Teaching Hours and new Teaching Strike?

[Dinomania]

Sara, do you mind me asking what sort of qualifications or experience you've got that's got you a place at Bristol?

I'm hoping 11 GCSE's 1 A, 7 B's and 3 C's - (B in Maths, B B C in Chem, Bio, Physics, C in Eng), AS Levels in Chem + Bio & a BTEC in Forensic Science (Merit Merit), and a 2.2 BSc (Hons) Forensic Science with focus on Chemistry, Forensic Biochemistry, Forensic Biomolecules etc... and a bit of work experience in a specialist science school will clinch it.

With that, I'd be surprised if you don't get a place. The only reason I could see for your being turned down would be them running out of places (it isn't a case of them getting everyone's application and picking the best - instead the course just fills up as they take people in - although I presume they skip the degenerates...).

I was interviewed on 9th of Dec and accepted by the 11th

If you want to know -
12 GCSEs (3 of which short-course so only 10.5 really), 4xA*, 1*B, rest As
4.5 A2s (A B B B C: Physics, Design-Tech, Economics, Maths, AS Further Maths)
BEng Engineering Design w/ Study in Industry (specialising electronics/comms) - 2:2
...and coming up to 4 years working in the electronics industry.

I started off so well and lost the energy as I specialised more and more narrowly - I'm itching to get back into delving into the whole spectrum of science and physics again

For the interview at Bristol they asked us for a 3-min presentation about introducing a new topic to a class of mixed-ability year 8s, I'd assume that's standard - just be interesting, prove you've thought about it, be aware that kids vary, etc...

 

[Pottsey]

All this talk about teachers but what about the rest of the school staff? If anything it’s the support staff that are underpaid, not the teachers.

Teachers pay is fine. The problem is not pay, the problem is they are given to much pointless paper work. Take away the pointless paperwork and keep the current pay and I bet most Teachers would be happy.

Often its the support staff who do not get enough pay.

 

[Kristoph]

Fingers crossed! When I checked on the GTTR again earlier Bristol and Bath both have vacancies on the course. Congrats on being accepted Sounds like you've definitely got the knowledge for it. I'm feeling more keen about this than I have for any of my past courses etc.

Thanks for the heads up on the interview, good to know what to expect. I'm currently living at home and it's handy to have a mum who's a decent teacher available to ask questions to!

 

[D D Danneh]

It is completely inefficent Dolph. Her time is spent ticking boxes and completing lesson plans (which are never looked at) so government targets are met rather than doing anything constructive for the pupils benefit.

I've experienced this first hand with my engineering GCSE. After getting 95% in the test (which is supposedly unheard of), I could have quite easily obtained a double A* grade. However, due to the whole "ticking boxes" thing, it is very hard to get a high mark in the coursework. The instructions are very vague, and the answers have to be very specific (some answers aren't even asked for, how the hell do you answer a question you aren't being asked?), so without the teacher's help, correcting my work and telling me what to improve, I cannot do any better. Due to the fact that he simply hasn't had time to mark it all (or he's lazy - I'm leaning towards this, every other teacher has managed to mark all of our work on time, and engineering is only one small class), I can now only obtain an a/b or a/a, which I'm pretty ****ed about, as I was expecting A*'s across the board (besides french, bleurgh), especially when it isn't my fault.

 

[platypus]

It is completely inefficent Dolph. Her time is spent ticking boxes and completing lesson plans (which are never looked at) so government targets are met rather than doing anything constructive for the pupils benefit.

And yet I know several teachers who don't bother doing this, just to make a few things up when an Ofsted inspection is incoming.

The main problem I have with teachers striking is that they should be complaining about red tape, not working hours and pay. Well that and I don't agree with striking.

And if the strike does go ahead, what kind of minefield does that open? Loads of people work unpaid overtime.

 

[a1ex2001]

I like the way the OP completely forgot the massive holiday allowance that teachers get, along with the cast iron pay rises, and guarenteed payscale progression regardless of performance.

Not saying a teachers life is easy but it's not as hard as some make out and it does have some perks that you won't get in other lines of work.

