Spain House Build - PLANNING APPROVED

[Martynt74]

If there is only two of you, do you need 3 bedrooms one with en-suite? Could maybe get more space if you limited those things?

Also can't you attach garage to house and have it more habitable?

Im no expert in any of this but I'd be looking to orient the main living room windows towards the biggest mountains and where there won't be anything in the way like other houses or roads.

Is it better to separate the bedroom areas from the living room areas by some form of corridor or hallway area?

Will the house be right in the middle of that plot with a long driveway, or nearer the road?

Well, the plan is the top right bedroom would be my office, then we have one spare bedroom for guests. That room could also be used by the wife when she's having a bad crash and needs to shut herself away in the dark and can watch tv away from noise. That way we don't have a tv in the bedroom and can orient the bed towards a big window.
That was the appeal of the bedroom orientation in post 12. The bed faces out to the side, rather than to the pool area.

I've ummed and ahhed about garage location. Having it separate means that there's no noise issues. If i want to absolutely blast music then it's separate enough to not be annoying . We could also build from lesser materials to keep costs down, however there's also the appeal of having it attached. Especially as it's more likely to be livable space. I could then just build a shed for tools/workshop away from the house with a covered car port for working on the car.

Oh, there's mountains in every direction and no cars/houses in the view (except way into the distance). We'd likely orient to the west, as whilst the mountains aren't the biggest, they're the closest and would be completely uninterupted.

I'm not a huge fan of the bedrooms directly off the living area and a corridor is a good idea. They seem to like the immediate bedrooms off living space here though.

House will likely be placed like this, although would need to spend more time there to really finalise it. Obviously not to scale

 

[danlightbulb]

Well, the plan is the top right bedroom would be my office, then we have one spare bedroom for guests. That room could also be used by the wife when she's having a bad crash and needs to shut herself away in the dark and can watch tv away from noise. That way we don't have a tv in the bedroom and can orient the bed towards a big window.
That was the appeal of the bedroom orientation in post 12. The bed faces out to the side, rather than to the pool area.

I've ummed and ahhed about garage location. Having it separate means that there's no noise issues. If i want to absolutely blast music then it's separate enough to not be annoying . We could also build from lesser materials to keep costs down, however there's also the appeal of having it attached. Especially as it's more likely to be livable space. I could then just build a shed for tools/workshop away from the house with a covered car port for working on the car.

Oh, there's mountains in every direction and no cars/houses in the view (except way into the distance). We'd likely orient to the west, as whilst the mountains aren't the biggest, they're the closest and would be completely uninterupted.

I'm not a huge fan of the bedrooms directly off the living area and a corridor is a good idea. They seem to like the immediate bedrooms off living space here though.

House will likely be placed like this, although would need to spend more time there to really finalise it. Obviously not to scale

Cool stuff.

Ah got to think about the sun as well haven't you. Outdoor pool ideally south or south west facing for the afternoon sun - you have it on the east side which is probably not a good idea as you'll have it in shade late afternoon.

 

[Martynt74]

Yeah, we really need to keep going up at various times to check. The issues being the mountains block the sun anyway quite early, but unsure if that's just because it's a little lower in winter and therefore not be as much of an issue in summer. I know this side of the valley is quite shaded though vs the other side in the evening.

Stupid mountains!

 

[HangTime]

2) The door to bedrooms 2/3 is in the middle of the seating area. Dormitorio 2 is going to be my office. This means that every time i want a drink/general skive, i'm going to be walking in front of my wife on the sofa

I'm trying to figure out if you mean that you are stepping away from a work computer to get a glass of water, or you are sneaking off from your wife to sit in your study and drink booze instead of being given chores haha

If it's the former I don't really see the issue, I mean how often is this going to happen, every couple of hours? Or is your wife going to to be working from the sofa on private phone calls or something? (I have that sort of scenario in that my wife typically works in the kitchen and has to deal with some quite sensitive safeguarding topics, so on the rare occasions we're both working from home I have to be wary of that going to get food/drinks, or she goes into a bedroom).

Your comment about table being a dumping ground resonates, but if you don't have a table, you'll still need a dumping ground like sideboards or something.

