Please link us the relevant section of the RTA.
road rule changes 2022
- Thread starter DanF
- Start date
Really selling the quality of your training by posting flawed statements on a forum eh.
There is absolutely nowhere along the roads I most regularly travel, where horses are most likely to be present, where going past them at 10MPH or less would be in any way safe for anyone in that equation... and it is very rare any horse rider I've encountered around here will pull to the side to left traffic past though it happens from time to time. I always give them a wide berth and give some tolerance against them possibly spooking.
This was one captured by a colleague a few years ago on his way home from work. Apparently the group of leisure cyclists passed about 3 or 4 suitable places on the left where they could have easily pulled over for 15 seconds to let the queue of vehicles behind them overtake. The road is quite twisty and there are enough oncoming cars to restrict the number of safe opportunities to pass the group.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nc-BDlz1Fts
His viewpoint was that they had delayed 30+ cars by about 2 minutes each in the space of a mile, so collectively they caused an hour's worth of delay and frustration. 7 cyclists delayed for about 15 seconds would collectively have been about 2 minutes
At least they were mostly making progress - the ones I run into are often doing half that speed...
Last edited:
His viewpoint was that they had delayed 30+ cars by about 2 minutes each in the space of a mile, so collectively they caused an hour's worth of delay and frustration. 7 cyclists delayed for about 15 seconds would collectively have been about 2 minutes
That viewpoint is overloaded with hypocrisy, tell him for me
Arguing collective efficiency while alone in a large vehicle that requires a full lane width to progress. The selfish road inefficiency of personal motor cars/vans cannot be rivalled.
This was one captured by a colleague a few years ago on his way home from work. Apparently the group of leisure cyclists passed about 3 or 4 suitable places on the left where they could have easily pulled over for 15 seconds to let the queue of vehicles behind them overtake. The road is quite twisty and there are enough oncoming cars to restrict the number of safe opportunities to pass the group.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nc-BDlz1Fts
His viewpoint was that they had delayed 30+ cars by about 2 minutes each in the space of a mile, so collectively they caused an hour's worth of delay and frustration. 7 cyclists delayed for about 15 seconds would collectively have been about 2 minutes
I couldn't entirely tell if they were side by side or single file? Tbh, on a road like that (traffic both ways) I doubt I would pull in. Plenty of opportunity for cars to pass before long, as long as we are all single file. Does make me itch a little when I'm in a group and a car is stuck behind two guys riding side by side, especially when we've shouted 'car' so they know it's there...
I think a lot of people are seeing this as the once instance on it's own though, not thinking about how often this could/would happen. You could cycle 3 miles and have to pull over six or seven times... I myself, don't think that's reasonable.
Ooof! Good comeback
As I mentioned, I happily pull over for lorries and busses as I know how much of a hassle it is getting up to speed and am regularly thanked for it by them with a wave. I purposely cycle at sunrise as the roads are quieter so is a lot safer but even then you get drivers that drive dangerously even when there is no need as the roads are quiet so there’s lots of opportunity to pass safely.
Those cyclists that don’t let people pass are probably the same type of cyclists that don’t stop at red lights etc because they just don’t care and probably drive Audis when not on their bicycles. Saying that, as above, many roads have a constant stream of cars, so if a cyclist was to pull over when there are cars behind them, they would be forever pulling over and not getting anywhere.
I did note you didn’t understand why cyclists moan about drivers being inconsiderate is not equivalent to drivers moaning about being held up though despite your boast about IAM certification
Last edited:
Soldato
- Joined
- 19 Oct 2002
- Posts
- 18,057
- Location
- Shakespeare’s County
Contravened this today, pulling into a t junction and didn’t stop for the pedestrians waiting on the kerb.
Realised after but body language and it being dark with headlights on I’m not sure how long the Mexican stand off would have lasted before they would have stepped off the kerb with a growing queue behind me… interesting test.
