, I find myself thinking "I wish I were on my Pompetamine". That's not to say you shouldn't look at the other options (the Kona Sutra does indeed get good reviews, after all), as there's a quite a lot out there.

I'll also take a closer look at the Dawes Galaxy too, and keep you updated Saundie! Let me know if you have any recommendations too r.e. touring equipment.

I'm hoping that it didn't come across as too strong an endorsement; I've never ridden one, after all, I've just seen it get lots of mentions on various cycling forums. I decided against getting a full touring bike when I realised that I will only ever tour on normal roads. As a result, I'm in the process of converting my Pompetamine into a sort of Audax/fast touring bike. I've not actually been touring yet, so I am not a good source of information on the subject unfortunately. I'm hoping to get out for some weekend tours in April or May, depending on the temperatures.

 

[Jonny69]

The headwind this week has been hell. It's taking me about 1/3 longer to get to the station

Also managed to chew up the bearings in my bottom bracket. Nipped them up this morning but I think a few days of them being a bit loose has worn them a bit ovalised. I'm going to try and bed them back in by running them too tight, but otherwise I think it's new bearings time and I'll probably switch to a new sealed cartridge instead of the older style cups.

 

[Saundie]

The headwind this week has been hell. It's taking me about 1/3 longer to get to the station

Agreed, I thought I had a puncture again it was so harsh. I've been forced to abandon the panniers as they were killing me in the wind. Fortunately the new tyres (Schwalbe Kojaks in 26x1.35) have meant that I'm not much slower despite the wind - it'll be good times once it subsides and I can see how much of a difference they really make.

In other news, I've got the new chain ring, sprocket, tyres, mudguards and rack for my Pompetamine, so I'll soon be able to transform it into a touring bike. I've gone for a 44t chain ring and a 22t sprocket, taking the gearing down to sane levels. The tyres are Schwalbe Marathon Supremes, hopefully they'll stand up to the reputation. Expect before and after pictures on Saturday

 

[apeZ]

It sounds as though you have your heart set on the LHT, maybe you should look into it if it's not too much over your budget. I bought my Pompetamine over a proper touring bike because it's what I really wanted, and I look forward to riding it because of that. When I ride my other bikes, I find myself thinking "I wish I were on my Pompetamine". That's not to say you shouldn't look at the other options (the Kona Sutra does indeed get good reviews, after all), as there's a quite a lot out there.

I know, but I've been quite swayed by the Sutra now. I might pop into my LBS and see if they would be willing to price match (LHT online is £900ish, LBS want £1k for it) given that I'd be paying for extra stuff too. I can see what you mean though, but I've looked at the Kona Sutra quite in-depth, minus riding it - I've emailed a shop in London to see if they would let me test ride one - so I don't feel too guilty for not getting a LHT.

On the topic of London - do you live there? Do you know of any dedicated touring bike shops or big bike shops that would have quite a lot of bikes on display? I know Evans have a store up there. Just wondered if you had any insight!

I'm hoping that it didn't come across as too strong an endorsement; I've never ridden one, after all, I've just seen it get lots of mentions on various cycling forums. I decided against getting a full touring bike when I realised that I will only ever tour on normal roads. As a result, I'm in the process of converting my Pompetamine into a sort of Audax/fast touring bike. I've not actually been touring yet, so I am not a good source of information on the subject unfortunately. I'm hoping to get out for some weekend tours in April or May, depending on the temperatures.

No prob. I'd probably be looking at converting an old bike, if I had a decent one to work with. Dedicated tourer seems to be the way to go for me, but I'm curious to see how you get on as well.

The reason I initially avoided the Galaxy is that they seemed a bit too common and not that unique. I know that's not a good reason to rule them out though - LHT is incredibly popular in the States. I also didn't think that their components scaled with the price that well, but there are some places like Spa Cycles who seem to take a few hundred £ off the retail price - making them viable.

I think the main problem with picking out a bike is that there is always better and a lot of cyclists 'swear' by certain bikes and write incredibly favourable reviews to try and tempt me to extend my budget a bit more. I never really experience that when buying PC components, if I give a price, I'll get my moneys worth and maybe a recommendation to spend a little extra for a big performance boost. Also, computer component recommendations seem to be more clear cut than when it comes to cycling - there is so much personal preference to bike components rather than an agreed standard.

e.g. buy this £800 PC and it will do this, this and this. buy this £1200 PC and it will do this, this, this and this. Whereas, with bikes it seems more like:

buy any bike £800-1200 and you'll have people discussing the merits and downfalls of individual components, sometimes quite aggressively!

Hope that makes sense

 

[Jonny69]

Oh god, I just accidentally won some really retro looking rims on eBay. Now I'm going to have to build another bike...

