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it was the previous post you didn't need to quote.
Super Straight - a new sexuality???
- Thread starter dowie
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Maybe you need two.
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Saturday night drinks is it?
No madam, woken by the child. If I bury my head in the sand, will he go away?
All the examples you’ve posted are utter freaks and not at all indicative of anything happening. The Fallon Fox fight for instance, happened in unsanctioned MMA events, before she disclosed she was trans... the attack in the toilets, was initiated in the store itself, and the attacker being trans had 0 baring or affect on the crime. In fact, if we go by your logic, we just ban all men from all public spaces with female toilets attached, because if you Google, there’s thousands of roses commuted by men in women’s toilets....
You are posting mentally ill people or fake trolls from Facebook or Reddit, and thinking they are real. Step away from the internet and live a little, it’s sad how consumed you are by an inconsequential fraction of society.
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Or on the other hand, we are getting a broad view across a lot of society through the Internet and your very localised and relatively tiny experience of trans people IRL isn't at all representative? It could be that too.
Should I post more examples about trans people in sport? Isn't it telling that you're so dismissive of something that has become such an issue for some people that they have felt need to create petitions to try protect themselves and receive thousands of supporting signatures in doing so?
https://lifepetitions.com/petition/keep-girls-sports-for-biological-girls-only-iamselina
As I said, my examples above weren't exclusive. I think it's shocking you don't see this as an issue and writing it off as some "fringe freaks".
If these are supposedly tiny issue then why the controversy when people want to do something about it? Why can't apps developers just allow females to use the app? Why are shelters or other facilities having issues if they want to cater to biological women? It's supposedly a tiny issue yet you'll find that women who speak up about this stuff face a ridiculous amount of abuse and physical attacks even.
Just have a look at what JK Rowling has faced on twitter for taking some positions that shouldn't be particularly controversial - she's hardly some Katie Hopkins, Daily Mail columnist type.
Perhaps Lesbians want an app for Lesbians and don't want a bunch of cross-dressing males involved- why is that so hard to understand?
Perhaps female athletes don't want to compete with males who are in their category simply because they have a mental health issue re: gender. It might be mostly lower leagues at the moment but why be dismissive of that - for every one of these males on a team they're depriving female of that place - this can have a knock-on effect re: say state championships in the US (only a small window of opportunity for athletes) or indeed on athletic scholarships for university.
This is a 52-year-old who got onto a college basketball team because she told the coach how tall she was and that she sued to play years ago as a male. She wasn't a student at the college and has had to enrol in some minimal amount of courses/credits in order to be eligible for the team. The notion that someone in their 50s is competitive enough to play in college sport in the US is farcical under normal circumstances - but being male, over 6ft and playing basketball against women gives rather obvious advantages.
You say you object to this stuff but you're also quite dismissive of it being an issue. I'd hope that things like Covid would get people out of the mindset that because something isn't an issue right now doesn't mean it won't be a growing issue in future - the more this is allowed and normalised then... well it's pretty easy to see. If people are quite happy to declare themselves non-binary etc.. in far greater numbers then it becomes more important to not disregard sex - the areas where sex is important then become more of an issue. Historically "trans" people have been a small %, generally people with gender dysphoria, these days the people falling under "trans" is growing and isn't just people with gender dysphoria but plenty of people choosing new labels, ti's semi-political even. If we end up with a double-digit % of people identifying as trans then you end up with a bigger issue in the areas where sex is more important than gender identity.
I find this subject to be the best example of how ridiculous it is that people choose to ignore biological differences between male and female humans.
There's a very real reason why we have mens and women's sporting events and as records going back decades prove, men have physical advantages that make them quicker and stronger. If you back trans rights in sports you are by definition anti-womens rights in sports - there is no position that can support both sides. Before anyone mentions it, trans athletes have already stated they should not be expected to take medication such as testosterone suppressants to compete. To them because they see themselves as female, they should compete as they are in female sports (i.e. they won't even accept competing in a trans category).
There's also plenty of non extreme examples, look at Rachel McKinnon - a trans athlete who competes in women's cycling and calls anyone who disagrees with that fact, transphobic. Which is nothing but an attempt to shut down the conversation that she shouldn't be allowed to compete in women's sport because she has physical advantages.
