Salary not being revealed

[HangTime]

A company I used to work for introduced a 'positive discrimination' [oxymoron alert] policy whereby you were encouraged to hire women, some nonsense about how if you had two equally good candidates you'd hire the female. I was never faced with a situation where I had to choose between two equally good candidates of different genders, I just hired the one I thought was best (some women and some men). I did however tend to ensure that I interviewed women so if HR got funny about me hiring a man I could demonstrate that I was giving women opportunities.

They then had a phase where they were offering women large payrises to try and address the gender pay gap. I don't have an issue with the concept but it seemed to be too primitive and only consider job title not level of experience / expertise. Like if you promoted someone from a junior to standard role, if they were a woman they'd get the same as someone already operating to a good standard at that level with years of experience, if they were a man then they'd get a raise to the low end of the spectrum.

I do feel like once I hit 50 it will be harder to move jobs in IT. There is a certain amount of passive ageism after 50 where people expect only managers in that age range. For technical guys like me - I don't like managing - it is a concern once I get there.

I think even within management there's an expectation in some parts that you'll have started to plateau by 50, i.e. if you've never had a position at a certain level before, and apply for it aged over 50, eyebrows will be raised i.e. they make the assumption that you can't be that good or you'd have got to that level by now already.

Sometimes I hate working in IT/tech companies in terms of the lack of (hot) women. The occasional gem pops up

I think it depends on the org, consultancies tend to have a decent number of at least moderately attractive women (to be honest, it wouldn't surprise me if subconsciously or otherwise some are more likely to get hired to give the clients something to look at). Newer companies especially may have a culture around diversity and general youthfulness, I used to work for a niche consultancy that was formed less than 5 years prior, most of the workforce was mid-20s to early 30s and a fair chunk of those were women.

 

[willhub]

I was looking for this thread today, it's frustrating to not see salaries listed, at the end of the day, money is money, it pays our bills, it gets us food and it helps our quality of life, I'm not going to apply for a job without the salary listed, it's almost a gamble if I'm looking for a new role but I need equal or higher pay, of course I'd wish for a higher salary.

The process of going through an interview to have a salary revealed would be a huge waste of time if it isn't adequate, imagine taking time out of your day, arranging child care, arranging time of work possibly, it's just no good.

It's even more essential to know a salary with cost of living, from those jobs that actually display the salary, I feel what you're paid for the role is not proportionate, some jobs descriptions make out the role is incredibly complex or important yet you're paid 20k a year and that's peanuts now, just slightly above minimum wage I believe.

 

[malachi]

I was looking for this thread today, it's frustrating to not see salaries listed, at the end of the day, money is money, it pays our bills, it gets us food and it helps our quality of life, I'm not going to apply for a job without the salary listed, it's almost a gamble if I'm looking for a new role but I need equal or higher pay, of course I'd wish for a higher salary.

The process of going through an interview to have a salary revealed would be a huge waste of time if it isn't adequate, imagine taking time out of your day, arranging child care, arranging time of work possibly, it's just no good.

It's even more essential to know a salary with cost of living, from those jobs that actually display the salary, I feel what you're paid for the role is not proportionate, some jobs descriptions make out the role is incredibly complex or important yet you're paid 20k a year and that's peanuts now, just slightly above minimum wage I believe.

What I do now is put my salary expectations on my CV. If I don't see a place on the application.

I also believe a company will pay you as little as they can get away with.

 

[willhub]

What I do now is put my salary expectations on my CV. If I don't see a place on the application.

I also believe a company will pay you as little as they can get away with.

Do you think putting salary expectations on the CV will detract from the employers point of view?

 

[malachi]

Do you think putting salary expectations on the CV will detract from the employers point of view?

Nope, stops them wasting your time.

 

[Funky-Melon]

What I do now is put my salary expectations on my CV. If I don't see a place on the application.

I also believe a company will pay you as little as they can get away with.

