Save the NHS!

SexyGreyFox said:
Working in this side of the NHS it doesn't happen and you have to be repeatedly crap to get that far.
A common phone call is like one I had today from a Clinician saying he has got an appraisal and needs to know how many claims he's had against him over the last year.
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You work for mdu/mps/gmc?
Interesting.
 
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holymonk said:
What about nurses. Fact is career progression of a doctor is good.
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True however as the fates would have it I am actually applying to university to be a nurse and am hopeful of an interview. Nursing hours are long, they are unsociable, they do assert a pressure on daily life. The NHS is being privatised through stealth. Contracts for this and that.

The sad reality I that you cannot trust the Tories or Tory light as it was with the NHS. Streamlining has to be done to reduce overheads and waste. It could be argued the NHS struggles to do this as effectively as the private sector. The issue herein is obvious, but in effect privatising the NHS will erode workers rights, they are already under attack through an ideological plateau that is as far removed as it as possible to be from real life that is real strife.

Talking to a perspicacious individual about this the other day and it of course boils down to that stuff in your wallet and inequality. The wheel of fortune in its inceptive meaning has been beaten by the elite and its Joe bloggs who rides its capricious merry go round
 
SexyGreyFox said:
Working in this side of the NHS it doesn't happen and you have to be repeatedly crap to get that far.
A common phone call is like one I had today from a Clinician saying he has got an appraisal and needs to know how many claims he's had against him over the last year.
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Not true, look at the recent doctor convicted of manslaughter - one bad day and your career is over, and you're potentially doing jail time.
 
holymonk said:
Shame on all the junior doctors putting patients at risk. Absolutely appalling attitude. They earn enough money a drink need to understand that the health service is not a Monday to job. The fact you're more likely to die in hospital at a weekend says it all.
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All junior doctors work 7 days already. No one has a problem with working 7 days. We just don't expect to take a paycut and play make believe that evenings and Saturday count as 9-5 weekday hours.
 
RaohNS said:
Streamlining has to be done to reduce overheads and waste. It could be argued the NHS struggles to do this as effectively as the private sector.
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Profit is a very good motive for the private sector, but there's no reason why public sector organisations can't be well managed - except newspapers complain if staff earn a lot of money for being the ones doing the good management.

There is no point expanding the amount of private involvement in the NHS if every private company just assumes they can walk away and fold the company up if it all goes south, and public money will ensure that patients don't suffer too much. There has to be criminal liability at the director level to keep people on their toes.
 
The site I work at just sums up the attitude of the NHS. All infrastructure of the hospital is treated on a short term gain/long term loss basis. Multiple bodge ups of essential systems just to keep the financial hit for the next guy in line to take charge.
 
Minstadave said:
Not true, look at the recent doctor convicted of manslaughter - one bad day and your career is over, and you're potentially doing jail time.
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Minstadave said:
All junior doctors work 7 days already. No one has a problem with working 7 days. We just don't expect to take a paycut and play make believe that evenings and Saturday count as 9-5 weekday hours.
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Agreed on both points - you can't have ideals without repercussions.

They are cutting the legs off the NHS so they can privatise it.

And the company who wins the tender happens to have someone on the board as a director who is a relative of the PM or similar.... I'm not cynical.

The NHS is so badly mismanaged if it didn't affect so many people it would be laughable!
Ethics is great to have but you have to have financial sense as well.
 
The NHS is so far from what was originally envisaged it's no wonder we can't afford it any more. There are so many treatments we can do now that are very expensive and then prolonging someone's life gets even more expensive if they need more treatment to keep them going. Who wants to make life and death decisions based on cash?

We're victims of our own success technologically and compassionately and I don't see our current politicians having the resolve to bite the bullet. I suspect they'll wait until it fails and then they will have a mandate to fix it probably under the pretext of mismanagement.
 
Minstadave said:
Not true, look at the recent doctor convicted of manslaughter - one bad day and your career is over, and you're potentially doing jail time.
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It is very rare though and the poster who I quoted just said '1 bad judgement' which is definitely not true.
Clinicians make bad decisions all the time which results in PALS, Incidents, Complaints, Inquests and Clinical Negligence but it's very rare you see a Clinician lose their job.
In nearly 6 years I haven't known anybody to lose their job over 1 bad judgement at our Trust.
 
SexyGreyFox said:
It is very rare though and the poster who I quoted just said '1 bad judgement' which is definitely not true.
Clinicians make bad decisions all the time which results in PALS, Incidents, Complaints, Inquests and Clinical Negligence but it's very rare you see a Clinician lose their job.
In nearly 6 years I haven't known anybody to lose their job over 1 bad judgement at our Trust.
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I have ... several times.
 
Caged said:
Profit is a very good motive for the private sector, but there's no reason why public sector organisations can't be well managed - except newspapers complain if staff earn a lot of money for being the ones doing the good management.

There is no point expanding the amount of private involvement in the NHS if every private company just assumes they can walk away and fold the company up if it all goes south, and public money will ensure that patients don't suffer too much. There has to be criminal liability at the director level to keep people on their toes.
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Profit is the only motive for private investment. From all accounts of private involvement funds are disproportionate to the management level and above. The old inequality factor imbalance. As an example, a new recruit at my company starts on £16,400ish rising to £17000 after successful completion. The next tier is a SMT whose earnings dwarf those of the staff and carry additional perks. The prime differential being responsibility. Beyond that directors are all on six figure salaries boosted by a dividend payment of an equal payment of 49% of profit. Staff (the whole of the organisation minus directors and SMT) only qualify for a 15% (divided by 260+ staff) if there is £100,000 made over profit target.

So to clarify and not detract from the thread, privatisation would operate no differently, especially when you have former MPs sitting on boards or given high paying positions in return for influence (KPMG anyone).

Junior doctors should be treated well and paid well and to step it further still so of course should their patients
 
SexyGreyFox said:
It is very rare though and the poster who I quoted just said '1 bad judgement' which is definitely not true.
Clinicians make bad decisions all the time which results in PALS, Incidents, Complaints, Inquests and Clinical Negligence but it's very rare you see a Clinician lose their job.
In nearly 6 years I haven't known anybody to lose their job over 1 bad judgement at our Trust.
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I have a hunch you work at an organisation headed by one with the initials SP acting as CEO?
 
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SexyGreyFox said:
I work in a Legal Department that deals with '1 bad judgements' all day.
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Its a pity that most I not all legal departments do not pursue staff who they can guarantee have done wrong. Its a pity some organisations will also actively cover up malfeasance even if that renders them liable to criminal conspiracy... Even if there is unequivocal proof of this, the organisation can 100% of the time get away with anything and everything.
 
The numbers are small because most of the care is good. The numbers who are investigated by GMC are significantly higher than that. The process of investigation though can be horrendous for the individual even if eventually cleared. A frighteningly high number of doctors commit suicide whilst being investigated. All the doctors on this board are well aware how they would feel if they were investigated by GMC. Although I hate the term vocation,as it generally seems to be used to mean we should all want to work for less than our worth, it is a term that is useful as at indicates how much our job is part of who we are. A number of years ago I received a complaint where a patient wrote direct to the GMC rather than going through proper complaint channels, naming myself and others in my team. It was spurious anyway and I simply made a written statement and it never went further than that, but opening the letter made me physically sick
 
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