Socket 939: Dead or alive?.....

[leaskovski]

lol, my 939 has got loads in it yeat. Im still run ning my venice 3000 at stock clock. When it starts to shows its age, i will oc it. Then flee bay will come in handy to get someone elses old top of the range 939 to plonk in my mobo.

 

[1dmf]

I find it funny how current AMD owners are in such a dilema, I myself am upgrading because I have a POS P4 netburst processor, which AMD has been spanking for years!!!

I've come to the 5 year upgrade point and I was going to go AMD, but then came C2D, no contest, i've bought a E6700, i was going to get new Mobo, Ram etc.. anyhow.

I guess if i'd already had an AMD it might have been a different descision all together.

I won't be upgrading for another 3-5 years so by then who knows what will be on the market, at least my Mobo is already QC ready so I guess a kentsfield , Vista and another 2gig of ram might do me in the interim in a year or so.

I've always been an Intel fan, although i did like my Tbird 1.2gig athlon when i got it before DDR was around! so going P4 back then was a no brainer at the time also.

probably no help to the OP but it's my 2 pence worth

 

[Gashman]

thats a fair enough reason, but as i have said before, i just don't see how im gonna get any level of improvement over this 4600+ running at 2.8Ghz, it runs absolutely everything without any trouble, i know conroe will do the same, but if theres no difference, then why bother? i certainly won't be running games, msn, IE, super-pi and burning DVDs all at the same time, thats just stupidity so i don't need a processor that can handle a dozen programs running at once, since i don't do that, if im gaming msn, etc all go off

 

[Cyber-Mav]

I find it funny how current AMD owners are in such a dilema, I myself am upgrading because I have a POS P4 netburst processor, which AMD has been spanking for years!!!

I've come to the 5 year upgrade point and I was going to go AMD, but then came C2D, no contest, i've bought a E6700, i was going to get new Mobo, Ram etc.. anyhow.

question is: is the gap clock for clock between the p4 and a64 the same as the gap between the a64 and the c2d?

 

[1dmf]

I agree, i'm pretty rubbish at games, and certainly can't play , burn cd's read my email and chat in forums at the same time.

I know there is a big debate on whether conroe does spank recent amd's and luckily for me i'm not in that predicament. I know i'm going to be blown away with my conroe e6700 ddr2-800 and 8800gtx.

and it's still less money than when i originaly built my P4 set up!

If AMD are smart I think they will stretch out the 939 socket a bit longer with a few more chips until they have got their act together as those with 939, PCI-e and DDR2-400 probably don't need to go AM2 yet, and from what i've seen many have gone C2D rather than AM2.

all AM2 really brought to the table was DDR2-800 and seings as latency is more important with AMD's and the higher MHZ you go the slacker the timings, hence them waiting till DDR2-800 instead of having 533 & 667 as only 800 showed any benefit to AMD it wouldn't be wise for them to leave 939 users out in the cold.

I read somewhere that the next gen AMD's might not even be AM2 or at least a revision of it, a bit like intel went 775 with the p4 before conroe replacing 478, AMD could have dropped a bollock with AM2, especially as the top end AM2's are not even on the 65nm wafers.

hmm intersting 6 months ahead to see what AMD does do, a lot thought AMD would drop prices in a bid to keep loyal AMD users, but if the 40% price slash on Intel is true in Q2 2007 that won't help AMD in the slightest!

only time will tell

 

[Cyber-Mav]

yea AMD made a big mistake abandoning s939 when conroe came out. its just plain simple logic that anyone who is on s939 and wants a new machine will go conroe, since you have to buy new mobo, cpu and ram.

if they extended the life of s939 and kept it in production then it would have slowed down conroe's take over by a large margin.

am2 should have debuted with k8L and not sooner.

 

[joeyjojo]

I guess they decided the lack of DDR ram would eventually make 939 impossible anyway.

 

[Cyber-Mav]

ddr ram still sells today at similar if not cheaper prices to ddr2. then again amd is not a trend setter. if intel go ddr2 amd will have to too.
if amd go ddr3 and intel don;t then amd = bankrupt.

 

[Killajaz]

 

[22BUK]

I put my socket939 X2 3800 up for sale on an auction site a few days ago and expected to get around £70 for it. With over a day left to go bidding has now reached £112, and over 500 people have viewed it. I guess AMD underestimated the demand for this socket.