 

[HangTime]

So, was up until around midnight last night playing with floorplan ideas, and i think i quite like this

It makes the master suite pretty big, with walk in wardrobe section
The seating area faces a big wall for the TV
It has a decent entrance hallway
Nice recessed bit outside the main bedroom for a small seating area
Great views from the main bedroom
Laundry is pretty big, with an external door for that end of the house
Main bathroom is open to all, rather than being focussed towards bedrooms 2/3

It takes the above plan and adds around 5m2 of floorspace but that shouldn't add *too* much cost to make it unaffordable

1. I prefer this, the master bedroom looks too small in the original.
2. It looks like you'll have a TV on the interior wall shared with Master Bedroom - possibly a noise issue if anyone is watching TV whilst you and/or your wife are trying to sleep?
3. I'd try and make it bigger if you can, if I was building a new home I'd want over 120m^2 for sure.
4. Regarding bedrooms off the living space, to me it feels like corridors are sort of 'wasted' space so it makes sense to me, although I don't like chained bedrooms (having to walk through one bedroom to access another). My grandmothers old house had ridiculous landing area, very wide except for the bit where it narrowed for the staircase up to the top floor. It was bigger than one of the bedrooms!

 

[Martynt74]

I'm trying to figure out if you mean that you are stepping away from a work computer to get a glass of water, or you are sneaking off from your wife to sit in your study and drink booze instead of being given chores haha

If it's the former I don't really see the issue, I mean how often is this going to happen, every couple of hours? Or is your wife going to to be working from the sofa on private phone calls or something? (I have that sort of scenario in that my wife typically works in the kitchen and has to deal with some quite sensitive safeguarding topics, so on the rare occasions we're both working from home I have to be wary of that going to get food/drinks, or she goes into a bedroom).

Your comment about table being a dumping ground resonates, but if you don't have a table, you'll still need a dumping ground like sideboards or something.

Haha, sadly it's the former!

Yeah, we both work from home, and she works from the sofa, and then sits watching TV. I don't think it'd be a huge issue, but it could be annoying. Especially as i'm fantastically useless and will often forget things and so could be wandering past every 30 seconds as things pop into my head!

1. I prefer this, the master bedroom looks too small in the original.
2. It looks like you'll have a TV on the interior wall shared with Master Bedroom - possibly a noise issue if anyone is watching TV whilst you and/or your wife are trying to sleep?
3. I'd try and make it bigger if you can, if I was building a new home I'd want over 120m^2 for sure.
4. Regarding bedrooms off the living space, to me it feels like corridors are sort of 'wasted' space so it makes sense to me, although I don't like chained bedrooms (having to walk through one bedroom to access another). My grandmothers old house had ridiculous landing area, very wide except for the bit where it narrowed for the staircase up to the top floor. It was bigger than one of the bedrooms!

I think i prefer this layout too. I'm going to run it by the builder/architect and see what objections they have.

TV i don't think would be an issue. She tends to go to bed early due to her illness and i've got into the habit of using headphones. The few times i don't i quickly put them on because of the dogs snoring (If you've heard a French Bulldog snore you know what i mean!). I'd also still have my "man cave" room in the external garage so if i wanted to make noise i have that option.

I kind of agree with corridors, although i think there's a balance. For example my layout in post 12 you preferred means guests are coming into the kitchen area to go to the toilet which could be awkward. In the original plan then at least it's hidden away. The alternative would be to make it a jack/jill style bathroom with my office. That way the entrance is private and i know if we have guests it's their bathroom and i just go from my office to the en-suite which isn't a big deal, and if we're just hosting then people who come round can use that bathroom.

Making things bigger then becomes a hit on costs and that's the tough part. Bear in mind i'd have a separate garage (which isn't really a garage), which is around 40-50m2. So all of my "stuff" (home gym/hifi/workshop) is separate from the main house. This leaves the main house as just being used just for the 2 of us for living and then accommodate guests.

I'd actually prefer the idea of a separate guest house. So the main house would only be 2 bedrooms (our main bedroom and an office for me), and then guests have their own separate place. That way they feel more at home/separate and we don't have any intrusion in the house from guests. Especially if people stay for longer as we expect my mother in law to do. The flip side to that is that if i had a separate building distanced from the house then i'd want to rent it out and everytime we had guests i'd be thinking it was costing me around 300-400 a week

Since i mentioned costs above, i guess i should say that the "base" cost of the plan in the OP which is 103m2 comes to around €273k, with adding various "extras" including a separate building of 50m2 (built using lesser materials but still being livable), a pool cover, upgrading air con to a heat pump based split system, electric shutters, full solar system including 13kwh battery storage, and extending the terraced area brings us to around €340k, the plot of land then is coming to around €80k. You then have 13% taxes on top bringing the whole lot to a cost of €460k and that's really our limit.