 

[collisster]

I'm going to buy the specialized allez I think, the only thing letting it down I feel is the groupset although it isn't that bad...
When it packs in or I get sick of it what is the best way to upgrade? can you do it bit by bit? ie some new shifters (9speed ones) and then a cassette? will 9 speed shifters shift an 8 speed derailleur?

 

[Jonny ///M]

I'm going to buy the specialized allez I think, the only thing letting it down I feel is the groupset although it isn't that bad...
When it packs in or I get sick of it what is the best way to upgrade? can you do it bit by bit? ie some new shifters (9speed ones) and then a cassette? will 9 speed shifters shift an 8 speed derailleur?

Which allez are you looking at? Newer sora is onto 9 speed now so you can mix and match easily enough with Tiagra.

As long as you match the shifters,cassette and chain you can run 8/9/10speed on the same hub and I wouldn't see a problem with the mechs(or I haven't with bikes I've worked with).

Rather than upgrading at a later date why not up the budget and go for something with 105 on it? The new 5700 105 is really nice! Most are ~£1k but can be had for £850 for something like a Felt Z85 and the cannondale Caad 8 105.

 

[SDK^]

Jonny - The Sora (9 speed) and Tiagra (10 speed) will not appear until 2012 bikes are launched.

 

[Jonny ///M]

Jonny - The Sora (9 speed) and Tiagra (10 speed) will not appear until 2012 bikes are launched.

Tiagra 10 speed is 2012 but sora and tiagra are both 9 speed right now last time I checked. I'd be a bit worried If I've put 9 speed chains on 8 speed cassettes.

http://cycle.shimano-eu.com/publish...ora/product.-code-ST-3400.-type-.st_road.html

 

[Russinating]

Friend came off his bike yesterday - hit a pedestrian full-pelt at 30mph after he literally just stepped out in front of him without looking. Fat lip, bruised nose and swollen elbow so not too bad fortunately, but still ridiculous. Pedestrians are always worse than cars!

 

[SDK^]

Tiagra 10 speed is 2012 but sora and tiagra are both 9 speed right now last time I checked. I'd be a bit worried If I've put 9 speed chains on 8 speed cassettes.

http://cycle.shimano-eu.com/publish...ora/product.-code-ST-3400.-type-.st_road.html

Good spot - I was thinking of 2300

 

[collisster]

Which allez are you looking at? Newer sora is onto 9 speed now so you can mix and match easily enough with Tiagra.

As long as you match the shifters,cassette and chain you can run 8/9/10speed on the same hub and I wouldn't see a problem with the mechs(or I haven't with bikes I've worked with).

Rather than upgrading at a later date why not up the budget and go for something with 105 on it? The new 5700 105 is really nice! Most are ~£1k but can be had for £850 for something like a Felt Z85 and the cannondale Caad 8 105.

bottom of the range one, but I might be able to get cycle to work. whats the usual discount?

 

[Jonny ///M]

bottom of the range one, but I might be able to get cycle to work. whats the usual discount?

I know we do 15% off the felt and the cannondale at £1000 so you get them for £850. For cycle scheme the voucher of £1000 only counts as £900 as cyclescheme take 10% so could do 5% off RRP on a £1000 bike so you get a voucher for £950 and the shop gets paid £855.

On cyclescheme any police I've dealt with have saved around 41% when buying a bike through it. They recently changed the final market value part so you should be paying 18% for <£500 and 25% >£500 but cyclescheme can take ownership of it for a 3/5% deposit and after 3 years(I think) you just keep it as it's worth **** all.

 

[Saundie]

I know, but I've been quite swayed by the Sutra now. I might pop into my LBS and see if they would be willing to price match (LHT online is £900ish, LBS want £1k for it) given that I'd be paying for extra stuff too. I can see what you mean though, but I've looked at the Kona Sutra quite in-depth, minus riding it - I've emailed a shop in London to see if they would let me test ride one - so I don't feel too guilty for not getting a LHT.

It's probably a good thing that you've been able to see past your LHT craving, if only because it opens you to other options.

On the topic of London - do you live there? Do you know of any dedicated touring bike shops or big bike shops that would have quite a lot of bikes on display?

There's an Evans in Croydon (South London, where I live), they have quite a big range of bikes, but not a lot of tourers from what I saw. The audax and touring orientated Roberts Cycles have their show room in Croydon. I have not actually been brave enough to go in there yet, as I fear I may walk out significantly poorer. It may be worth a look if you're keen on spending over £1k... which it sounds like you're not. The same goes for GB Cycles, also in Croydon, though pretty much exclusively for road/racing bikes.

