Im not unwilling to not smack my child. When I have children I will do my upmost to not have to resort to that. After all, what parent really wants to hit their child? I just accept that there could quite possibly come a circumstance where a smack is needed, and I will cross that bridge when I do. I just don't feel you have failed as a parent, or you are abusing your child if you do smack them as a last resort.
Slapping Your Children
- Thread starter Kosmiche
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Im not unwilling to not smack my child. When I have children I will do my upmost to not have to resort to that. After all, what parent really wants to hit their child? I just accept that there could quite possibly come a circumstance where a smack is needed, and I will cross that bridge when I do. I just don't feel you have failed as a parent, or you are abusing your child if you do smack them as a last resort.
Soldato
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If smacking is a last resort then clearly the parenting skills need expanding upon.
I was smacked as a child, my parents didn't know any better, it didn't do me any harm but on the flip side it did me no good either, i simply learned to avoid it and it just led me to resent my parents.
These days we are awash with different methodology's that there really is no reason to resort to smack/slap/tap (however you want to dress it up)
Or perhaps she has simply matured/developed enough to handle her emotions.
I was smacked as a child, my parents didn't know any better, it didn't do me any harm but on the flip side it did me no good either, i simply learned to avoid it and it just led me to resent my parents.
These days we are awash with different methodology's that there really is no reason to resort to smack/slap/tap (however you want to dress it up)
Or perhaps she has simply matured/developed enough to handle her emotions.
I can guarantee that some of the worst behaved kids in school will be the ones getting the most smacks at home.
Violence breeds violence.
I didn't say it automatically means failure as a parent, many well meaning parents do things which are detrimental - even a parent who as you say uses physical punishment once or twice but apart from that is very attentive will indeed be a net positive influence.
But, even the rare use of physical punishment does have an impact for some children & on-top of that there is no evidence that suggests it modifies behaviour in the long term (aside from short term compliance). The fact you dislike the term child abuse is simply because you assuming it's meaning is being applied in the more severe sense - it isn't, but the term is still objectively correct if you take it in it's most broadest sense.
I'm not suggesting that people are terrible net parents, I'm saying that with what we know today there is no real excuse to use physical punishment to raise children - it shows a lack of self-control or willpower to use potentially longer & more difficult parental methods which overall are more effective.
If anything a parents role is to set an example, the use of physical force to make a point or force compliance is clearly going to have a few unintended side effects (which according to the studies include, violence throughout early childhood, spousal & child abuse).
To me, the 'gain' of short term compliance isn't worth the potential risks.
This thread just reminded me of something I did recently, my sister agreed as did my mum, my girlfriend kind of agreed...
Either way, my nephew, 4 years old, little ****. He is a brat and gets away with it from my mum and my sis (gran and mother).
I was asked to baby sit him, his brother (younger, 1 year old) was snoozing away and the eldest (Oliver) was fart arsing around. I asked him to calm down but knew he was just full of energy so didn't want to be a complete **** to him. Then, he started kicking the cat's climbing post, to which I said "Oliver, please don't kick things, it's not nice". And as usual, he carried on, eventually, after a few reminders, I got serious...
Note, this point is where my mum/sis give up and just shout, ignoring the younger child so Oliver gets all the attention, which is what he ultimately seeks.
So, I said "one more time, and I WILL smack you, your 3rd and last warning. Do not kick things".
He looked at me, smirk on his face and slowly extended his leg and kicked the post ever so gently. He knew what he was doing, so did I.
I stood up, walked at him with some pace. The boys face when white. I grabbed his arm, lifted him up and slapped his arse.
He didn't move or say anything for 20 mins, the first 5 was crying and screaming. The rest was sulking. I left him to it. And ignored all his cries. After 20 mins, he came over, said sorry and I said "do you understand why I smacked you?" "yes, I kicked that thing when you said not to".
"Good, don't do it again"... Done.
My mum and sis came back about an hour later. I told my sis what I did and both were a little shocked as I had not slapped either of the boys before but as I said. He needs some proper telling off from time to time to show him some things are said for a reason.