 

[HangTime]

The alternative would be to make it a jack/jill style bathroom with my office. That way the entrance is private and i know if we have guests it's their bathroom and i just go from my office to the en-suite which isn't a big deal, and if we're just hosting then people who come round can use that bathroom.

That looks like the best option, I see what you mean about the kitchen, you don't want to be cooking breakfast in the morning and someone sheepishly walks past having clearly just been for a dump

 

[dlockers]

That looks like the best option, I see what you mean about the kitchen, you don't want to be cooking breakfast in the morning and someone sheepishly walks past having clearly just been for a dump

Feels like a problem that can be educated out. Dump with confidence if you are dumping in my house!

 

[Martynt74]

Been slightly thinking about the above since the posts when driving round looking at plots this evening.

I'm actually wondering if a better option is the build out the house as per the above, but make bedrooms 2/3 into my office and home gym (would probably extend the 2 rooms slightly and then wouldn't need a corridor at all as the non en-suite bathroom would be less important to be concealed for private pooping.
Then instead of an external garage of 50m2, i could build a small 2 bed unit which was self contained. This would then be used for guests/rentals. As long as the builders did the structural work, then i could fit a kitchen/bathroom easy enough.

The plot is big enough that there is sufficient space to keep it far enough from the main house, whilst still being close enough for it not to feel too isolated.

The addition of a hifi room could then come later on if i decided i needed it, although in all honesty, whilst i like the idea, the amount of use it'd get would be minimal.

 

[Martynt74]

For people wondering about directions/layouts. Here's a few pictures of the 40,000m2 plot


View from the road of the "middle" of the plot. Pretty much goes to the base of the hill so no obstruction in that direction.

Plot on the right of the road looking towards the town

Pretty much goes towards the white building in the distance

Sunrise shot

 

[ristac]

Opening thread, I assume he has already built a few designs the same as this, can he arrange for you to visit one. It would be much easier to see what does and doesn’t work by being in a similar build

 

[Martynt74]

Opening thread, I assume he has already built a few designs the same as this, can he arrange for you to visit one. It would be much easier to see what does and doesn’t work by being in a similar build

No, it's a new design they've pretty much come up with following stealing the plans from taking over a failed build and liking the design. However this was in partnership with the architect and the existing clients are already in but aren't happy showing people around. I guess the problem with working with smaller builders who only build a few homes a year vs some of the big developers.

What we did view was one of his other builds (this is what showed the quality of his work). This was the design of the house and whilst we liked it, there were a few elements that didn't work for us, such as no dressing room and the entrance being through the laundry room. We'd have wanted to turn it into a corridor


We went out to the plot with the builder and the architect on Wednesday and decided on the positioning of the house on the plot. We then hit a stalemate. My wife and the architect believe that the pool should face south to maximise the sun, however me, the estate agent and developer would all flip it 180 degrees, so the pool looked out over the valley and hills. Facing south still faces the mountains close by, but without the sweeping views that being high up in a valley gives which would be lovely from the lounge. We would all counteract the lack of south facing by moving the pool away from the house to keep it in maximum sun. With the house only being single storey, even in the shortest day (yesterday) the shadow cast by the house would only be around 8m, however it was also mean the covered patio would be shaded which isn't ideal.


I then started to think about potential layout changes which give both a south facing pool, whilst still keeping views from the open plan lounge. I remembered the house we viewed which had the bedroom either end with a lounge/kitchen in the middle. This was the design, and actually the picture of the house we viewed. It'd been built around 3 years, hence the slight discolouring on the paint.

I then started to use a floorplanning tool to make some tweaks to it, and came up with the below. It's around 20m2 bigger than the original and keeps a separate front door but moves it to the side so that the cars etc aren't at the same side as the lounge area.

I've asked for a rough price from the architect to try and create something which fits us now that he's seen the plot and can try and integrate the house into the land and make it work in every sense. Whilst i'm still confident the original layout would suit us brilliantly, having the best of everything by making small adjustments seems worth it at this stage.


In other news i've just signed the initial contract with the builder. This means the architect and surveyors can get back to the land and assess the ground and see what's needed ahead of finalising plans.