Realised after but body language and it being dark with headlights on I’m not sure how long the Mexican stand off would have lasted before they would have stepped off the kerb with a growing queue behind me… interesting test.
the junction/pedestrian rule...
is it not the case that you should be looking out for pedestrians who've already started crossing and be prepared to stop if they've already stepped out on to the road...the same as it's always been
not that you're expected to stop dead if you see anyone waiting to cross the road when approaching, that's not to say you can't do that although it makes much more sense to stop and wave them on if you're approaching a T junction/crossroad etc straight on rather than when turning in to the junction
it's basically to reinforce the idea that hammering it in to/up to a junction thinking you have 100% right of way over pedestrians isn't what you should be doing
is it not the case that you should be looking out for pedestrians who've already started crossing and be prepared to stop if they've already stepped out on to the road...the same as it's always been
not that you're expected to stop dead if you see anyone waiting to cross the road when approaching, that's not to say you can't do that although it makes much more sense to stop and wave them on if you're approaching a T junction/crossroad etc straight on rather than when turning in to the junction
it's basically to reinforce the idea that hammering it in to/up to a junction thinking you have 100% right of way over pedestrians isn't what you should be doing
- Joined
- 10 Mar 2009
- Posts
- 475
No, it's a give way. You literally have to stop and allow pedestrians to cross.
At light controlled crossings the lights take priority, I'd have thought that would be fairly clear.
it's still a 2 way thing though when 'should give way' is mentioned - ie both pedestrian and driver assesing the situation and not assuming you can just step out on to the road as a pedestrian or turn in to/approach a junction as a driver without fear of someone thinking it's safe to cross
'priority' and 'MUST give way' is more definite and is when you need to stop but it doesn't cancel out the 'Look out for traffic turning into the road, especially from behind you, and cross at a place where drivers can see you.' part for pedestrians and should make drivers be aware (as it already is) that pedestrians could misjudge the speed of vehicles approaching...again the point is to slow drivers down at junctions
the suggestion of rear end shunts is ridiculous
for pedestrians
Rule 8
At a junction. When you are crossing or waiting to cross the road, other traffic should give way. Look out for traffic turning into the road, especially from behind you, and cross at a place where drivers can see you. If you have started crossing and traffic wants to turn into the road, you have priority and they should give way (see Rules H2 and 170).
for drivers
Rule 170
Take extra care at junctions. You should
give way to pedestrians crossing or waiting to cross a road into which or from which you are turning. If they have started to cross they have priority, so give way (see Rule H2)
Rule H2 - Rule for drivers, motorcyclists, horse drawn vehicles, horse riders and cyclists
At a junction you should give way to pedestrians crossing or waiting to cross a road into which or from which you are turning.
You MUST give way to pedestrians on a zebra crossing, and to pedestrians and cyclists on a parallel crossing (see Rule 195).
Rule 195
Zebra and parallel crossings. As you approach a zebra crossing
- look out for pedestrians waiting to cross and be ready to slow down or stop to let them cross
- you should give way to pedestrians waiting to cross
- you MUST give way when a pedestrian has moved onto a crossing
Last edited:
Not necessarily, and I'd certainly say there is an increased risk of this especially when making a left turn, and not at the fault of the driver who is obeying the new rules who may or may not have enough room to clear the junction before giving way to a pedestrian, whilst matey boy behind who has just put his foot down after seeing an indication that the car ahead is turning left, only to find it comes to a stop in their line of straight ahead travel.
Granted that this will totally be the fault of the driver not leaving enough space to the car in front and not anticipating the stop, but we all know it's gonna happen.
Anyone thinking they are going to shunt someone due to this needs to hand in their licence.
Typical behaviour for a car turning off is to indicate and slow maybe even stop if the turn isn't perfectly clear, maybe the binmen are at work or something.
Definitely ridiculous to suggest a driver can't handle a car in front indicating, slowing and stopping.
yupp, with a T junction/crossroads you should be aware of anything that might make you need to slow down or stop, any slip road style 'junction' where pedestrians would possibly be crossing to the other side/island would be controlled by lights, there may be exceptions?
hashtag staycalm and don't drive like a fanny
hashtag staycalm and don't drive like a fanny
I think in your case it wasn’t this issue as to why they wanted you to drive past….
Probably just someone being polite rather than related to these changes but I saw someone stop on a corner yesterday to let someone cross which was not an advisable place to stop at all (obviously sometimes a vehicle might be stopped there if it broke down, etc.) - it is definitely something people are going to need to utilise with discretion but there are far too many possibilities for situations these changes haven't been made with in mind and the sad reality is there are too many drivers who through not paying enough attention, etc. is likely going to result in an increase in incidents or close calls.
Soldato
- Joined
- 27 Mar 2013
- Posts
- 9,439
To me the difficult bit is where do you draw the line (this explanation might be tricky due to text form). I get you have to give way if you've turned into a junction, but if the pedestrian is say 1 metre away do you still stop, what about 2 or 3? To me common sense would be when you've finished you're turn you no longer have to give way I.e. wheels all straight, but still seems a bit ambiguous.