I will be just as strict with my own children, and this is what my girlfriend doesn't agree with.
I was brought up with a firm hand from both parents, love them both and learnt my lessons early on. Words mean nothing if the threats are not followed through.
Just my 2 cents.
Either way, my nephew, 4 years old, little ****. He is a brat and gets away with it from my mum and my sis (gran and mother).
I was asked to baby sit him, his brother (younger, 1 year old) was snoozing away and the eldest (Oliver) was fart arsing around. I asked him to calm down but knew he was just full of energy so didn't want to be a complete **** to him. Then, he started kicking the cat's climbing post, to which I said "Oliver, please don't kick things, it's not nice". And as usual, he carried on, eventually, after a few reminders, I got serious...
Note, this point is where my mum/sis give up and just shout, ignoring the younger child so Oliver gets all the attention, which is what he ultimately seeks.
So, I said "one more time, and I WILL smack you, your 3rd and last warning. Do not kick things".
He looked at me, smirk on his face and slowly extended his leg and kicked the post ever so gently. He knew what he was doing, so did I.
I stood up, walked at him with some pace. The boys face when white. I grabbed his arm, lifted him up and slapped his arse.
He didn't move or say anything for 20 mins, the first 5 was crying and screaming. The rest was sulking. I left him to it. And ignored all his cries. After 20 mins, he came over, said sorry and I said "do you understand why I smacked you?" "yes, I kicked that thing when you said not to".
"Good, don't do it again"... Done.
My mum and sis came back about an hour later. I told my sis what I did and both were a little shocked as I had not slapped either of the boys before but as I said. He needs some proper telling off from time to time to show him some things are said for a reason.
I will be just as strict with my own children, and this is what my girlfriend doesn't agree with.
I was brought up with a firm hand from both parents, love them both and learnt my lessons early on. Words mean nothing if the threats are not followed through.
Just my 2 cents.
Soldato
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^^
I see nothing wrong with that at all.
Completely agree. That is exactly the right and measured way IMO.
Spot on, you reasoned with him, he blatantly and willfully defied you knowing the consequences (which weren't being beaten to an inch of his life) and he got those consequences.
While that can be true, I know of people who parent's let them get away with murder. Never smacked their children, most likely because they couldn't be bothered. They were complete terrors in school.
Think it boils down to some kids need smacking, others don't.
Soldato
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I guess the main reason we need little scientific evidence to socially accept smacking is possibly that generations of people have had a clip up the ear, or been spanked with no perceivable detriment to their lives. Granted, it is not sceintific, but I think generations of parents have shown that occasionally smacking a child when they have been very naughty has not bred a world full of violent miscreants and in most cases the child goes on to live their life without any issues.
Clearly systematic abuse is a different issue, and should be tackled.
In general, I think a short sharp shock serves to focus the mind and relate a negative outcome with negative behaviour or actions. For example, you could explain to a child that fire is hot and not to touch it because it will burn. Would doing so be more or less efective than them putting their fingers into a flame and getting burned?
You could explain to a child that climbing over XYZ is dangerous but would they take that lesson on board more readily than the time they fall off XYZ and graze their knee or bump their head?
The same goes with explaining why they should not chase wasps around the garden. Would explaining it be more or less effective than the time they do it and get stung?
The basis of shock and pain related responses when forming behavioural pathways is part ouf our survival technique as a species - in fact the very purpose of pain is a protection mechanism so we know when something is wrong with us and it helps cognitition when we assess the world around us. A child does not have the necessary faculties to assess the world around them so parents have to do it for them and protect them from the dangers in life. But to take that to a logical conclusion we would have generations of children who never left their parents side, or the family home. Ergo, we have to allow a child to experience things like shock and pain because it is important in their development and cognition of risks/rewards within their environment.
Here is a question:
If smacking a child when they have put themselves at severe risk, or done something very naughty is classed as abuse, what is it when we let the same child ride a bike and fall off and hurt themselves (which they inevatibly will)?
Both are concious choices by the parent. Both result in shock and or pain for the child. Both assist with creating cognitive and behavioural pathways.
Why is one classed abuse and the other not?
