Shops not passing on VAT cut

Well, reading between the lines of some private Fox vs DD slapping, I still don't understand how making business more money is supposed to be more useful to economy than what it was originally introduced for.

The idea is to get people spend money again. Not just on small items - they want the shopping spree back in fashion. They want you to go and buy that stuff you postponed. Many of us don't get to see much father than cozzy, stable for a while IT market but you have to remember what happened when the banks badly invested our money and lost most of it on letting Chantelle buy her plywood trailer in Pensylvania based on her projected door to door Tupperware sales income.

The first things banks did was to pull availability of UK credit and mortgages. Not only lack of credit made it harder to get credit card and pay for all those shoes in Mrs.Shopoholic closet but it actually collapsed the biggest cashcow this country had for decades - housing market. Not because people didn't want to buy houses any more but because no one would lend them unless they had ef loads of it in the first place. Which no one was prepared to have, as it all happened very quickly. And so we went from fully swung shopping spree fueled additionally by fantastic exchange rate against just about everything to zero in matter of days, not even weeks. Once the housing market collapsed, the ground broke under DIY, furniture, household goods market, your boilers, cookers, windows, building trade, flooring, painting, carpeting, you name it. All the businesses where you need people to spend tens of thousands of pounds, all of that gone stale in weeks. I should know, I closed the door on my part time business as well. As a double whammy - the clientele left in the shops looking at those sofas, carpets and tv sets can't get credit as readily as they used to. And it spreads like a disease, because the less business, the less plumbers buying yutes and pickup trucks, less builder's wives going nuts with wallet at Debenhams, less plasmas bought by carpenter's kids for new football seasons. So on, so forth. You get it. And this is where keeping 2.5% of no money walking in to the store is much worse option than kick starting customers to actually spend cash and start pouring money back to business and by default back to taxman vaults. The money is to motivate me or Fox, to go and start spending. This VAT cut would be much deeper and much more prenounced if it wasn't for the EU rule which prohibits VAT lower than 15% in any member state.

Now, the reason why computer high street store's decision to go for "it will cost us staff hours and will only save £1 on £40 purchase" is incredibly stupid is not only because it makes the particular store greedy ("well if it's "only" £1, then why don't you pass it on, a-holes?") but also because it now makes them look like even bigger rip off compared to already cheaper and now additionally cut prices on the net.
 
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Now, the reason why computer high street store make a huge decision going for "it will cost us staff hours and will only save £1 on £40 purchase" is incredibly stupid is not only because it makes the particular store greedy ("well if it's "only" £1, then why don't you pass it on, a-holes?") but also because it now makes them look like even bigger rip off.


:o
 
PLEASE correct me if i'm wrong, but the business will pay 2.5% less sales tax on it's own purchases. So there is absolutely NO loss to the business if it lowers prices to reflect the tax cut

Had to put that in bold as it's been mentioned wrongly a few times, but this is how I have been taught it and know it.

NOW, I'm a firm believer that companies should damn well keep the prices as they see fit, that 2.5% margin can make a HUGE difference (i agree with you there pilky), it will help companies perform better, give/keep jobs, helps the companies on a fine line stay afloat. Personally, and I take a strong view on this, if you're moaning about a company not passing on a tax cut to you, then you need help (not mental, financial. and if it's purely for principle? well principles mean nothing in this day and age, we all have to bend over backwards at this time to keep the country and economy intact). As you can tell I'm not quite politically neutral, but I'm just saying what I think.

If Ford decided not to pass on the tax cut then (yes/no as prices for Fords have increase slightly recently) I would be glad, we have taken a slim pay rise only JUST above inflation which is not normal for Ford, and ALL spending is frozen (travel, training, overtime, extra shutdown etc etc), and I would be glad that my pension is intact and that it could make the difference of me having a job or not. This is just a simple example, Ford Europe is extremely healthy at the moment, making the largest profits since the 80s (and far outperforming it's rival GM Europe), all the cut in spending and drawbacks on some benefits are purely to help Ford North America, which I believe we should do.

I COMPLETELY agree with Fox, and dirtydog I believe you are taking an EXTREME view and not taking into account how this will affect everyone...only possibly yourself. You seem to have forgotten everyone elses views and focused on Fox entirely picking apart his posts. I'm not getting into an argument or anything but I've seen you do this before and from my standpoint your responses always become illogical.
 
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DD, I have read your posts for a good number of years now, often you do provide at least a little bit of justification or rationality behind your arguments however in this thread you have come across like someone who has a massive chip on their shoulder.

You don't need to be paying bills to understand the value of money, I learnt the value of money from a very young age and still have the same attitude now when I pay my rent and bills. Get off your high horse, paying bills doesn't make you God, neither does living like a loner.
 
PLEASE correct me if i'm wrong, but the business will pay 2.5% less sales tax on it's own purchases. So there is absolutely NO loss to the business if it lowers prices to reflect the tax cut

Thats only true if you assume the costs involved with making the price changes happen are zero, which of course they are not.
 
