The all encompassing BNP thread - keep all crap in here.

You do know that percentages are meaningless for working out benefit costs right? Which is bigger, the 5% of unemployed christians or 12-17% of unemployed muslims? Who will cost the country more?

That is like saying "Which is bigger, the 95% of employed christians paying into the system or the 83% of muslims?"

Why should the working native import large proportions of non working immigrant and then pay for them?

If you also factor in the much higher birth rate then what does it hold for the future? Unemployed christian with 2 kids will cost society X amount. Unemployed non native muslim with 4 or 5 kids will cost more without even considering any additional costs such as translation services.
 
Let's make it even simpler... Muslims only make up circa 3% of the population (2.7% from the last census, so I'm being generous and rounding it up).

Christians, by contrast, make up around 71% of the population.

And they pay far more in to the system..... what is your point?
 
I'm sorry Dirtydog - I shan't use 'Dude' again - clearly an insulting term.

I'm not a statistician so I couldn't tell you what things have changed or why but quoting 2004 stats when there has been a major social and economic upheaval in the past 18 months is ridiculous and an ill founded point.

To deny the truth of what I and the BNP are saying is ridiculous. Utterly ridiculous.
 
Promoting the Traditional Family Unit :
http://www.scribd.com/doc/15109757/BNP-White-Paper-on-Family-Law

Contains some great chestnut like this:

The BNP will discourage the formation of single-parent families as a career option for young women through the benefits system with the removal of Single Parent Allowance, Housing and Council Tax Benefit and no automatic right to be housed (except in circumstances were there has been a divorce or death whilst married and will not affect current claimants). Our school children will also be taught through the national curriculum the moral benefits of the traditional family unit over being a single parent family.

Chuck single mothers out on the streets, nice one.

You can not legislate for the heart nor would the BNP want to. However, with the business of sham marriages of British citizens to foreign nationals for money and to get a foreign national into the country, the BNP will introduce into law that any British citizen that marries a foreign national must have lived together in their spouse’s country for a minimum of 2 years before applying at the local British Embassy for their spouse to accompany them back to the UK. The British national will also have to report to the British Embassy every month with proof that they are residing in that country. If no proof is provided then the application will be rejected.

So making it extremely difficult to marry a foreigner in other words, surprise surprise.

The Civil Partnership Act 2004 that came into force on 5 December 2005 and enables same sex couples to obtain legal recognition of their relationship as equivilent to that of married couples will be repealed by the BNP.

So as well as racists, they're homophobes as well.

How anyone sees them as a serious political party I really cannot fathom.
 
That is like saying "Which is bigger, the 95% of employed christians paying into the system or the 83% of muslims?"

Why should the working native import large proportions of non working immigrant and then pay for them?

If you also factor in the much higher birth rate then what does it hold for the future? Unemployed christian with 2 kids will cost society X amount. Unemployed non native muslim with 4 or 5 kids will cost more without even considering any additional costs such as translation services.

And they pay far more in to the system..... what is your point?

That those stats aren't useful as they aren't benefit claims so don't demonstrate what you show.

See the link and breakdown I've posted above. you can't determine benefit claims by religion very well among immigrants...
 
Which is what, "darkies out?"?

Not at all, but I'm sure you hope there is mileage in continuing to misrepresent the BNP's policies. That's what the fascist UAF wants too, which is why it keeps disrupting BNP press conferences. Mustn't let the people hear the BNP speak because they might actually like what they hear eh? And vote for them, like a million did last week :)
 
Not at all, but I'm sure you hope there is mileage in continuing to misrepresent the BNP's policies. That's what the fascist UAF wants too, which is why it keeps disrupting BNP press conferences. Mustn't let the people hear the BNP speak because they might actually like what they hear eh? And vote for them, like a million did last week :)

That is what the BNP want, it is in their party constitution. Why should the media and others only promote the BNP filtered version of their views when the alternative is publically available direct from the original source?
 
That is what the BNP want, it is in their party constitution. Why should the media and others only promote the BNP filtered version of their views when the alternative is publically available direct from the original source?

They are welcome to, so long as they don't misrepresent BNP policy by quoting it selectively or taking it out of context, or putting their own spin on it which distorts the true picture.
 