 

[Martynt74]

Ok. Been a fair old wait as the land seller has had some issues setting up power of attorney for the sale. Things are now scheduled for the 20th February. As such we had a meeting with the builder on Tuesday and have narrowed down the house layout to the below

It's mostly the original plan, but with the top section shifted over to move that door behind the sofa. We do have quite a bit of "wasted" space in the hallway and i'd have preferred to shift that to the lounge area, but my wife liked it like this. I had concerns it might be dark, but i think with motion sensors setup it should be ok.

The window to the right wall will be a high up long narrow window so will have a bank of kitchen units below. Then with a big island. I think that probably gives enough kitchen space. Especially with the large laundry room.

I would still love some big ornamental wooden doors for a grand entranceway, but we need to try and find some at a decent price. Some are crazy! Found these but they're £2.5k and not sure i can justify that over a regular front door.

Indian Original Vintage Teakwood Door - Eco Village Collection IN55

Introducing the Indian Original Vintage Teakwood Door from the Eco Village Collection. Crafted in Rajasthan, India, this door is made with old teakwood, solid and beautiful. Enjoy the vintage charm of this door and the peace of mind of its construction. Features: Unique Large Entrance Door...

www.baliabundance.com.au

 

[dirtychinchilla]

Morning,

Can't say I've followed your journey, but I can't help feel it would be nice if you square off the top left corner, and then on the top right that'd enable you to shift everything left and square off that corner. Unless, I guess, you're trying to get a northern view, as drawn, from the en-suite. Otherwise, I can't see why you'd have those two bits jutting out.

Maybe, though, it's architecturally more interesting..

 

[Martynt74]

Morning,

Can't say I've followed your journey, but I can't help feel it would be nice if you square off the top left corner, and then on the top right that'd enable you to shift everything left and square off that corner. Unless, I guess, you're trying to get a northern view, as drawn, from the en-suite. Otherwise, I can't see why you'd have those two bits jutting out.

Maybe, though, it's architecturally more interesting..

Couple reasons.

1 we were trying to break up the big white box look of a lot of new build villas. The plan is to finish with a stone effect render to try and get it to fit in more

2 The original plan was similar to your suggestion. The problem is that shifting everything left moved the doorway to the bedrooms in front of the sofa which we felt would be irritating. Especially as my wife works on the sofa and so I’d constantly be walking around her. Shifting it right as above keeps a bit more separation.

 

[dirtychinchilla]

Couple reasons.

1 we were trying to break up the big white box look of a lot of new build villas. The plan is to finish with a stone effect render to try and get it to fit in more

2 The original plan was similar to your suggestion. The problem is that shifting everything left moved the doorway to the bedrooms in front of the sofa which we felt would be irritating. Especially as my wife works on the sofa and so I’d constantly be walking around her. Shifting it right as above keeps a bit more separation.

Fair enough. I imagine you could put some nice corner windows in or something like that, which would be really nice.

 

[Martynt74]

Fair enough. I imagine you could put some nice corner windows in or something like that, which would be really nice.

Yeah, it also creates the space top left for a small terrace and with that being the guest room, it might be nice for them to have their own small private seating area.

 

[dirtychinchilla]

Yeah, it also creates the space top left for a small terrace and with that being the guest room, it might be nice for them to have their own small private seating area.

Though they might be able to see into your en-suite?

 

[jpaul]

.. so there is a full length patio/sliding door on the guest - could have terraces even if the design was rectangular, but, then, could need sheltering.
used to have narrow terrace outside upper storey S facing bedroom patio doors - not that you ever sat out there, just open them in the morning and lay in bed looking out,

Guess you have a plan showing potential window location - rollered/shuttered. ?

 

[Martynt74]

Though they might be able to see into your en-suite?

Haha true, we'd just have to put the window on the other side, although i'm sure any windows would be frosted.

.. so there is a full length patio/sliding door on the guest - could have terraces even if the design was rectangular, but, then, could need sheltering.
used to have narrow terrace outside upper storey S facing bedroom patio doors - not that you ever sat out there, just open them in the morning and lay in bed looking out,

Guess you have a plan showing potential window location - rollered/shuttered. ?

The builder is with the architect today so hopefully we'll have a proper designed plan from them and not just a bodge job that i've thrown together.

Agreed on sheltering. My plan would be to put a pergola like structure in the corner bit for some cover. Mainly to again, break up the boxey flat finish with some wood.