McKinnon isn't in some low league either, they're competing in world titles in cycling and they're a disgusting human being:
https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/10/rachel-mckinnon-is-a-cheat-and-a-bully/
There's a very real reason why we have mens and women's sporting events and as records going back decades prove, men have physical advantages that make them quicker and stronger. If you back trans rights in sports you are by definition anti-womens rights in sports - there is no position that can support both sides. Before anyone mentions it, trans athletes have already stated they should not be expected to take medication such as testosterone suppressants to compete. To them because they see themselves as female, they should compete as they are in female sports (i.e. they won't even accept competing in a trans category).
There's also plenty of non extreme examples, look at Rachel McKinnon - a trans athlete who competes in women's cycling and calls anyone who disagrees with that fact, transphobic. Which is nothing but an attempt to shut down the conversation that she shouldn't be allowed to compete in women's sport because she has physical advantages.
McKinnon isn't in some low league either, they're competing in world titles in cycling and they're a disgusting human being:
https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/10/rachel-mckinnon-is-a-cheat-and-a-bully/
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That wouldn't solve the problem because the core of it is the demand that everyone act as if (and believe that) a statement overides biology in determing biology. The whole point is the belief that a person's sex (biological/physiological) is determined by what they say. Even when it obviously isn't.
I'm reminded of the famous "There are 4 lights!" psychological torture scene from Star Trek. Getting a target to believe something obviously untrue is a big step in breaking them and thus controlling them.
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Exactly. Have 3 categories: Biological Male Human, Biological Female Human and Everyone/Everything Else.
This for me is why the whole 'Trans' debate is such a big thing.
The likes of Hurf make out its a genital obsession and the other common comment is usually something along the lines of "why cant you just let people say what they are, isnt in nicer that way?"
But for me its no coincidence that there appears to be a considerable Venn style overlap between people who advocate for 'trans rights' and people that employ other arguments that may be called 'intersectional' (which is basically cultural Marxism...a term that's great for getting some people frothing but it is a simple concept that takes 'classical' Marxism and replaces the oppressor class (bourgeoise in 'classical' Marxism) oppressed class (proletariat) and means of systemic oppression (Capitalism) and replaces them with other classes and supposed means of systemic oppression.
For example for 'Trans' we have oppressor class ('Cis' 'Terf's/ people that follow biology) oppressed class ('trans' people) and means of systemic oppression ('Cis' normativity/ laws and customs that differiate the sexes by biology and not subjective feelings of individuals)
It comes down to the old Voltaire saying "Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities"
There is real power in being able to shame or compel someone else into expressing a position that they don't believe and which is riddled with logical contradictions and absurdities.
George Orwell knew this tyrannical impulse all to well which is explored through through the character of Winston Smith in Orwell's book 1984.
I'm not convinced by an awful lot of 'trans' allies. I think a considerable amount of them don't really care at all about whether or not their advocacy helps people or not. Rather much like 'big brother' they see it as one of the ultimate opportunities to fundamentally destroy one of the pillars of society by having people recite nonsensical statements.
Power for powers sake.
Any event open to men and women would just end up being dominated by men, so a bit pointless.
It's the whole reason it was seperated in the first place. Men pretending to be women should not be a loophole.
Totally agree when it comes to sports. That’s an entirely different topic though. It shouldn’t be used as fuel to promote what is essentially a 4chan/alt right troll to get people to promote the SS without realising it by conflating a very minor issue (some very mentally ill trans people insisting you be attracted to them) vs actual serious trans discussion.
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Can there not just be male/female oriented sports then another one for trans only. How can a trans be in a team where they over power their team mates all because they transitioned.
Bonkers
Bonkers
It's not really doing that though - the few times I've seen that on twitter it's trans activists trying to make that claim rather than anyone actually doing that and, tellingly, all the images are posts on 4chan rather than tweets or reddit posts. Those cherry-picked posts might be actual nazis, might be people being edgy or might be woke types creating things to amplify and criticise. Either way if you look at either the Reddit group of the hashtags on twitter this notion that this is some idea to promote the SS is utterly flawed.
Is it though? You just queried who, where and when are people being dragged for not pandering to the agenda that is being driven.
It's a whole aspect issue, not just one about the small percentage that are demanding they are porked, as women. It's about the ability to wield power and apply pressure on society to fit a rather dim viewpoint to appease a tiny minority. Yet you claimed they have little power. It appears that isn't the case.
I have shown all your examples to be little to nothing.
In fact, you then went on to post an example of where a trans person has been asking to be allowed to compete against their gender, but not allowed, so is forced to be fighting women despite them having male levels of testosterone.
Indeed. Sounds like someone is scared to make the correct and logical decisions aren't they? Why might that be?