The reason I initially avoided the Galaxy is that they seemed a bit too common and not that unique.

I feel the same way, however it seems we'd be in the minority as most people will stick to the big, well known brands, such as Trek/Specialized etc. My taste in bikes is very strange, which means I tend to gravitate away from mainstream brands anyway. A lot of people feel the same way about cars, and would much rather drive about in an old MG or Triumph than a modern BMW or Merc, after all.

I think the main problem with picking out a bike is that there is always better and a lot of cyclists 'swear' by certain bikes and write incredibly favourable reviews to try and tempt me to extend my budget a bit more.

From what I can tell by reading various cycling forums, there is a lot of this "right" way of doing things. It seems a lot like the old computing adage that "nobody ever got fired for buying IBM" to me. You get fanboys in pretty much every field, after all, people who will only buy nVidia graphics cards, or BMWs, or Cannondale. I can understand why people do it, even if I don't feel it myself. I think the most important thing is to just try the bike and make sure it suits you before you commit to it; something that I haven't done with any of my bikes and somewhat regret not doing.

I spent most of the morning working on the Pompetamine. It took me less than fifteen minutes to get the back wheel off, remove the tyre and undo the casing around the sprocket and change the sprocket. It then took me two hours to reattach the split ring that holds the sprocket on. In the end I gave up and got somebody else to do it for me. I've resolved never to take that split ring off ever again. It took another half an hour or so to change the chain ring, and about the same again to get the back tyre and wheel on properly. I wasted a bit of time trying to get the Schwalbe Marathon Supremes on before it dawned on me that they'd never fit the rims. I'd ordered them in 700x32c; too big for the rims, which will accommodate a maximum of 28mm. I'm going to have to send back the Supremes and find an alternative. At the moment I'm swaying towards Gatorskins in 700x28c, though I'll have to continue my research.

On the plus side, I didn't have to mess around the chain length after changing the sprocket & chain ring. The result is 25% lower gearing, with a range of 28.2 to 86.4 gear inches with 700x28c tyres, which seems about right. I may take it out for a ride tomorrow morning to see how much of a difference it makes. Once I get the new tyres I'll just need to swap the road racers for the raceblades and attach the rack, and then it'll be good for touring

 

[TreeTops]

I own both a Trek and a Cannondale though not exactly because they are fashionable. The Trek was bought because it was the only bike I could get at the time with a 25" frame and the Cannondale because I didn't fancy a carbon fibre bike, had been consistently rated as a classic aluminium framed road bike can came in a 63cm frame size. When your at the big and tall end of the spectrum then you don't really get much of a choice on make and model of bike

On the whole touring thing I really wouldn't get too hung up over the bike. On our first tour one of the chaps joined us on his Specialized Allez and a rucksack. Admittedly he is as fit as a fiddle but only really struggled when cycling through Strines just outside of Sheffield.

If you have a bike then it shouldn't take much to stick a rack and panniers on. Alternatively stick a large underseat (such as a carradice) pack on it. At least you can give touring a go and if you should find it not to your taste, you haven't blown lots of cash on another bike. If you do like it then speak to your LBS or someone like Spa Cycles - they'll happily customise a bike for you.

 

[TreeTops]

And if your interested in what a tour can be like, I've published the first 5 days of our last 8 day tour around central and eastern Scotland. If I get a chance over the coming week, I'll finish the final 3 posts off to round off the tour.

http://www.malia.info

 

[collisster]

I think I'm going to extend my budget and get the specialized allez comp instead. got 9 speed gears instead of 8 and some nicer components. a bit lighter too.

When I get some more money where is the best places to start saving weight?

cheers
Martin?

 

[apeZ]

It's probably a good thing that you've been able to see past your LHT craving, if only because it opens you to other options.

Indeed! To be honest, pretty much every half-decent touring bike I've looked at has had someone take it across the globe so I'm slowly escaping the mindset that it's about the bike - it isn't - it's about the tour

There's an Evans in Croydon (South London, where I live), they have quite a big range of bikes, but not a lot of tourers from what I saw. The audax and touring orientated Roberts Cycles have their show room in Croydon. I have not actually been brave enough to go in there yet, as I fear I may walk out significantly poorer. It may be worth a look if you're keen on spending over £1k... which it sounds like you're not. The same goes for GB Cycles, also in Croydon, though pretty much exclusively for road/racing bikes.

I did a bit of googling and looked for dealers of Kona bikes in London and I've sent out a few emails. I might end up going into an Evans store at some point though, if only to look at accessories and the like, so thanks!