Not a bad idea, would stop me having my time wasted again (see a few pages back).

I'm not sure if in my case the recruiter was stringing me along hoping I'd take a lower salary as well, on the off chance I'd accept and he'd get his commission.

 

[malachi]

Not a bad idea, would stop me having my time wasted again (see a few pages back).

Also happened to so many times. After wasting 30mins of time during my break asked about salary at the end. To be told "oh, that's abit high" I had to hold my tongue

 

[~Divine~Wind~]

There was recently some new roles advertised at a place I know, whilst the pay was mentioned the terms weren't.
Comes to shortly before the interviews and they released the terms... I think was about 30% dropped out of the applications straight away

 

[malachi]

There was recently some new roles advertised at a place I know, whilst the pay was mentioned the terms weren't.
Comes to shortly before the interviews and they released the terms... I think was about 30% dropped out of the applications straight away

They must have known something would turn people off if they didn't state the terms from the start.

 

[moogle]

Do you think putting salary expectations on the CV will detract from the employers point of view?

Potentially, but helps you avoid timewasting companies. All depends on your skill/experience and how difficult it is to get candidates for the role.

If more job hunters ignored the posts without salaries then they'd start providing it. I wouldn't waste my time applying to a role without it, and the usual reason they don't provide it is because they'd get little to no applicants by doing so having the effect commented in the post above.

 

[willhub]

Potentially, but helps you avoid timewasting companies. All depends on your skill/experience and how difficult it is to get candidates for the role.

If more job hunters ignored the posts without salaries then they'd start providing it. I wouldn't waste my time applying to a role without it, and the usual reason they don't provide it is because they'd get little to no applicants by doing so having the effect commented in the post above.

I work in a call center on between 30-40k, which is pretty high salary for a call center considering I'm not management, so I find it very hard to find jobs on a similar level without much lower wage and those that I see don't advertise and those that do might aswell advertise as a rocket scientist.

 

[D.P.]

.

I also believe a company will pay you as little as they can get away with.

And the employees want to get the maximum they can get away with. In reality, for most jobs supply and demand dictate a reasonable balance and there are many reasons why employers will want to pay market rated or even above. Loosing talented workers that are experienced in the company is a big problem so employee retention tends to be highly valued.

The few times an employer will intentionally low-ball an employee will be if they are simply not good at the job and so this can act as a gentle nudge to quit before being laid off. Of course, rubbish employees tend to struggle to get new jobs and are too scared to proactively search

 

[HangTime]

If more job hunters ignored the posts without salaries then they'd start providing it

People aren't going to do that en masse though because they don't want to limit their options, you'll always have some people who are desperate for work and will apply for anything within reason.

As for stating salary expectations on CV my main worry would be when you have various versions of your CV floating around with agencies etc that it potentially undermines your negotiating power in terms of tailoring salary expectation to role. e.g. you apply for job 1 asking for £x an then a few months later you apply for job 2 and ask they update their CV on file with your new one asking £25k more or whatever (because it's a more senior role / further away / less appealing etc). Probably doesn't get picked up on often but I guess I'd just be wary of having a number published in writing that then becomes a sort of benchmark in cases where I wouldn't want it to be and you get into a debate about why you believe you deserve £25k more than you stated earlier in the year.
Also for me the amount of money I want to do a job will depend on information I don't know up front, obviously I'll have a floor in mind that I won't go below, but what I found out at interview etc will ultimately dictate the amount I need. For example loads of jobs don't state the working hours on the advert, a 40hr/week role is going to need to pay more than 35hr/week.
That said, I'm not completely against the idea as it probably eliminates some time-wasting.

 

[~Divine~Wind~]

They must have known something would turn people off if they didn't state the terms from the start.

Oh it 100% was this haha, think it was effectively doing the same job as people on almost 40%+ more, with less benefits
This or the fact that there was no sick pay for the first 2 years! Are we the USA now?