I guess it depends on which countries and which cultural norms. Lets take Turkey for an example. Turkey is 99% Sunni Muslum and yet it is a well thought of a much visited tourist destination where we can go to beaches and wander around the cities without much fear of recrimination for what we are wearing or a requirement to head to the nearest Mosque 5 times a day. However we are asked to respect their cultural norms when we actually visit areas like Mosques and or peoples homes. The same goes for Italy when you visit Rome and the Vatican City - we wear long shorts and cover our shoulders.
Those countries would beg non religious people to go and visit if he tourist trade dried up. They get a clear financial return for alowing johnny foreigner into their country. Plus the tourists go home again 14 days later, have no right to stay, don't use the local education system, pay for the health system if they need it etc, etc, etc.
If you take the deepest Middle East countries as an example then you're always going to run into some serious cultural conflicts because they haven't massively moved on in thousands of years. But you will also find that they have no tolerance of other cultures and/or belief structures and it's this that I think causes a great deal of the difficulty when shifting to the UK because it's a radically different environment. We end up with something of a culture clash however I don't believe we should be taking the stance that if they can't change then why should we?
I don't beleive we should ask more of the natives than of the immigrants.....
I don't think that allowing immigrants to exercise their religious beliefs nor hold on to their cultural identity is costing me anything at all.
That all depends upon where things stop. When demands are made to allow practices that are illegal in our country, to change laws etc to suit their culture then things have gone too far. Two small but recent requests are open air cremations and animal slaughter without stunning the animal. Tip of the iceberg in all probability.
As far as food goes I've typically found that getting Chinese cuisine from proper Chinese chefs tends to taste better than getting it from M&S or Sainsburies but then that could just be me ;)
It probably is not just you, then again I could sacrifice the odd Lamb Jalfrezi for lower levels of unemployed people, cheaper housing, schools that had low levels of non english speakers etc, etc, etc.
Art is an easy one - pay a visit to the Tate Modern, or the old Tate or perhaps the Portrait galleries. Artists like Van Gogh, Monet, Rembrandt, Picasso, Leonardo da Vinci, Caravaggio, Johannes Vermeer are all foreign and are reconised for enriching the art world no end. Now I admit that art is very much subjective and that you'd have to be interested in it to get the full advantages from it.
Lots of good european artists there. Artists who did not even need to step foot in the UK for me to see their work too :) Where are the great African or Indian artists that have enriched you?
Because the news is always 100% factual and never has any spin on it? The news doesn't supply cultural awareness at all, it supplies news that is almost exclusively relevant to you and no-one else. Where are you getting cultural awareness from the news?
It is simply an example. There are plenty of TV programs, websites, books, magazine articles etc that focus on other cultures. If I ever find one of them interesting enough I'll go there to se the culture for myself rather than seek out the Egyptian quarter of Soho to see if they've erected any Pyramids recently or built a shrine to Anubis.
Don't you think that it's a little sad to get all your cultural awareness from the TV? Home and Away is hardly representitive of the average Australian culture and Flight of the Concords is definately not how the rest of New Zealand is (Nor for that matter is Lord of the Rings ;))
The antipodeans have culture? Out of interest, what is New Zealand culture?
The downsides to immigration in the present system is that anyone in the EU can turn up here and jump on the Benefit system.
Yet the majority of immigrants on the dole appear to be non EU.
They don't have the same controls that we Antipodeans have, we can't turn up in this country and bludge like many from the EU do.
Are there statistics for EU scroungers available?
This is the downside of the present system and I think there needs to be some sort of accountability for those that are choosing to settle here. If I have no job and no money then because I can't get the benefit then I can't stay here, simple as - I think the same should apply to other immigrants.
I'd agree.

But surely by voting the BNP in you are directly advocating that policy?
I have never voted for the BNP in any election, poll or anything else. I actually voted Tory locally and UKIP in the European elections. However the garbage that is spewed out about the BNP in this thread and across the news/media coupled with the off the cuff "immigration is good" posts that completely fail to explain why they have that viewpoint prompted me to post and questions some of the rather baseless assumptions being posted.
 
Not at all, but I'm sure you hope there is mileage in continuing to misrepresent the BNP's policies. That's what the fascist UAF wants too, which is why it keeps disrupting BNP press conferences. Mustn't let the people hear the BNP speak because they might actually like what they hear eh? And vote for them, like a million did last week :)

LOL in protest votes because the other parties aren't delivering - I'd like to see that number sustained in future elections. It's a real shame that these people didn't think it through enough - a vote is a vote regardless of their reasoning for giving it.
 
LOL in protest votes because the other parties aren't delivering - I'd like to see that number sustained in future elections. It's a real shame that these people didn't think it through enough - a vote is a vote regardless of their reasoning for giving it.

Did I hear right you are an immigrant yourself, from Down Under? With all due respect, what makes you think you are more qualified to comment on British politics and social matters than people like myself who were born here and have lived here all my life?
 