 

[Deleted member 66701]

along with the cast iron pay rises

Don't make me laugh.

Whoever is in government in a little over a month will implement a pay freeze.

massive holiday allowance that teachers get

10 weeks, which is only three more than I get.

guarenteed payscale progression regardless of performance.

Progression is withheld for anyone placed on active performance management.

 

[monkeysmith]

Don't make me laugh.

Whoever is in government in a little over a month will implement a pay freeze.

Not for all teachers, some will still progress up the pay scale.... won't they!?

10 weeks, which is only three more than I get.

10?

I get 13. Of those 13 weeks, I can honestly say I will do about 1 to 2 weeks work.

 

[bhindi]

Sorry if this is a repost.

Apoligies as I cannot find a linkie but I heard on the news that teachers will be considering strike action based on their working hours. Essentially saying that they should only be contracted to a 35 hour contract per week.

What are peoples opinions on this?

Personally I agree/disagree with the situation.

My lass is a teacher so I see first hand how many hours she has to work and quite frankly its ridiculous.

I work a 50 hour a week contract but she works a lot more than. She is in the school 8-4 Monday to Friday, every evening she does a minimum of 2 hours work be it marking/planning and then on a Sunday she generally does between 4-6 hours work again on marking or planning. This equates to a working week 54-56 hours.

Now consider the payment for this, she has only been full time just over 2 years (this is her third full year) and earns 22.5k. This is for a 50+ hour week, currently im earning more than double this amount for 50 hours.

In a few years she will be on mid twenties, a bit more than that but if someon asked me to work the hours she works for less than 30k they would be getting short shrift.

Lets be honest here as well its not as if its some mickey mouse public sector job like the a hell of a lot of them are these days. If she is crap at her job (which she isnt) kids futures can be effected. She has to perform and do well at her job or it does have a consequence.

Its no wonder people who are well qualified tend to opt away from the teaching profession. Long hours and poor pay? No thanks. The only thing the job has going for it is the pension.

Now me and the lass have discussed this and whilst the hours annoy her (she has considered quitting as she is constantly working to (at times) the detriment of our social life together) but she likes the job and she likes teaching.

She is in favour of the 35 hour week, which I would be but to her it would be 35 a week teaching time with 5-10 hours per week PPA (forgot what it stands for, its what teachers call planning and marking time) to be completed in the school. So essentially a 35-45 hour a week contract which would then let her complete her work in work with little carry over to effect her own time. This is what I think would be a good solution, not reducing classtime (which a blanket 35 hour contract would do) but reducing overall working time and building the extra work which is always done at home just to keep up into a normal working day.

The drawbacks to this (and probably why it would never happen) is that it would require further investment from the government either so that there is more teachers or teaching assistants in the school who could cover the lessons whilst teachers have their PPA time.

So what does everyone think? Are teachers underpaid and overworked or do you personally think the oppisiate?

Having seen it firsthand teachers are overworked and horribly underpaid considering the importance of the profession. Though I am sure some will disagree with me

Just to have my 2 pence worth . May be im wrong in what im about to say , but profession such as teaching or being nurse or doctor . You do these kinds of jobs for the love of doing them , and hope of changing or improving some body life . Yes the hours are long and the pay is crap , but dont tell me before most teachers started there training they didnt know this

 

[Pottsey]

bhindi said “Yes the hours are long and the pay is crap , but dont tell me before most teachers started there training they didnt know this“
They did not know this during training. The hours have steadily been getting worse over the years due to more and more pointless paperwork. Teachers now spend less time teaching then they did 5 or 10 years ago.

The hours where not as bad 5 or 10 years ago when Teachers started training. So how could they have known how bad it would be today?

 

[rojones]

All i can say is around here it appears that trying to get a teaching job is like trying to win the lottery. Now if that many people are wanting to become teachers it cant all be that bad. If you don't like your job go do something else.

I know someone who has been a teacher for a long period of time and he is close to retirement, he cant wait to finish and says the amount of useless paper work that has to be done nowa days it beyond, so i guess things do need to change in teaching but i don't think its the pay, as others have mentioned you get a steady job with pretty much no worries of loosing your job and great holidays and fantastic pensions.