Nobody will migrate from 939 to AM2 when Conroe is so good, but a lot of people would have taken the easy upgrade option and just replaced the CP for a faster one.

 

[Biggles 266]

I know if i am to buy ddr2 for a new system it wont be for amd, it really bugs me that they just cant get their socket revsion sorted once and for all. Blimey its got more pins than intel but can only support one fabrication of chips. So although intel costs more, at least it will last much longer with a simple bios update! Back to the op, this platform is dead so lets just accept it imo!

Um, this complaint is baseless and wrong. It applies to Intel however.

Socket AM2 is compatible with all Socket AM2 chips. AMD will be updating Socket AM2 to what is currently being termed AM2+. The only difference is that HTT will move from the current 1.0 revision to 3.0 revision, giving a lot more bandwidth. The processors will still all use DDR2 RAM at this point. Processors released for Socket AM2+ will however still work in Socket AM2 boards, just without being able to utilise all the bandwidth that HTT 3.0 offers. This is an academic point anyway, since no chip currently saturates HTT 1.0. So far, nothing to complain about - future chips work just fine, but will work theoretically better with future motherboards.

Socket AM3 is next. This uses DDR3 RAM. Lots more memory bandwidth, still uses HTT 3.0. DDR2 and DDR3 RAM are not compatible. However, Socket AM3 chips will have the same number of pins as AM2 and AM2+ chips and will be drop in replacements. The memory controller of AM3 chips is supposed to be compatible with both DDR2 and DDR3 chips. The worse you might see is quad-core (or more perhaps) AM3 chips possibly managing to saturate the bandwidth of HTT 1.0, Socket AM2 motherboards. Socket AM2+ motherboards have HTT 3.0 so wouldn't face that problem.

To summarise, all future chips will fit in Socket AM2. Newer chips might be able to take advantage of newer motherboards, but shouldn't be handicapped being in older motherboards. Only combination that won't work is a Socket AM2 chip in a Socket AM3 motherboard. But then nobody complained when Pentium 3s didn't fit in Pentium 4 motherboards, did they?

I really don't see what you are complaining about.

Intel on the other hand have a situation where not all Socket 775 chips will work in all Socket 775 motherboards. Ironically, even their own top-of-the-line enthusiast board featuring a chipset hailed as the best for C2D.

 

[Cyber-Mav]

I put my socket939 X2 3800 up for sale on an auction site a few days ago and expected to get around £70 for it. With over a day left to go bidding has now reached £112, and over 500 people have viewed it. I guess AMD underestimated the demand for this socket.

Nobody will migrate from 939 to AM2 when Conroe is so good, but a lot of people would have taken the easy upgrade option and just replaced the CP for a faster one.

thats what i have been saying all along. my mate rang up the fools at AMD and told them that they had made a big mistake etc but they just hung up on him

hope amd go bankrupt for this.

 

[Biggles 266]

You want AMD to go bankrupt? Why, so Intel can shaft you and not bother to develop better technology? Competition is only a good thing. Without it we will see a return to the days of slow development and £500 processors.

DDR2 was necessary for AMD because that's what the memory companies were making. DDR was becoming rarer and more expensive, not to mention the fact that it was in as big sizes as it was going to get. If you want 4 GB of RAM on a DDR2 motherboard, that's easy. No big performance hit and not overly expensive. 4 GB on a DDR motherboard? Horrendously expensive and a big performance hit.

Also think about how much in the way of sales enthusiasts who want Socket 939 contribute compared to the sales AMD get from Dell. Dell use DDR2 now, that wasn't going to change.

Yeah, I'd like an upgrade path for Socket 939, but it couldn't happen. I'd also like an upgrade for Socket A, but that couldn't happen either. Technology moves on.

Bottom line is that AMD needed to move to DDR2 RAM, not for performance reasons but for economic and market reasons. AMD didn't make a mistake, your mate is just wrong.

 

[Final8y]

You want AMD to go bankrupt? Why, so Intel can shaft you and not bother to develop better technology? Competition is only a good thing. Without it we will see a return to the days of slow development and £500 processors.

DDR2 was necessary for AMD because that's what the memory companies were making. DDR was becoming rarer and more expensive, not to mention the fact that it was in as big sizes as it was going to get. If you want 4 GB of RAM on a DDR2 motherboard, that's easy. No big performance hit and not overly expensive. 4 GB on a DDR motherboard? Horrendously expensive and a big performance hit.