Some points about those Stats:
  • In them selves, they are meaningless as they do not indicate why there were unemployment differences.
  • Those unemployed were not necessarily on benefits
  • Those were not statistics on unemployment but of employment inactivity. There is a difference
  • Since this is employment inactivity, it includes those people who were studying.
  • High Unemployment rates in non-white Britons may merely be an indicator or racial prejudice in the work place preventing non-whites obtaining work
  • This does not differentiate those that do not need to work. What if a large number of millionaire foreigners come to the UK not to work. Maybe this is bull ****, but it is just an example how those stats are useless.
  • Those stats are very old
  • Some people choose not to work. Many of the females may be looking after the household and children as is the norm in most foreign countries
  • These employment inactivity stats show nothing of the overall economic impact of immigrants.
  • Look at the employment inactivity rate for some areas of Glasgow.
 
So you can deduce from that on average an immigrant is more likely to be on benefits, but it certainly doesn't show a high correlation. Then there is the causation to take in to account that a lot of the immigrants will find it hard to get jobs to begin with and have to counter prejudice and lack of education.
High correlation? LOL :D Only a few posts ago the difference between 6.3% and 10% was HUGE to you......... but the difference between 4.5% and 15% isn't anything interesting now.......
Stag said:
The Pakistani women's statistic doesn't surprise me in the least due to the patriarchal model of their culture, would be interesting to see the break down of 1st generation immigrants and 2nd though to see if young Pakistani girls escape that culture.
Wait! Aren't we supposed to be embracing that culture and encouraging it to establish itself. Isn't that culture enriching the lives of the average native?
I'd wager the 2nd generation immigrants statistics would be more in line with the mean. Though is it really that surprising that White people are more likely to be employed? We can look at it from another point of view if you break down the statistics further.
Perhaps you can find them..... although if it isn't 2nd gen women staying at home looking after the kids then just how many first gen have recently arrived?
According to the 2001 census we had 50,366,497 white Britons of which 4.5% were unemployed so that makes roughly 2.3 million unemployed.
747,285 Pakistanis with about 15% unemployed making 112 thousand which means there there were over 20 times more unemployed white people than Pakistanis. So white Britons were more than 20 times draining of our social security "blanket" than Pakistanis.
Who was creating that security blanket? Oh yes it was white britons......... So if we look at who is contributing then it is vastly more likely to be a white briton than a pakistani......To determine if white britons were draining the system more you'd also have to factor in how much cash each family is receiving, larger familes will take more...... isn't the birth rate of pakistani women more than double that of white women......
You also failed to quote the entirety of the page from the nation statistics site, which go on to show a different graph with an explanation:



Funny that the BNP always bang on about how mothers should stay at home yet you attack the Pakistanis for doing exactly that, you hypocrite.

;)

A shame that so many white women HAVE to go to work instead of looking after the families. Perhaps they should stay home and have 4 kids each then? Or perhaps they feel duty bound not to scrounge off the system that they statistically don't pay into? Maybe immigrants don't have the same set of morals and are happy to take our money for no return.
 
Plus I thought all these dirty foreigners were stealing jobs from good honest native white folk. Those stats show the completely opoiste, they can't get as many jobs as the average white person!

HYPOCRITE
 
Did I hear right you are an immigrant yourself, from Down Under? With all due respect, what makes you think you are more qualified to comment on British politics and social matters than people like myself who were born here and have lived here all my life?

Yes you did. You also would've heard that I live here, work here and pay taxes like any other gainfully employed person. I do not claim benefits and I contribute to the local economy through my spending. I don't send money home so I'm not draining the economy other than through my holiday spending which admittedly is probably more than the average Brit because I don't go to Blackpool every year.

My living is as much effected by the decisions of voters here as anyone else so I believe that I am entitled to an opinion.
 
Promoting the Traditional Family Unit :
http://www.scribd.com/doc/15109757/BNP-White-Paper-on-Family-Law

Contains some great chestnut like this:



Chuck single mothers out on the streets, nice one.
There is an argument that some kids are getting pregnant as a way of getting a council house. That is not good for the child being born nor for the country. How would you tackle that? It is worthy of its own thread. I'm not suggesting that the BNP have the answer but there is an issue and it is not being resolved. IIRC the UK has the highest teen pregnancy rate in Europe.

So making it extremely difficult to marry a foreigner in other words, surprise surprise.
Again they have identified a genuine issue, how would you deal with it?
So as well as racists, they're homophobes as well.
Is their view on homosexuality different to islamic opinion, catholic opinion or "black cultural" opinion? Odd that you deride them for being homophobes but claim to be enriched by cultures that actually stone gays to death.
How anyone sees them as a serious political party I really cannot fathom.
How anyone can claim immigration is beneficial because "we getz curryz" I really cannot fathom.
 
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I'm sorry Dirtydog - I shan't use 'Dude' again - clearly an insulting term.

I'm not a statistician so I couldn't tell you what things have changed or why but quoting 2004 stats when there has been a major social and economic upheaval in the past 18 months is ridiculous and an ill founded point.

Immigration has increased and the immigrant birth rate is up. So it's all good news then?
 
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