Shops not open until 11am on sunday?

DBT85 · 30 Jan 2011 at 12:08

vonhelmet said:
Anyway. It's arguably of benefit to the workers, as it guarantees them at least some time off during the week.

I've never quite understood this. I work a 42 hour week. If I work more I get paid more. If my boss asks me to work an 84 hour week and I agree then its a) my choice and b) overtime.

As long as you can't get sacked for not doing overtime, and as long as you get paid for doing said overtime, why can't the stores decide? If they can't get the staff to work it they'll either not open early or will have to pay more.

In the end it'll probably result in not much changing because to open longer would cost more for a little more income. But shouldn't that be upto the market to decide?

Castiel · 30 Jan 2011 at 12:14

Todge said:
I've never quite understood this. I work a 42 hour week. If I work more I get paid more. If my boss asks me to work an 84 hour week and I agree then its a) my choice and b) overtime.

As long as you can't get sacked for not doing overtime, and as long as you get paid for doing said overtime, why can't the stores decide? If they can't get the staff to work it they'll either not open early or will have to pay more.

In the end it'll probably result in not much changing because to open longer would cost more for a little more income. But shouldn't that be upto the market to decide?

Scotland have a law which means retail workers cannot be forced to work Sundays.

This allows workers to at least spend one day with their family, and due to the predominance of women/housewives in the industry I support it.

It also helps protect smaller stores who are exempt.

Just shop on the other 6 days.

The Halk · 30 Jan 2011 at 12:17

I prefer our law to yours to be honest. Retail is really hard on workers.

As for it being labour MPs who got the concession... I don't really remember it that well, and I wasn't especially interested at the time, as it doesn't affect me. All I recall is the uproar the CoE caused. If perception is truth...

Danny091 · 30 Jan 2011 at 12:21

Your only allowed 6 hours trading so usualy shops will open 11 till 5.

DBT85 · 30 Jan 2011 at 12:27

Castiel said:
Scotland have a law which means retail workers cannot be forced to work Sundays.

This allows workers to at least spend one day with their family, and due to the predominance of women/housewives in the industry I support it.

It also helps protect smaller stores who are exempt.

Just shop on the other 6 days.

I'm not suggesting anyone is forced to work on Sundays, so long as the extra hours are optional overtime and up to the individual why does it matter? Its 2011, more people are working longer hours monday to friday which is meaning the shops are all rammed at the weekend. I'm lucky enough that I can shop midweek so it doesn't often affect me, but on the odd occasion that it does it can take 3 times as long to do anything on a Saturday/Sunday than it does on a weekday because the majority only have the weekend to get anything done.

I'm not suggesting that stores SHOULD open early on Sundays, I doubt there is a market for it.

I get the protection of smaller stores though.

Cosimo · 30 Jan 2011 at 12:54

Energize said:
Just moronic laws as usual hurting the economy.

They don't seem to have harmed the country so far. Go down the high street and it's business as usual apart from the hours.

Skilid · 30 Jan 2011 at 12:55

I work in a large retail store and we are open from 10:30 til 4:30. This is not the case for EVERY shop in the UK. Shops that are under a certain square foot size can be open as long as they like (co-ops for instance), but any shop over that is locked to the maximum 6 hours trading laws.

Redz · 30 Jan 2011 at 12:57

Castiel said:
Nothing to do with Church attendance, everything to do with rest days for retail workers....hence the voluntary aspect and increased pay under legislation.

This only applies to retail and not other industries, if it was specifically to encourage church attendance then it would apply to everyone.

So why is opening on Easter Sunday, a traditional Christian holiday, prohibited?

The Sunday Trading Act 1994 regulates the Sunday opening hours of large shops and prohibits them from opening on Easter Sunday.

http://webarchive.nationalarchives....whatwedo/consumers/fact-sheets/page38554.html

Castiel · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:01

The Halk said:
I prefer our law to yours to be honest. Retail is really hard on workers.

As for it being labour MPs who got the concession... I don't really remember it that well, and I wasn't especially interested at the time, as it doesn't affect me. All I recall is the uproar the CoE caused. If perception is truth...

It's not my Law, I live in England.

The Church wished to protect the Sunday prohibition, the Sunday Trading Laws protect retail workers, not the observance of religion.

Castiel · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:03

Redz said:
So why is opening on Easter Sunday, a traditional Christian holiday, prohibited?

http://webarchive.nationalarchives....whatwedo/consumers/fact-sheets/page38554.html

And before the Sunday Trading Law 1994, they couldn't trade at all.

The laws protect retail workers, not the Church. If religious observance wss the driving factor then there would have been no changes to the previous "no trading at all."

arknor · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:05

Energize said:
Just moronic laws as usual hurting the economy.

yea like those pesky minimum wage laws

whats wrong with me shipping a container full of indian or chinese people over , setting up a mini industrial town like the the 1800's and making some fat profits?

Haze · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:08

The supermarket i work in opens at 9:30 ( for browsing ) and then we trade 10am - 4pm

Redz · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:08

If the legislation was not religiously orientated there would not be separate provisions for those of Jewish faith.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1994/20/schedule/2

InvaderGIR · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:10

Nexus said:
Some stores open at 10 as a 'browsing' hour, but you can't buy anything till 11.

Indeed, we open at 09:30 but you can't get anything at the tills until 10:00.

SMN · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:15

Its the sunday trading law, as already stated. Think it needs to be ... removed from law however, since online stores can trade 24x7, which should a shop front be required to shut?

Castiel · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:17

Redz said:
If the legislation was not religiously orientated there would not be separate provisions for those of Jewish faith.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1994/20/schedule/2

That is for closing on the Jewish Sabbath instead, it allows them to be exempt on Sunday only under strict regulation.

Destination · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:19

The Halk said:
In England and Wales your shops are resticted on the total hours they can open on a Sunday, to make sure that people go to Church, rather than shop all day.

In our wonderful little region of Norn Iron, Sunday opening hours are even more restrictive. 1pm - 6pm is the only opening hours allowed on a Sunday even for Tescos and chums. Petrol stations excluded, but 5 hours is otherwise the max.

Energize · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:21

simulatorman said:
They don't seem to have harmed the country so far. Go down the high street and it's business as usual apart from the hours.

Look at the figures, the economy contracted last quarter.

arknor said:
yea like those pesky minimum wage laws

whats wrong with me shipping a container full of indian or chinese people over , setting up a mini industrial town like the the 1800's and making some fat profits?

I think you're in the wrong thread, this is about Sunday trading hours not minimum wage.

Castiel · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:24

SMN said:
Its the sunday trading law, as already stated. Think it needs to be ... removed from law however, since online stores can trade 24x7, which should a shop front be required to shut?

While they can take orders, they cannot fulfil them.

Redz · 30 Jan 2011 at 13:25

Castiel said:
That is for closing on the Jewish Sabbath instead, it allows them to be exempt on Sunday.

Yes that's the point. The legislation allows them to close on their day of rest/worship.