Clearly systematic abuse is a different issue, and should be tackled.
In general, I think a short sharp shock serves to focus the mind and relate a negative outcome with negative behaviour or actions. For example, you could explain to a child that fire is hot and not to touch it because it will burn. Would doing so be more or less efective than them putting their fingers into a flame and getting burned?
You could explain to a child that climbing over XYZ is dangerous but would they take that lesson on board more readily than the time they fall off XYZ and graze their knee or bump their head?
The same goes with explaining why they should not chase wasps around the garden. Would explaining it be more or less effective than the time they do it and get stung?
The basis of shock and pain related responses when forming behavioural pathways is part ouf our survival technique as a species - in fact the very purpose of pain is a protection mechanism so we know when something is wrong with us and it helps cognitition when we assess the world around us. A child does not have the necessary faculties to assess the world around them so parents have to do it for them and protect them from the dangers in life. But to take that to a logical conclusion we would have generations of children who never left their parents side, or the family home. Ergo, we have to allow a child to experience things like shock and pain because it is important in their development and cognition of risks/rewards within their environment.
Here is a question:
If smacking a child when they have put themselves at severe risk, or done something very naughty is classed as abuse, what is it when we let the same child ride a bike and fall off and hurt themselves (which they inevatibly will)?
Both are concious choices by the parent. Both result in shock and or pain for the child. Both assist with creating cognitive and behavioural pathways.
Why is one classed abuse and the other not?
The fire example you used. If i discipline my child for her own safety but end up giving her a small smack to stop her touching the fire, if i understand your point, you argue that you've effectively just transferred the shock/fear factor from the fire itself to the parent.
Which i think is a good thing. When a child subsequently does something despite you having had to discipline them before for doing it, which they will do, and then REALLY hurts themselves you could argue you have made a positive impact on your relationship with your child.
You've had it proven that when you tell them something, and it's important enough to you to have smacked them for disobeying, then actually you may have been right to discpline them.
I don't believe it's beyond a 3 year old to think "Hey, touching fire does bloody hurt, it's a bloody stupid idea and perhaps mum and dad are right when they tell me stuff."
And yes, i would say it's the right thing to do to try and teach them to avoid severe and potentially life changing / threatening injury with a smack if that is absolutely your last choice in the matter. Letting my daughter rampage around the room when i could see obvious dangers to her if she continued to do so would be a far greater dereliction of duty.
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^^
I see nothing wrong with that at all.
I'm glad you all agree, I don't agree with multiple slaps or smacking. And never, ever above the waist. One swift smack and the child left alone until all tempers/emotions have calmed is what I think is right. Followed by a discussion of what happened and why.
Oh, he hasn't kicked a thing since and when ever he starts to play up. I remind him that he will be smacked and now he knows it's not a pleasant experience and I will not back down from my threat, any issues are almost instantly nipped in the bud.
I slap my girlfriend and mates, if the occasion calls for it.
The 'why' just varies.
*keyboards a-flailing*
Soldato
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Man, you're lucky LateX'Dog decided to leave the thread or you'd REALLY be in for it.
Oh wait, there's MrMoonX. Get ready for it you child abusing scum!
Man of Honour
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Never slapped my younger boy.. I can't say the same for my older to who are now teenagers.
I'm of the opinion now that i doesn't serve any purpose... so it's pointless.
I'm of the opinion now that i doesn't serve any purpose... so it's pointless.
People have their own opinions and are entitled to them. But to tell someone else their own opinions are wrong is plain stupid. So here is a pre-emptive reply for when either do come along with those accusations.
1) It's a child, so not, it's not like slapping my friend on the arse. Don't be so stupid.
2) It's not child abuse, child abuse is something seriously different. I did not punch, torture, suffocate, molest, emotionally torture, tease, kick, ignore or many other things which can be seen as abuse. I gave clear instructions to which the child defied. All 3 previous instructions were given a threat of a physical lesson, a slap on the bum. On the 3rd strike, no final warnings would be given and only a slap. The child questioned my authority and as a result, the child was punished and reminded I'm in charge.
3) No.