[TW]Fox;13005095 said:
Thats only true if you assume the costs involved with making the price changes happen are zero, which of course they are not.

Thanks, have to put things in bold in these fast moving threads to get something answered! :D

Opportunity Cost for the ...wait, we cant say that can we.
 
Tesco just gives the vat back on the receipt at the end. A DVD at £9.99 is still £9.99, but at the till on the multibuy savings bit there is VAT back.
An easy short term solution.

On the other hand.... where is the 2.5p reduction on fuel?!

There has been a 2p duty increase on fuel.
 
No :) Because it is deeply patronising to people who do need their money to live and not just to buy BMWs and high end graphics cards.

I do pretty well earnings wise, but I'm still not crazy enough to turn down extra money in the form of change. I just shove it all in a large Bell's bottle and get it changed up when it's full. It's amazing how quickly it adds up and it usually ends up being spent on beer or on something for my nieces/nephew.

Look after the pennies... :D

EDIT: If implementing the cut is at the expense of jobs at a small business then it's justifiable to not pass on the 2.5% drop IMO.
 
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I do pretty well earnings wise, but I'm still not crazy enough to turn down extra money in the form of change. I just shove it all in a large Bell's bottle and get it changed up when it's full. It's amazing how quickly it adds up and it usually ends up being spent on beer or on something for my nieces/nephew.

Look after the pennies... :D

But do you want that extra little bit of change that has to "add up" to be worth anything puposeful at the expense of higher taxes later?
 
I have to say I was dissapointed with overclockers with regards to introducing the vat cut early. I was impressed when i read spie's posts on the forums last week stating how ocuk are bringing the cut in early. However after going to the shop on saturday to get the stuff for my new rig, after ordering and paying, i noticed a small a4 piece of paper stuck in the background stating how the reduced vat wasnt introduced early for shop purchases.


Ive had a look again and cant see anywhere that its stated the early reduction was for internet purchases only. Just to rub salt into the wound, whoever the chubby bloke on the front counter on saturday was rude and about as helpful as a brick wall.
 
Well ocuk doesnt seem to be doing vat drops cos the seagate 500gig sata 2 drive is still 45.99 so no diff there then cos i been checkin the price for last two weeks after i bought first one during halloween.

I have seen Be There broadband use new prices tho for their broadband down from 18 a month to 17.50 a month.
 
[TW]Fox;13001216 said:
Good. The whole thing is ridiculous and stores are stuck in a difficult situation.

They have two choices:

a) Reprice EVERYTHING. This means moving away from established price points, bringing in completely random new ones. Going through huge amounts more change at tillpoints, increasing the time it takes each customer to be served. Spending hundreds of thousands reprinting price stickers, POS, adverts all over the country.

For what? So a £29.99 item can become £29.27? Whats the point, really? Are you actually going to be pleased to pop into a shop, hand over 30 quid for a 29.99 item and instead wait whilst the cashier counts out 73p of change for you? Great. I'd rather just have the penny. We are all going to end up carrying huge amounts more loose change.

So, at a time when the economy isn't doing great companies already experiencing a downturn in sales must commit much money to this utterly ridiculous idea.

Or they can do b)

b) Keep prices the same. Not incur huge pricing costs and retain sensible pricing strategies. Get absolutely slated by the Daily Mail and driven out of business as a result.

Fanastic. And just 3 weeks before Christmas as well.

LOL.

c) Take off VAT at the till.
 
And have all the stock incorrectly priced throughout the store? Thats purely a short term measure. Besides, despite your LOL even taking it off at the till doesn't change the change aspect of it.
 
There has been a 2p duty increase on fuel.

And yet the price of fuel hasnt dropped for more than 3 weeks ! yet I cant see a thread complaining about this on the front page.

The goverment should step in and force garages to drop the price of fuel based on oil prices, they should also force energy companys to drop their prices as the cost of fuel has dropped and they should force banks to pass on credit to customers and businesses, at the moment I have a small business overdraft.. just incase I need it and yet I'm in the black and paying 12.99% interest on the overdraft. Once these other companys get brought into line then we can visit the vat issue.
 
And yet the price of fuel hasnt dropped for more than 3 weeks ! yet I cant see a thread complaining about this on the front page.

The goverment should step in and force garages to drop the price of fuel based on oil prices, they should also force energy companys to drop their prices as the cost of fuel has dropped and they should force banks to pass on credit to customers and businesses, at the moment I have a small business overdraft.. just incase I need it and yet I'm in the black and paying 12.99% interest on the overdraft. Once these other companys get brought into line then we can visit the vat issue.

No one is really complaining because after the drop in VAT it is the same price it was before. And the reason the fuel is so expensive in the first place is because of the ridiculous amount of tax tax the government put on it.
 
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