Swings and roundabouts as they say.

 

[Stretch]

The thing with teaching is, you KNOW what your letting yourself in for unless you have walked into it blindly (which is amazingly retarded) so the hours and pay shouldn't be too much of a shock to the system.

This.

They did not know this during training. The hours have steadily been getting worse over the years due to more and more pointless paperwork. Teachers now spend less time teaching then they did 5 or 10 years ago.

Teachers still used to moan (endlessly) 10-15 years ago. My mum is a teacher, it's been going on all my life, nothing is ever good enough.

 

[LordSplodge]

All this talk about teachers but what about the rest of the school staff? If anything it’s the support staff that are underpaid, not the teachers.

Teachers pay is fine. The problem is not pay, the problem is they are given to much pointless paper work. Take away the pointless paperwork and keep the current pay and I bet most Teachers would be happy.

Often its the support staff who do not get enough pay.

That's true. Some of my ICT Techs were paid a miserable 10k a year. Even my post (middle management) was 8-10K behind an equivalent teacher grading.

That's one of the reasons I got out!

 

[BullBoyShoes]

teachers are just bums:

- 3 months of the year holidays
- finish at 3:30
- guaranteed salary increments no matter on performance
- after your 1st year teaching everything just repeats again

Stop moaning and get on with it

 

[Pneumonic]

even if a teacher is doing a 50 week when they are in school this only equates to 37.5 hours / week if you include the 13 weeks holiday they get.. what are they moaning about?

Frankly they should be paid on performance.. might get ride of the large number of useless teachers out there that do f-ek all and reward those that actually work harder

 

[Pneumonic]

Don't make me laugh.

Whoever is in government in a little over a month will implement a pay freeze.

OMG pay freeze.. like the real world! welcome to it

 

[a1ex2001]

Don't make me laugh.

Whoever is in government in a little over a month will implement a pay freeze.

Which is what most of the private sector has had for the last couple of years. It won't last as the eachers will strike.

10 weeks, which is only three more than I get.

Did you forget to count half terms or do you work outside of the state education sysyem? and three more weeks is over a 50% increase for a lot of people I know!

Progression is withheld for anyone placed on active performance management.

Exactly so if you do an average job you get yearly payscale progression which isn't the case for most people in the private sector, where an average performance means you stay where you are!

 

[RDM]

Speaking as somone who has just started on the path to become a teacher (start uni in Sept for 3 years, then a PGCE) it is no suprise at all to me the workload, the hours and the other problems with teaching. You would have to be pretty daft to think about going in to teaching without first talking to teachers and other people involved in the profession prior to starting.

 

[sparklebox]

I'm a trainee teacher of primary education with a specialism in History. Most of the points raised in this thread are fair, I will get longer holidays than others in different sectors, however I will indeed spend a lot of time marking, lesson planning, filling out masses of paperwork, and undertaking record keeping and providing evidence for this. Not including all the training days that have to be done through the holidays, and display boards etc. that have to be updated in our own time i.e. holidays.

Though I haven't qualified the days I do are the same as a -committed- teacher, I have to be at the placement school by 8.00am, and I don't leave until half past 5 in the evening. Which I then have to go home, do all the regular things, and sit down and begin marking, adjusting lesson plans, ensuring resources are completed and continuously updating records. Which some nights takes me up to 11pm. That's just the teacher side of my course. (Not including all of the uni work I have to do)

I knew there would be a hefty workload involved when I signed onto the course, however I will admit to not knowing how hefty it will be. I think the pay for teachers is fair and if some unions are pushing for a strike then so be it.

Also to those who are complaining about hours and pay, well you chose not to go into a teaching career, so why moan about it? I chose to teach, not to become a stockbroker earning upto £100,000 a year, but that was my decision therefore I won't moan about that.

 

[eatcustard]

OP

Your wife chose Teaching, knowing it would be long hours etc.
Stop moaning and get on with it, before we are full of polish teachers