Ryanair buys 75 737 Max

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Yeap, there's two Angle Of Attack (AOA or ADD) probes on the outside which measure the angle the aircraft is flying relative to the airflow. In the original setup only one of these was used by the MCAS system during flight and which one was picked for use was automatically changed every flight so, even with two sensors, it was specifically designed to include a single point of failure which, in a safety critical aviation design, should be considered criminal negligence and I'm amazed no-one has been sued at the very least and criminally investigated at worst.
IIRC it also meant that if the pilots were not aware of it (IIRC the total recommended training on it was something like a single slide in some cases), that if you had a problem noted one flight it would clear up for the next.

It was a design that from what I understand should never have been approved as it went against decades of lessons from incidents with other instruments that only had one or two inputs and no easily comparable redundancy.


I believe that one of the USPs of the 737 Max was that conversion training was less extensive than it would be on a "New" aircraft. I seem to recall reading that training on the MCAS was considered to be unimportant because MCAS couldn't go wrong.

I also believe that the 737 Max ad behaved erratically a couple of times in the US but that the pilots involved had used their experience and initiative to avoid plummeting into the ground rather than relying on the avionics to sort out the problem - as their training probably told them they should have done - with fatal consequences.

From memory the US pilots who had the issue may have had the "dispute" display active (their airlines were not as price sensitive and paid for it rather than taking what the manufacturer classed an "optional" feature as being required for fundamental safety) and additional training on what that dispute display meant.

A large part of the problem was that Boeing played down and basically hid from the pilots what MCAS was and how it worked - it wasn't that pilots from other countries were under qualified but that their training may have been the
level that Boeing said was needed and their employers assumed would be what was needed having trusted the manufacturer of their new aircraft that was meant to fly just like the old one.
Effectively Boeing lied about how much training was required to know how the aircraft differed and what the new systems were.
 
Never had a problem with Ryanair used them loads its basic and does the job plus the ladies are far better then Easyjet :cool:

As for these new planes it kind of puts a thought in back of your mind hope they are safe!
you go on a plane to watch the women walking up and down the aisle ?
in my experience easy jet cabin crew are either gay, chubby, or old though :D


but they always seem nice enough apart from the "noob" ones who won't let you put a full backpack under the seat even though it's wedged in...

Easyjet let me out at the wrong airport one time as well which was nice, diverted due to weather, asked If I could leave the plane here cos it's closer to my destination and saves me over 1hour on the train.

after loads of morons were complaining saying I would hold the flight up (the one waiting to refuel anyway but people too dumb)

they soon shut up when the captain came to my seat, asked me a few simple questions then said sure it's no problem lul...

I was on the train before that plane even saw the fuel tanker 100%
 
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Used to nip over to Portugal some long weekends for a tenner. Can't say a 2h flight was ever that unbearable. My lunch cost more than the flight.
 
I’ll happily fly on a 737 max if it was Jet 2 Tui, BA etc. But I’d never fly on that horrible airline. Don’t care if they are £300 cheaper just don’t and won’t fly with them.
Jet 2 and EasyJet never had a problem ever. Prefer EasyJet’s Airbus fleet and prefer Jet 2 service. 10 holidays with Jet 2 to Rhodes and always perfect.

I’m with you there, but there’s always someone who’ll say that Ryanair is the greatest thing since sliced bread.
I used to subscribe to a very small local forum, probably no more than 100-150 posters, and someone mentioned Ryanair favourably once, so I replied that if I was going to Faro, I’d rather pay £150 plus more and go with TAP or BA than that outfit.
I was buried in venom for my impetuosity, most saying that I was a snob with more money than sense.
The post that stuck out for me said, “You sound like one of those class traitors, who only eat in restaurants that have white tablecloths, and then show off by tipping the waiter!”
 
Seeing as they went super cheap in deigning the bloody thing in the first place, maybe they are just cheap planes.
Wouldn't go near them some real horror stories about how Boeing cheaped on this from the basic engineering all the way up.
 
I seem to remember one problem being a reduced number of sensors by design and software making an approximation or best guess which was the issue. I don't think they actually increased the number of sensors, just fiddled with software?

In any critical system, you ideally want 3 sources of data to come to a conclusion and I thought that wasn't the case here.
One sensor, for a completely new system all because Boeing went cheap, on a plane which basically doesn't work right so the need to counter its bad dynamics.
 
I don't hate Ryanair. Scum sure but they made flying affordable for the masses.

Usually use Swiss Air myself can't beat the complementary chocolate and wine. Business class is great for the meals etc. Usually don't bother as only few hours on plan, but nice occasionally.
 
what was surprising was none of the US Carriers wanted to go into a Live TV broadcast and commit to buying the 737 Max, You would think that they would be first to jump onboard.
 
what was surprising was none of the US Carriers wanted to go into a Live TV broadcast and commit to buying the 737 Max, You would think that they would be first to jump onboard.
Shome mishtake shurely?
Jump overboard?
Do the door locks not work either on the Boeing 737-Max?
 
I’m with you there, but there’s always someone who’ll say that Ryanair is the greatest thing since sliced bread.
I used to subscribe to a very small local forum, probably no more than 100-150 posters, and someone mentioned Ryanair favourably once, so I replied that if I was going to Faro, I’d rather pay £150 plus more and go with TAP or BA than that outfit.
I was buried in venom for my impetuosity, most saying that I was a snob with more money than sense.
The post that stuck out for me said, “You sound like one of those class traitors, who only eat in restaurants that have white tablecloths, and then show off by tipping the waiter!”
Wasn’t forums4airports by any chance was it?
They get excited when Ryanair announce a new route, personally I think they are a waste of a Air bridged stand at Manchester . Should be dumped on remote stands and leave T3 and the Domestic terminal like it used to be.
 
Seeing as they went super cheap in deigning the bloody thing in the first place, maybe they are just cheap planes.
Wouldn't go near them some real horror stories about how Boeing cheaped on this from the basic engineering all the way up.
Totally agree, the whole 737 series is *****, it might be a great seller but it’s a poor Aircraft to fly on. Uncomfortable landings in them also due to a very low landing gear.
The A320 series is much nicer to fly on, more room in the cabin, doesn’t take three months to get Airborne and a proper landing gear.
Boeing should have revised the 757 instead of making the 737 max.
 
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