Also think about how much in the way of sales enthusiasts who want Socket 939 contribute compared to the sales AMD get from Dell. Dell use DDR2 now, that wasn't going to change.

Yeah, I'd like an upgrade path for Socket 939, but it couldn't happen. I'd also like an upgrade for Socket A, but that couldn't happen either. Technology moves on.

Bottom line is that AMD needed to move to DDR2 RAM, not for performance reasons but for economic and market reasons. AMD didn't make a mistake, your mate is just wrong.

4GB of DDR ram does not give you a big performance HIT. its a small one.[I have 4GB & the hit from benching and gaming was unnoticeable from when i had just 2GB] nor did it cost more than 4GB of DDR2.
And yes they did need to move on to DDR2 but that does not mean that they had to drop 939 chips so fast as well tho, that is a mistake if how they go about it makes most people buy the competition because of not giving people a worthwhile upgrade path at such cost, they should surport the 939 untill they can offer one.
AMD don't make ram they make CPU`s ect... & demand for 939 was there.
Now at this time they have nothing to offer so people will leave AMD, the timing could not have been any worse and when they see what was happening with the C2D they should have done some back tracking with not dropping All 939 chips.
Just like you can still buy new AGP cards today even tho its old tech a lot of ppl have them you give them what they want untill you can offer something better that they cant resist on the new PCIE.
Its all about keeping people in your pocket.

I wonder if AMD released a 939 cpu that was equal to a C2D that few if any would have moved over.
If you look at the threads ~& comments you will see that its not about the DD2 ram or the sockets or the mobos that are making people move its about having the best cpu you can get for your money.

 

[Gjaxx]

I've hunted high and low for a x2 4800 for the last month, eventually ending up on this thread.
I had a major disaster about 6 months ago and had to find a mobo and processor in a hurry. Given the amount of cash available at the time and that I'd just bought a 7800GS (AGP), I chose to go with an ASRock Dual939-SATA2, with a 64bit 3200 mainly because it offered future upgrade ability. An AGP slot + pci-e and a future cpu slot which would take an AM2 cpu board, as well as IDE and SATA2. Bear in mind that this was just before AMD dropped all their prices. Total package cost was over £240. Great, time to upgrade to dual core. I have a couple of hundred to spare so a nice shiny x2 4800 will do just nicely......HaHaHa! Yeah! Right!
Now I'm not the brightest star in the firmament and failed to check out how much this AM2 cpu board would cost. I now find that it costs approx £70, which is more than the original board cost. Add to that the cost of DDR2 and it all begins to go a bit pear shaped.
AMD have kicked their supporters in the teeth with this policy and I for one will just hang on to what I have until I can afford a new system, which will be Intel based....Way to go AMD

 

[allllec]

Just one question, if you had say, £300 to spend on a new mobo/ram/cpu

what would perform better S939 based or AM2 based? just curious... i know its all very subjective but still would like an idea


*edit*

also, we must bear in mind that unfortunately enthusiasts are a tiny percentage of amd's custom compared to say someone like Dell, and enthusiasts are probably the majority of people who would stick on 939 and upgrade.. sure so would average users who got a tiny bit of knowledge.. but i doubt its viable for AMD to put more money into R&D, production, sales, support, marketing into 939 considering the majority of their custom is going to be AM2

don't get me wrong id be over the moon if amd turned around and said look at our 2.8ghz, 65nm 60w X2 s939's we can dream cant we

 

[Final8y]

Just one question, if you had say, £300 to spend on a new mobo/ram/cpu

what would perform better S939 based or AM2 based? just curious... i know its all very subjective but still would like an idea


*edit*

also, we must bear in mind that unfortunately enthusiasts are a tiny percentage of amd's custom compared to say someone like Dell, and enthusiasts are probably the majority of people who would stick on 939 and upgrade.. sure so would average users who got a tiny bit of knowledge.. but i doubt its viable for AMD to put more money into R&D, production, sales, support, marketing into 939 considering the majority of their custom is going to be AM2

don't get me wrong id be over the moon if amd turned around and said look at our 2.8ghz, 65nm 60w X2 s939's we can dream cant we

Agree but it was the enthusiasts that helped in a big way to get them where they are in the first place by getting them noticed more in the main stream spreading the word for free, but hey thanks guys but we don't need your help anymore we need to move onto AM2 for DDR2 so for you guys with 939 will not see any benefit so tough luck. it will only appeal to new first time buyers & big corporate needs.