I feel the same way, however it seems we'd be in the minority as most people will stick to the big, well known brands, such as Trek/Specialized etc. My taste in bikes is very strange, which means I tend to gravitate away from mainstream brands anyway. A lot of people feel the same way about cars, and would much rather drive about in an old MG or Triumph than a modern BMW or Merc, after all.

I agree here as well...the Sutra has a particular charm about it. I'm not convinced by the colour scheme but that goes for a lot of tourers. I saw one of the Dawes bikes at Spa which looked very nice... here: http://www.spacycles.co.uk/products.php?plid=m1b0s21p2419

Only problem is Spa is so far away... maybe I can find some Dawes bikes in a LBS and give them a try. They are nice, and have a good reputation. I still think that I'll be happy with most of the ones I've looked at so far - they wouldn't be called touring bikes if you couldn't tour on them!

From what I can tell by reading various cycling forums, there is a lot of this "right" way of doing things. It seems a lot like the old computing adage that "nobody ever got fired for buying IBM" to me. You get fanboys in pretty much every field, after all, people who will only buy nVidia graphics cards, or BMWs, or Cannondale. I can understand why people do it, even if I don't feel it myself. I think the most important thing is to just try the bike and make sure it suits you before you commit to it; something that I haven't done with any of my bikes and somewhat regret not doing.

I know what you mean. And definitely +1 to trying before buying, I don't want the hassle of having to send it back if it isn't the right size, doesn't suit me, etc. I'm sometimes a bit of an impulse buyer, so I'm trying to be a bit more careful here and make sure I spend my money wisely.

On the whole touring thing I really wouldn't get too hung up over the bike. On our first tour one of the chaps joined us on his Specialized Allez and a rucksack. Admittedly he is as fit as a fiddle but only really struggled when cycling through Strines just outside of Sheffield.

Mm, like I touched on in the first reply above - determination and a will to tour seems to be all it takes to get started.

If you have a bike then it shouldn't take much to stick a rack and panniers on. Alternatively stick a large underseat (such as a carradice) pack on it. At least you can give touring a go and if you should find it not to your taste, you haven't blown lots of cash on another bike. If you do like it then speak to your LBS or someone like Spa Cycles - they'll happily customise a bike for you.

Alas, I don't have a bike at the moment. I use my parents for commuting sometimes and although they are bog-standard Raleigh's, they are fine. I wouldn't want to ride distances on them though, I've crashed a few times pushing them to the limit... broken pedals, chain coming off, blah blah. When one of the pedals came off in pieces, I stacked it literally OUTSIDE a bike shop. Embarrassing, but convenient

And if your interested in what a tour can be like, I've published the first 5 days of our last 8 day tour around central and eastern Scotland. If I get a chance over the coming week, I'll finish the final 3 posts off to round off the tour.

http://www.malia.info

I saw you post this link before and I had a read up of it - the Edinburgh loop or something. It was interesting, and I'll check it again when I have time

--

Also, I discovered this guy today, Roei Sadan. He's an Israeli who has just completed a world tour.

If you check out his site at http://www.dreamwithopeneyes.com/ , his philosophy towards touring is remarkable. He has some great videos too, they put a smile on my face

 

[TreeTops]

Alas, I don't have a bike at the moment.

Ah sorry - my misunderstanding. I thought that you already had a capable bike!.

I saw you post this link before and I had a read up of it - the Edinburgh loop or something. It was interesting, and I'll check it again when I have time

I've updated the blog entries from the tour itself rather than just the planned route. I'll get the site updated with the final 3 days logs and an aftermath post that covers what went well, what went wrong what items were packed in the panners etc.

Not sure if you have read through the CTC forums. There is usually plenty of information buried in there - certainly more than you'd find on BikeRadar or similar sites.

http://forum.ctc.org.uk/

It's worthwhile thinking about joining the CTC. Membership gives you a degree of insurance for when your riding. I cannot remember the complete details but I'm sure it'll be on the main site.

 

[apeZ]

Not sure if you have read through the CTC forums. There is usually plenty of information buried in there - certainly more than you'd find on BikeRadar or similar sites.

http://forum.ctc.org.uk/

It's worthwhile thinking about joining the CTC. Membership gives you a degree of insurance for when your riding. I cannot remember the complete details but I'm sure it'll be on the main site.

Cheers for that. I have had a look through the forums before, but I just noticed the For Sale bit, some pretty good deals on used bikes imo. There's a Koga Miyata World Traveller for around £1150! I fired off an email, can't resist an offer like that... edit: but it's gone

I got an email back from the guy up in London, and he has the Sutra in stock. Might pop up for a viewing and test ride in the next few weeks. I'm going to keep an eye on the CTC sales forum as well, are there any other places I can check for bikes? Adtrader and the like?

I'll definitely consider membership once I get up and running, could be quite useful.