Supervisor - Formal Greivance

Resident said:
The apology is off the table. Union view is that any apology will be seen as admission of guilt and will be used against me.

Their view is there is zero evidence until I do. Claim is based on hearsay and this is why management want it done informally.
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You're still not being clear here - what is the actual issue? What are they claiming happened?

Resident said:
1. Conversation happened.
2. I expressed an OPINION on a factual happening, nothing I stated was untrue.
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You're not being clear here - stating some facts or airing an opinion isn't necessarily a disciplinary matter - was there something specific about that opinion that might make it one? Or are the making some additional claim re: things you didn't actually say?

If you didn't do anything wrong then you have nothing to apologise for and your union rep is correct.

Mr Badger said:
If you really have company blackmail level knowledge the smart move is to use it to stop the process, not to try to change the outcome.
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No, that would be dumb too. The smart move would be to not get involved in any blackmail in the first place.
 
So I'll update:

1. So far I have had no FORMAL meeting regarding this, however the manager dealing with has tried twice now to get me to apologise so that 'it doesn't need to go any further and be marked on my record'

2. As for specifics, I've not actually been told the exact thing I'm supposed to have said, other than being part of the discussion and giving an opinion that apparently upset the the complainant when they were told what I allegedly said

3. The complainant raised the grievance on 30/01/25, I was not informed of this until just over 2 weeks later. As of now it's been almost a month

4. No other participant of the conversation in question has been complained about.

5. My union rep says to let it run. They believe it the management won't go any further than the informal chats I've already had due to the lack of evidence. The personnel that told the complainant what I allegedly said aren't willing to make formal statements as it would be career suicide because all their colleagues would then know they're rats & they'd end up ostracised.
 
Resident said:
Spoken with Union chair today.

The apology is off the table. Union view is that any apology will be seen as admission of guilt and will be used against me.

Their view is there is zero evidence until I do. Claim is based on hearsay and this is why management want it done informally.

Union position is also that of one of being singled out.



Tbh they try to fire me I know enough about goings on that will secure my job ;)
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Sounds like an escalation.

Why not "I do not know what has been reported to you, but if anything that i have said is hurtful, i apologise."

Be the bigger man. Even if you feel that you are in the right, an apology never hurts, particularly in private, and get on with your life. Unions rarely help resolve these issues.
 
If you cant be kind, sometimes its better to say nothing at all.

Appreciate the special treatment will drive people mad, but bitching to others about it does not get it fixed or resolved. Are you just mad that you dont have a special arrangement?
Resident said:
Tbh they try to fire me I know enough about goings on that will secure my job
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This reads quite childish, who wants to stay in a job that has almost got rid of them?
Or you could look at it and think, I deserve better than this and walk away.
 
Josh said:
You should like a walking red flag tbh

What industry? So I can avoid more than anything.
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Transport industry

Hagar said:
Sounds like an escalation.

Why not "I do not know what has been reported to you, but if anything that i have said is hurtful, i apologise."

Be the bigger man. Even if you feel that you are in the right, an apology never hurts, particularly in private, and get on with your life. Unions rarely help resolve these issues.
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Because ANY apology would be used as an admission of guilt when no guilt has been established. There's precedence that management have done this before, got the person to apologise whilst everything was off record then used it against them.

Union/My position that if an apology is all that is wanted by the complainant then we get that on record, in a formal setting and a formal apology would then be issued. This would then close the matter officially and cannot be used.

sidimmu said:
If you cant be kind, sometimes its better to say nothing at all.

Appreciate the special treatment will drive people mad, but bitching to others about it does not get it fixed or resolved. Are you just mad that you dont have a special arrangement?
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It's more of a case of this individual has been known to abuse said special arrangement, been caught but management swept it under the carpet. My position is that the arrangement should have, at minimum, been nullified due to that abuse. I'd even go as far as it being gross misconduct. There are also other couples within the business that have asked for similar treatment, like being granted holidays together and been refused
 
Resident said:
There are also other couples within the business that have asked for similar treatment, like being granted holidays together and been refused
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So, why are you their voice of reason and why should you put your head above the water to be shot?

Sounds like this is something that's got absolutely sweet FA to do with you, but you stuck your nose in to it.
 
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sidimmu said:
So, why are you their voice of reason and why should you put your head above the water to be shot?

Sounds like this is something that's got absolutely sweet FA to do with you, but you stuck your nose in to it.
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Or I took part in a discussion about it and gave my opinion?
 
Since when do people have to apologise for having an opinion about something someone else doesn't like at work? Wtf? Surely you are allowed to say someone is getting special treatment without getting into a disciplinary.
Unless there's more to it. Which I suspect.
 
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And this is why i don't work in companies that have all this BS going on.

All this nonsense = less productivity. Adults acting like children in a playground.

Also why i left Teaching. The Adults are worse than the children.
 
Resident said:
5. My union rep says to let it run. They believe it the management won't go any further than the informal chats I've already had due to the lack of evidence. The personnel that told the complainant what I allegedly said aren't willing to make formal statements as it would be career suicide because all their colleagues would then know they're rats & they'd end up ostracised.
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I'd listen to them tbh.

How can you possibly apologise for something if you don't know the specifics of what they are alleging you said and/or whether it matches what you actually said?

If what you said was factual and/or just offering an opinion on something factual then I don't see how this is a disciplinary issue at all, apologising for something (i.e. admitting guilt) when you don't even know what you're admitting to seems like an insane thing to do.
 
You're with a Union, stick with their advice and help. If it does come to any kind of formal meeting, insist on bringing Union representation with you. Good luck.
 
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Resident said:
I'd even go as far as it being gross misconduct. There are also other couples within the business that have asked for similar treatment, like being granted holidays together and been refused
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It's hard to say for sure without knowing the the details but special treatment around rotas and holidays etc doesn't sound like gross misconduct to me. IANAL so I don't know what a proper definition of that is but it sounds more like misconduct without the gross. Abuse of privilege or something but the way it reads to me is that some are getting preferential treatment but others are not being specifically mistreated. i.e. rules are followed for the majority and then bent for her husband or whatever, rather than her husband gets paid properly and everyone else is getting their pay docked inappropriately or something.
 
Most grievance procedures require them to be dealt with informally first, where the complainant, the defender and the line manager get together to try and work things out.
Usually the complainant knows what they want to get out of raising the grievance in the first place.
Here it sounds like they would like an apology, which could be done with no admission of being guilty. Could just say that it was a group discussion and if anything was said that caused offence, then that wasn't meant to be the case.
If it can't be resolved informally, then it usually goes formal and that is when statements, etc are taken and the fallout can go pearshaped if not careful, usually resulting in disciplinary action. Sometimes though it can backfire on the complainant if evidence contradicts what they allege.
I am a LM in as large company and have dealt with many grievances in my career, also been on the receiving end and what I would say is that, I would expect to be notified with 48hrs that one had been raised against me. The longer they are left, the less chance of the true facts being given as people forget.
 
Uther said:
I learnt very early on at work not to gossip about anyone else, with anyone else. They're work colleagues, not friends.
Just not worth the hassle. Go in, do the job, go home. Talk about the weather or football at work if you must.
Doesn't help you now, but maybe something to consider in future.
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exactly this. The only conversation you need is as follows:

You:
Did you see that ludicrous display last night?

Colleague:
What was Arteta thinking sending Stirling on that early?

You:
The thing about Arsenal is, they always try to walk it in!

Colleague:
Yeah it is true. See you later

You:
Mind 'ow you go.
 
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